You've hit the nail on the head; the Twoof Movement relies on dishonesty. If somebody could place a curse sort of like in the movie "Liar Liar" that forced them all to be intellectually honest, the Twoof Movement would be dead in a week.
Tweeter do you retract your intellectual dishonesty?
There is a link in this forum to an episode of "Hardfire" featuring your beloved Mark Roberts, and a New York city fireman, where there was a consensus that fire caused building 7 to collapse, not the damage to the facade. I know the WTC 7 building was on fire, I know that the facade was damaged. I don't believe, nor do I understand how any rational, skeptical person would believe that that is what caused the building to collapse in the manner it did in several hours.
Your inability to believe or accept that is irrelevant to whether that is exactly what happened or not. That's simply argument from incredulity, and it's unlikely you even have the experience or eductation to even make such a conclusion. If you did, you'd realize you were wrong, and not be arguing it.
There is a link in this forum to an episode of "Hardfire" featuring your beloved Mark Roberts, and a New York city fireman, where there was a consensus that fire caused building 7 to collapse, not the damage to the facade. I know the WTC 7 building was on fire, I know that the facade was damaged. I don't believe, nor do I understand how any rational, skeptical person would believe that that is what caused the building to collapse in the manner it did in several hours.
Changing the subject cause you know you've lost, eh? Let's recap:
You
I'm sure those in the controlled demolition industry are overjoyed to know that a few carefully set fires will replace their previous methods of demolition, as it will undoubtedly mean more for their bottom line going forward.
Here you are making the ludicrous claim that if fire could damage steel, that's how demolition companies would destroy buildings. Note that you ignore structural damage.
Corsair
That should be a few carefully set HUGE fires along with SIGNIFICANT STRUCTURAL DAMAGE CAUSED BY THE IMPACT OF LARGE AIRLINERS MOVING AT HIGH RATES OF SPEED.
ElMondo correctly pointing out your intellectual dishonesty.
You
There is a link in this forum to an episode of "Hardfire" featuring your beloved Mark Roberts, and a New York city fireman, where there was a consensus that fire caused building 7 to collapse, not the damage to the facade. I know the WTC 7 building was on fire, I know that the facade was damaged. I don't believe, nor do I understand how any rational, skeptical person would believe that that is what caused the building to collapse in the manner it did in several hours.
And that brings us back to you. Please compare this quote to the first two quotes in this chain and note how unrelated they are. You were exposed as a charlatan so now you are attempting to change the subject. Nice try.
Actually I should say change the subject AGAIN, because this thread was already was off topic to begin with. The point of the OP was: To say that the WTC collapses didn't happen because nothing like them has ever happened before is a fallacy of circular logic.
There is a link in this forum to an episode of "Hardfire" featuring your beloved Mark Roberts, and a New York city fireman, where there was a consensus that fire caused building 7 to collapse, not the damage to the facade. I know the WTC 7 building was on fire, I know that the facade was damaged. I don't believe, nor do I understand how any rational, skeptical person would believe that that is what caused the building to collapse in the manner it did in several hours.
Changing the topic as has been pointed out. Nevertheless this is again an example of minimizing of things that are inconvenient to the TM.
WTC 7 was unstable from the moments after WTC 1 collapsed as evidenced by the fact that many firemen stated that it was creaking and groaning and was unstable, and that a transit was used to determine just how far the building was moving/bulging/leaning.
The SW corner of the structure was ripped away for over a dozen storeys.
Evidence of damage to the core of the building exists in that elevator cars were ejected from their shafts.
nor do I understand how any rational, skeptical person would believe that that is what caused the building to collapse in the manner it did in several hours.
Um.... not since one of the first ones collapsed from fire - the Equitable Insurance Building in 1912. After that, it became common to fireproof the steel members of steel buildings. Why do you suppose they do that?
And, can someone give me the total count of steel-hulled passenger steamships which have been sunk by icebergs?
You think ice cuts steel?
This notion that anyone thought that icebergs were a hazard to steel-hulled passenger steamships prior to the Titanic is nonsense, since no such thing had ever happened before.
There is a link in this forum to an episode of "Hardfire" featuring your beloved Mark Roberts, and a New York city fireman, where there was a consensus that fire caused building 7 to collapse, not the damage to the facade. I know the WTC 7 building was on fire, I know that the facade was damaged. I don't believe, nor do I understand how any rational, skeptical person would believe that that is what caused the building to collapse in the manner it did in several hours.
Tippit, in six years not a single firefighter who was on the scene that day has come forward to express the slightest bit of doubt or suspicion regarding the official story. Not a single one.
Tippit, in six years not a single firefighter who was on the scene that day has come forward to express the slightest bit of doubt or suspicion regarding the official story. Not a single one.
Fire Fighters excluded from 9/11 testimony
NEW YORK — The independent commission probing the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks on New York and Washington decided not to hear from the worker group that lost more lives than anyone else to the terrorists: The Fire Fighters. http://911research.com/cache/post911/commission/workdayminnesota_fdny.html
9/11 Truth: Firemen Describe Pre-Collapse WTC Explosions
Firefighters and other emergency workers describe the events immediately preceding the collapse of the World Trade Center towers on September 11, 2001.
Interview with John Schroeder 911 FIREMAN
BROOKLYN, N.Y. - Firefighter John Schroeder, assigned to Engine Company 10 directly across the street from the World Trade Center complex, ... all » holds back tears and describes his first-hand experience on Sept. 11th. His story directly contradicts many aspects of the National Commission on Terrorist attacks and corroborates many other eyewitnesses testimony.
whats more dishonest is that to most of them the planes are inconsequential anyway, the twin towers WERE hit by planes, and collapsed, and CTers still cry foul
That's the guy who admits that his memory is shot - apparently to the point of not knowing which tower collapsed first!!! Oh and his testimony isn't backed up other FDNY.
Imagine what you'd say if the "official story" relied on people like that.
That's the guy who admits that his memory is shot - apparently to the point of not knowing which tower collapsed first!!! Oh and his testimony isn't backed up other FDNY.
Imagine what you'd say if the "official story" relied on people like that.
Fire Fighters excluded from 9/11 testimony
NEW YORK — The independent commission probing the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks on New York and Washington decided not to hear from the worker group that lost more lives than anyone else to the terrorists: The Fire Fighters. http://911research.com/cache/post911/commission/workdayminnesota_fdny.html
9/11 Truth: Firemen Describe Pre-Collapse WTC Explosions
Firefighters and other emergency workers describe the events immediately preceding the collapse of the World Trade Center towers on September 11, 2001.
Interview with John Schroeder 911 FIREMAN
BROOKLYN, N.Y. - Firefighter John Schroeder, assigned to Engine Company 10 directly across the street from the World Trade Center complex, ... all » holds back tears and describes his first-hand experience on Sept. 11th. His story directly contradicts many aspects of the National Commission on Terrorist attacks and corroborates many other eyewitnesses testimony.
I hate to break it to you, sport, but we were talking about WTC7 specifically. Next time you butt into a discussion, you might want to pay a little closer attention to what is actually being discussed.
But hey, let's look at the information you linked anyway.
First link: An article about firefighter's very legitimate complaints about equipment failures, etc. However, it has absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand.
Second link: Firefighter's oral history, which DRG then interprets for us. Which is of course exactly what I was looking for: another CTer telling me what firefighter's think. Nice try, but no.
Third link: John Schroeder's interview in which he relates his experiences on 9/11. None of which contradict any part of the official version. I have no opinion on the state of his mental health, but I'd be curious as to how confused and bewildered he would be if were interviewed by honest people without an agenda that could have informed him of the phenomena behind the experiences that confused and bewildered him.
Why don't I see John Schroeder's name on the front page of the New York times for spearheading a movement to reveal the "truth" behind 9/11?
Why isn't he being featured on every major media outlet in the world as the hero that came forward and pulled back the curtain on a heinous conspiracy to murder thousands?
Why is the only place I see this man's so-called doubts expressed in an edited interview with leading questions conducted by people trying to sell conspiracy DVDs?
I'll give you a little credit, though. This one is closer to the mark. But you still fail.
My claim is no steel constructed high-rise building has ever suffered global collapse from fire. It has never happened. Now correct me if I’m wrong but even according to the official 9/11 theory I don’t believe the towers are said to have collapsed from fire alone either. So talk about your “ circular reasoning”.
Yet the first claim was that no steel building has ever suffered global collapse from fire. The Kader Toy Factory fire is shown, you then move the goal posts and say high-rise building. Yet no high-rise building has ever had a top-down controlled demolition performed on it, yet that's ok because a 4 story, completely stripped building did. It has been shown that steel structures do not hold up well to fires. You just won't accept that.
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