Christopher 7 --- C7 & C4

If you say WTC 7 doesn't look like a building implosion then you are in denial IMO.

Well I don't know about you, but every building implosion I have seen there are huge flashes, loud explosion noises in quick succession and visible explosions.

None of which were observed at WTC7.
 
I worked for 2 1/2 years with a professional armourer, so I'm pretty familiar with steel and how it changes colour when heated.

That is not heat-discoloured.

-Gumboot
 
Chris, I don't think you want to play the photo game with me. You cannot defend your claims because they are nonsensical. Rational people reject such nonsense. This has been pointed out to you dozens of times.
Actually, most of the people that i have shown those photos think the steel was cut.

Some are not sure but none say that those beams broke off.

Apparently you think that there is no chance that they cut.

Your 'Verizon Bldg - Sheared Splice Plate' photo shows a bent beam with an irregular tear as would be expected of steel.
Steel is malleable. It does not break*. It bends, rips and tears.

*Stress fractures are not a factor here.
 
The breaks are mostly straight and there is blue discoloration. This is clear evidence that they were cut IMO.
It would take an group of experts to say definitively but anyone not in denial would say "It does not look like the steel broke off".

Then what does steel look like when it "breaks off"?

If you cannot answer that, then you cannot say that the beams must have been cut.

No one climbed up there and cut this section of framework while the fires were still burning.

Thankyou for that context.

A single opinion would not be sufficient.
A professional organization like the Structural Engineers Association of New York would have sufficient credibility.

No, a single opinion is NOT sufficient. That is why you claiming that the beams must have been cut holds no water at all.

A single expert opinion would be better than no opinion, or a non-expert opinion.

The collective opinion of a number fo experts would be better than the single expert opinion.

Thank you for your honesty.

Anytime.
 
Steel is malleable. It does not break*. It bends, rips and tears.

*Stress fractures are not a factor here.
Please explain why the splice plates could not have fractured. Back up your claims with facts. Fair enough?
 
Hogwash.
Your brief moment of honesty seems to have passed.

Dear Ed you are an insincere [rule 8].

If you disagree with my analysis, then tell me WHY. Don't just say 'hogwash', give reasons.

And why on earth would you consider that I am being dishonest in my analysis?

So now you're an expert?

Anybody feel free to correct me on this, but unless the laws of physics have changed since I last checked, steel does not turn blue when it is heated, and it does not turn blue when it cools. I don't need to be an expert to tell you that.
 
Your 'Verizon Bldg - Sheared Splice Plate' photo shows a bent beam with an irregular tear as would be expected of steel.
Steel is malleable. It does not break*. It bends, rips and tears.

(my bolding)

1. to smash, split, or divide into parts violently; reduce to pieces or fragments: He broke a vase.
2. to infringe, ignore, or act contrary to (a law, rule, promise, etc.): She broke her promise.
3. to dissolve or annul (often fol. by off): to break off friendly relations with another country.
4. to fracture a bone of (some part of the body): He broke his leg.
5. to lacerate; wound: to break the skin.
6. to destroy or interrupt the regularity, uniformity, continuity, or arrangement of; interrupt: The bleating of a foghorn broke the silence. The troops broke formation.
7. to put an end to; overcome; stop: His touchdown run broke the tie. She found it hard to break the cigarette habit.
8. to discover the system, key, method, etc., for decoding or deciphering (a cryptogram), esp. by the methods of cryptanalysis.
9. to remove a part from (a set or collection): She had to break the set to sell me the two red ones I wanted.
10. to exchange for or divide into smaller units or components: She broke a dollar bill into change. The prism broke the light into all the colors of the rainbow.
11. to make a way through; penetrate: The stone broke the surface of the water.
12. Law.
a. to open or force one's way into (a dwelling, store, etc.).
b. to contest (a will) successfully by judicial action.
13. to make one's way out of, esp. by force: to break jail.
14. to better (a given score or record): He never broke 200 in bowling or 80 in golf.
15. to disclose or divulge personally in speech or writing: He broke the good news to her at dinner.
16. to solve: The police needed only a week to break that case.
17. to rupture (a blood vessel): She almost broke a blood vessel from laughing so hard.
18. to disable or destroy by or as if by shattering or crushing: to break a watch.
19. to cause (a blister, boil, or the like) to burst, as by puncturing: She broke the blister with a needle.
20. to ruin financially; make bankrupt: They threatened to break him if he didn't stop discounting their products.
21. to overcome or wear down the spirit, strength, or resistance of; to cause to yield, esp. under pressure, torture, or the like: They broke him by the threat of blackmail.
22. to dismiss or reduce in rank.
23. to impair or weaken the power, effect, or intensity of: His arm broke the blow.
24. to train to obedience; tame: to break a horse.
25. to train away from a habit or practice (usually fol. by of).
26. Electricity. to render (a circuit) incomplete; stop the flow of (a current).
27. Journalism.
a. to release (a story) for publication or airing on radio or television: They will break the story tomorrow.
b. to continue (a story or article) on another page, esp. when the page is not the following one.
28. Pool. to cause (racked billiard balls) to scatter by striking with the cue ball.
29. Sports.
a. (of a pitcher, bowler, etc.) to hurl (a ball) in such a way as to cause it to change direction after leaving the hand: He broke a curve over the plate for a strike.
b. (in tennis and other racket games) to score frequently or win against (an opponent's serve).
30. Nautical. to unfurl (a flag) suddenly by an easily released knot.
31. to prove the falsity or show the lack of logic of: The FBI broke his alibi by proving he knew how to shoot a pistol.
32. to begin or initiate (a plan or campaign), esp. with much publicity: They were going to break the sales campaign with a parade in April.
33. to open the breech or action of (a shotgun, rifle, or revolver), as by snapping open the hinge between the barrel and the butt.
–verb (used without object)
34. to shatter, burst, or become broken; separate into parts or fragments, esp. suddenly and violently: The glass broke on the floor.
35. to become suddenly discontinuous or interrupted; stop abruptly: She pulled too hard and the string broke.
36. to become detached, separated, or disassociated (usually fol. by away, off, or from): The knob broke off in his hand.
37. to become inoperative or to malfunction, as through wear or damage: The television set broke this afternoon.
38. to begin suddenly or violently or change abruptly into something else: War broke over Europe.
39. to begin uttering a sound or series of sounds or to be uttered suddenly: She broke into song. When they entered, a cheer broke from the audience.
40. to express or start to express an emotion or mood: His face broke into a smile.
41. to free oneself or escape suddenly, as from restraint or dependency (often fol. by away): He broke away from the arresting officer. She finally broke away from her parents and got an apartment of her own.
42. to run or dash toward something suddenly (usually fol. by for): The pass receiver broke for the goal line.
43. to force a way (usually fol. by in, into, or through): The hunters broke through the underbrush.
44. to burst or rupture: A blood vessel broke in his nose. The blister broke when he pricked it.
45. to interrupt or halt an activity (usually fol. by in, into, forth, or from): Don't break in on the conversation. Let's break for lunch.
46. to appear or arrive suddenly (usually fol. by in, into, or out): A deer broke into the clearing. A rash broke out on her arm.
47. to dawn: The day broke hot and sultry.
48. to begin violently and suddenly: The storm broke.
49. (of a storm, foul weather, etc.) to cease: The weather broke after a week, and we were able to sail for home.
50. to part the surface of water, as a jumping fish or surfacing submarine.
51. to give way or fail, as health, strength, or spirit; collapse: After years of hardship and worry, his health broke.
52. to yield or submit to pressure, torture, or the like: He broke under questioning.
53. (of the heart) to be overwhelmed with sorrow: Her heart broke when he told her that he no longer loved her.
54. (of the voice or a musical instrument) to change harshly from one register or pitch to another: After his voice broke, he could no longer sing soprano parts.
55. (of the voice) to cease, waver, or change tone abruptly, esp. from emotional strain: His voice broke when he mentioned her name.
56. (of value or prices) to drop sharply and considerably.
57. to disperse or collapse by colliding with something: The waves broke on the shore.
58. to break dance.
59. (of a horse in a harness race) to fail to keep to a trot or pace, as by starting to gallop.
60. Botany. to mutate; sport.
61. Linguistics. to undergo breaking.
62. Billiards, Pool. to make a break; take the first turn in a game.
63. Sports. (of a pitched or bowled ball) to change direction: The ball broke over the plate.
64. Horse Racing, Track. to leave the starting point: The horses broke fast from the gate.
65. Boxing. to step back or separate from a clinch: The fighters fell into a clinch and broke on the referee's order.
66. to take place; occur.
67. Journalism. to become known, published, or aired: The story broke in the morning papers.
68. Horticulture. to produce flowers or leaves.
–noun
69. an act or instance of breaking; disruption or separation of parts; fracture; rupture: There was a break in the window.
70. an opening made by breaking; gap: The break in the wall had not been repaired.
71. a rush away from a place; an attempt to escape: a break for freedom.
72. a sudden dash or rush, as toward something: When the rain lessened, I made a break for home.
73. a suspension of or sudden rupture in friendly relations.
74. an interruption of continuity; departure from or rupture with: Abstract painters made a break with the traditions of the past.
75. an abrupt or marked change, as in sound or direction, or a brief pause: They noticed a curious break in his voice.
76. Informal.
a. an opportunity or stroke of fortune, esp. a lucky one.
b. a chance to improve one's lot, esp. one unlooked for or undeserved.
77. the breaks, Informal. the way things happen; fate: Sorry to hear about your bad luck, but I guess those are the breaks.
78. a brief rest, as from work: The actors took a ten-minute break from rehearsal.
79. Radio, Television. a brief, scheduled interruption of a program or broadcasting period for the announcement of advertising or station identification.
80. Prosody. a pause or caesura.
81. Jazz. a solo passage, usually of from 2 to 12 bars, during which the rest of the instruments are silent.
82. Music. the point in the scale where the quality of voice of one register changes to that of another, as from chest to head.
83. break dancing.
84. a sharp and considerable drop in the prices of stock issues.
85. Electricity. an opening or discontinuity in a circuit.
86. Printing.
a. one or more blank lines between two paragraphs.
b. breaks. suspension points.
87. the place, after a letter, where a word is or may be divided at the end of a line.
88. a collapse of health, strength, or spirit; breakdown.
89. Informal. an indiscreet or awkward remark or action; social blunder; faux pas.
90. Billiards, Pool. a series of successful strokes; run.
91. Pool. the opening play, in which the cue ball is shot to scatter the balls.
92. Sports. a change in direction of a pitched or bowled ball.
93. Horse Racing, Track. the start of a race.
94. (in harness racing) an act or instance of a horse's changing from a trot or pace into a gallop or other step.
95. Bowling. a failure to knock down all ten pins in a single frame.
96. Boxing. an act or instance of stepping back or separating from a clinch: a clean break.
97. any of several stages in the grinding of grain in which the bran is separated from the kernel.
98. Botany. a sport.
99. Journalism. the point at the bottom of a column where a printed story is carried over to another column or page.
100. Nautical. the place at which a superstructure, deckhouse, or the like, rises from the main deck of a vessel.
101. breaks, Physical Geography. an area dissected by small ravines and gullies.
102. Mining. a fault or offset, as in a vein or bed of ore.

I don't think you know what "break" means.

-Gumboot
 
Anybody feel free to correct me on this, but unless the laws of physics have changed since I last checked, steel does not turn blue when it is heated, and it does not turn blue when it cools. I don't need to be an expert to tell you that.


Actually it does, but it doesn't look like that.

-Gumboot
 
Chris, you are speculating on the splices being cut, without having the slightest evidence to support that claim,
That sir, is a matter of opinion

or any explanation of how that could have been accomplished by the conspirators.
So what? You want i should prove every element of the crime?
If that is where you are putting the goalposts, you are blissfully safe in your denial.

Chris, could the splices have fractured from the collapse? Yes or no?
Not [mostly] straight like that.

Neither of us is qualified to say for sure but you cannot justifiably rule out that they were cut IMO.
 
Or not...I thought steel glowed red-orange when heated, and returned to essentially it's original colour provided it hadn't been welded or alloyed?

We'd get it on steel when we'd been angle-grinding it. Very deep rich blue stain at the edge of the cut. Usually means the steel has been heated and cooled very fast, and is very sharp. It usually comes away very easily. We're talking a narrow strip maybe 5mm from the edge of the cut.

-Gumboot
 
You claimed that the splice plates could not have fractured. For the second time, present your evidence to back that claim.

If you have none, just say so. That's what rational adults do.
 
I don't think you know what "break" means.

-Gumboot
Good point. Should be "break off straight"

Steel will bend, deform and tear in an irregular manner as in this photo

gravydl9.png


Break: To separate into 2 pieces
Rip: Tear or be torn
Tear: To pull something apart
 
You claimed that the splice plates could not have fractured. For the second time, present your evidence to back that claim.

If you have none, just say so. That's what rational adults do.
Now you want i should prove a negative?

O master of misquote

What part of "not [mostly] straight like that" don't you understand?
 
Last edited:
Now you want i should prove a negative?

O master of misquote

What part of "not [mostly] straight like that" don't you understand?
No, Chris, you made a positive claim.

First, look at the photos I posted. None of them show a "mostly straight" break. There are jagged breaks in the splice plates above the column ends, below the column ends, and column ends where the splice plates are completely gone.

Present your evidence that the splice plates could not have broken in the way they did. There's a whole field of science devoted to this subject. You must have something: a website you can refer me to, anything.

Chris: do you have anything with which to back your claim, besides your opinion?
 
Good point. Should be "break off straight"

Steel will bend, deform and tear in an irregular manner as in this photo
Chris, you posted a photo of splice plates that did not break off straight. The one on the left could hardly be less straight. The one on the right that the arrows point to goes from high above the column end, to even with the column end.

What's your explanation?
 
We'd get it on steel when we'd been angle-grinding it. Very deep rich blue stain at the edge of the cut. Usually means the steel has been heated and cooled very fast, and is very sharp. It usually comes away very easily. We're talking a narrow strip maybe 5mm from the edge of the cut.

-Gumboot

I stand corrected. From your description, that doesn't sound anything like what has been posted in that picture.
 
Well I don't know about you, but every building implosion I have seen there are huge flashes, loud explosion noises in quick succession and visible explosions.

None of which were observed at WTC7.

Not to mention that in professional implosions any damage to other buildings is usually very slight.

30 West Broadway and the Verizon building(coutesy of the above photos) suffered damage that is inconsistent with a professional implosion.
Chris will argue that the surrounding buildings were not a consideration. Why then was the supposedly professional implosion designed such that most of the structure did fall within it own footprint. That is NOT a requirement for professional demolitions, many structures are brought down in such a way as to have the structure move in a specfic direction. In one docuementary I saw concerning the demolitions of Las Vegas casinos the term "pull" was used to describe such action. (it did not involve the use of cable, just used the timing of the explosives to have the building fall away from another structure only a few feet from the one coming down.

Seems Chris then wants it both ways; the building came almost straight down and therefore the professional demolition was used to drop the building into its own footprint , AND it really didn't matter where the building fell as far as the conspiractors were concerned.

However, IF the whole idea was to hide evidence that WTC 7 was used in some way to cause the collapse of the other two towers, or to destroy other docuements and evidence contained in the offices in that building then the most effective direction of collapse would have been to have it fall onto WTC 6 and have its debris co-mingle with that of WTC 6 and WTC 1.

These 'professionals' were out-to-lunch it seems.

Chris also cannot explain why it is that all the columns that he says were cut seem to have separated only at column splices. He will not even venture a guess at how the installation of these charges and their control mechanisms was accomplished.

You can't believe that anyone could pull it off, therefore, it didn't happen.

Until at least some cogent arguement is made that suggests that it could be accomplished AND some evidence is brought forward to suggest that these columns were cut by demolition charges the whole hypothesis turns on your personal incredulity that debris damage and/or fire could not have brought the building down.
 
Last edited:

ISF - Join now!

Every member here is approved by hand. No bots, no spam, just people who care about evidence and honest debate.

Membership is free!

Create your free account

Back
Top Bottom