Merged Chick Tracts

[John Nowak]

I don't think we can expect fear of eternal damnation to trump avarice, can we?

I'm not clear where you're writing from, but over here a five day work week is common.

 

[halleyscomet]

This fella clearly isn't quite getting the message god's trying to send...

He's clearly never read the book of Amos.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amos_(prophet)

 

[Seismosaurus]

I am not so sure.
I think a good 15% could not correctly name any single commandment (number one wrong answer to this question is "Do unto others yadda-yadda")

I am guessing about only 85% would provide a correct answer to where do the 10C come from or who wrote them. Possible ten percent saying "don't know" and five percent giving a wrong answer.

There are still a lot of ignorant or uneducated people out there.
And most importantly, the number of never-heard-of-them folks was much greater when Chick started writing (70s ?)

I can certainly believe that few would know details of the TC, but seriously, to have never even heard of them? No, I don't buy that for a second.

 

[maximara]

I am not so sure.
I think a good 15% could not correctly name any single commandment (number one wrong answer to this question is "Do unto others yadda-yadda")

I am guessing about only 85% would provide a correct answer to where do the 10C come from or who wrote them. Possible ten percent saying "don't know" and five percent giving a wrong answer.

There are still a lot of ignorant or uneducated people out there.
And most importantly, the number of never-heard-of-them folks was much greater when Chick started writing (70s ?)

While this is somewhat true the problem is Exodus 20:1-17 and Deuteronomy 5:4-21 have them in different order. Furthermore, as the wikiarticle on them shows their order and which commandment is which changes.

More interesting Exodus 34 has a different set of "Ten Commandments" from these.

More importantly when asked by a follower in Mark 10:18-25 how he may be saved Jesus does NOT cite all the Commandments but only these:
Do not commit adultery,
Do not kill,
Do not steal,
Do not bear false witness,
Defraud not,
Honour thy father and mother.

Then Jesus seems to throw out the Commandments altogether in Matthew 25:41-46 where he has helping one another at the key for salvation. Funny thing Chich uses Matthew 25:41 a lot but ignores the context.

 

[maximara]

Fundies think that the only reason people don't believe is that they just haven't heard about Jeezus. Once you hear about him you just have to accept the truth and convert.

Steve S

Actually Chick goes the 'they haven't heard the truth about Jesus' route.

 

[halleyscomet]

While this is somewhat true the problem is Exodus 20:1-17 and Deuteronomy 5:4-21 have them in different order. Furthermore, as the wikiarticle on them shows their order and which commandment is which changes.

More interesting Exodus 34 has a different set of "Ten Commandments" from these.

More importantly when asked by a follower in Mark 10:18-25 how he may be saved Jesus does NOT cite all the Commandments but only these:
Do not commit adultery,
Do not kill,
Do not steal,
Do not bear false witness,
Defraud not,
Honour thy father and mother.

Then Jesus seems to throw out the Commandments altogether in Matthew 25:41-46 where he has helping one another at the key for salvation. Funny thing Chich uses Matthew 25:41 a lot but ignores the context.

This is complicated by the fact that there are multiple versions of the Ten Commandments among different denominations and religions. The "ten Commandments" is actually an editorial distillation of 13 proto-commandments.

 

[Ladewig]

While this is somewhat true the problem is Exodus 20:1-17 and Deuteronomy 5:4-21 have them in different order. Furthermore, as the wikiarticle on them shows their order and which commandment is which changes.

More interesting Exodus 34 has a different set of "Ten Commandments" from these.

More importantly when asked by a follower in Mark 10:18-25 how he may be saved Jesus does NOT cite all the Commandments but only these:
Do not commit adultery,
Do not kill,
Do not steal,
Do not bear false witness,
Defraud not,
Honour thy father and mother.

Then Jesus seems to throw out the Commandments altogether in Matthew 25:41-46 where he has helping one another at the key for salvation. Funny thing Chich uses Matthew 25:41 a lot but ignores the context.

I should have been more specific. When I said that 15% could not give a correct answer to where they come from, I was simply looking for answers such as the Bible, the first half of the Bible, the Old Testament, "religious scriptures," or even "some book written more that 2000 years ago." Similarly, for the question of who wrote them, God, Moses, "someone in the Old Testament," Jewish priests, and some Bible prophet would all count as correct answers. In fact, I think my numbers might still be valid if a correct answer consisted of naming any Bible character other than Adam or Jonah.

 

[maximara]

I should have been more specific. When I said that 15% could not give a correct answer to where they come from, I was simply looking for answers such as the Bible, the first half of the Bible, the Old Testament, "religious scriptures," or even "some book written more that 2000 years ago." Similarly, for the question of who wrote them, God, Moses, "someone in the Old Testament," Jewish priests, and some Bible prophet would all count as correct answers. In fact, I think my numbers might still be valid if a correct answer consisted of naming any Bible character other than Adam or Jonah.

I really don't think it would be 15% who would fail to produce answers like this between radio and TV preachers as well as who ever is local how could you not produce answers this general.

 

[maximara]

"Liquor's like a demon in every bottle... and he's out to get you."

Yeah because the drinker isn't responsible for drinking at all.

That is a common theme with Chick: its the Devil and his demon minions that are to blame for this ill. Believe in Jesus and you will be saved no matter what kind of bad thing you have done. Lisa is where it really hits the sewer pipe and it manages to do it at the end. You see the daughter this guy has given herpes to and she doesn't look like she is even 10 yet.

As the commentator on that story said "And so our story ends with poor Lisa suffering from herpes and the emotional scars of having been raped and abused by her parents (and a neighbor, who never gets mentioned again). But it’s a happy ending, because Henry and Linda have become Christians after seeing the error of their ways."

 

[Ladewig]

I really don't think it would be 15% who would fail to produce answers like this between radio and TV preachers as well as who ever is local how could you not produce answers this general.

I have no evidence to support my claim. I just believe that there are a lot of people who don't pay attention to TV preachers or real-life preachers.

 

[Delvo]

When I said that 15% could not give a correct answer to where they come from, I was simply looking for answers such as the Bible, the first half of the Bible, the Old Testament, "religious scriptures," or even "some book written more that 2000 years ago." Similarly, for the question of who wrote them, God, Moses, "someone in the Old Testament," Jewish priests, and some Bible prophet would all count as correct answers. In fact, I think my numbers might still be valid if a correct answer consisted of naming any Bible character other than Adam or Jonah.

So what non-Biblical answers do you think 85% would give? Buddha? Julius Caesar? The Mockingjay?

 

[maximara]

I have no evidence to support my claim. I just believe that there are a lot of people who don't pay attention to TV preachers or real-life preachers.

True, but you commented "There are still a lot of ignorant or uneducated people out there." and that is exactly the type of person the radio, TV, and real-life preachers aim for.

There is a reason Marx said "religion is...the Opium of the masses"

Look at the early Middle Ages where the majority of people were "ignorant or uneducated" and see how religious they were.

 

[maximara]

This is complicated by the fact that there are multiple versions of the Ten Commandments among different denominations and religions. The "ten Commandments" is actually an editorial distillation of 13 proto-commandments.

Interestingly the wikipedia article I cited has the same chart as the blog above. But the blog avoids the whole Exodus 34 issue which has a different set of commandments. Here they are, as based on some of the comments some of you aren't following the links I provide (the bolded ones are those that do NOT appear in either Exodus 20:1-17 or Deuteronomy 5:4-21):

1. Thou shalt worship no other god (For the Lord is a jealous god).

2. Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.

3. The feast of unleavened bread shalt thou keep in the month when the ear is on the corn.

4. All the first-born are mine.


5. Six days shalt thou work, but on the seventh thou shalt rest.

6. Thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, even of the first fruits of the wheat harvest, and the feast of ingathering at the year's end.

7. Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leavened bread.

8. The fat of my feast shall not remain all night until the morning.


9. The first of the first fruits of thy ground thou shalt bring unto the house of the Lord thy God.

10. Thou shalt not seethe a kid in its mother's milk.

Note that only three of these Ten Commandments agree with the lists provided by Exodus 20:1-17 or Deuteronomy 5:4-21.

 

[Craig B]

Interestingly the wikipedia article I cited has the same chart as the blog above. But the blog avoids the whole Exodus 34 issue which has a different set of commandments. Here they are, as based on some of the comments some of you aren't following the links I provide (the bolded ones are those that do NOT appear in either Exodus 20:1-17 or Deuteronomy 5:4-21):

1. Thou shalt worship no other god (For the Lord is a jealous god).

2. Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.

3. The feast of unleavened bread shalt thou keep in the month when the ear is on the corn.

4. All the first-born are mine.


5. Six days shalt thou work, but on the seventh thou shalt rest.

6. Thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, even of the first fruits of the wheat harvest, and the feast of ingathering at the year's end.

7. Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leavened bread.

8. The fat of my feast shall not remain all night until the morning.


9. The first of the first fruits of thy ground thou shalt bring unto the house of the Lord thy God.

10. Thou shalt not seethe a kid in its mother's milk.

Note that only three of these Ten Commandments agree with the lists provided by Exodus 20:1-17 or Deuteronomy 5:4-21.

And not one of these particular three is a moral precept. The ones in the later lists in Ex 20 and Deut 5 that are in fact moral precepts, are commonplaces found in practically every set of commandments and laws enforced or enjoined in all societies. This was noted in ancient times by the philosopher Julian, the last non-Christian emperor of Rome.

Now except for the command "Thou shalt not worship other gods," and "Remember the sabbath day," what nation is there, I ask in the name of the gods, which does not think that it ought to keep the other commandments? So much so that penalties have been ordained against those who transgress them, sometimes more severe, and sometimes similar to those enacted by Moses, though they are sometimes more humane.​

"Against the Galileans", Flavius Claudius Iulianus Augustus, reigned 361-363.

Julian's book was suppressed and destroyed after his death, and has had to be reconstructed, as far as possible, from passages preserved in critical Christian works.

 

[Ladewig]

So what non-Biblical answers do you think 85% would give? Buddha? Julius Caesar? The Mockingjay?

As I said in the previous page, i expect 10% to say "I don't know" and 5% to give incorrect answers. The ones you suggested are as likely as any others I could think of. Maybe the Founding Fathers, the first Pope, Martin Luther, Martin Luther King, and such.

 

[Ladewig]

True, but you commented "There are still a lot of ignorant or uneducated people out there." and that is exactly the type of person the radio, TV, and real-life preachers aim for.

Even if that is their target market, the predatory preachers don't have 100% market penetration.

Furthermore, even if there are ignorant people following these preachers, that doesn't mean that all them pay close enough attention to understand that the Ten Commandments come from the Bible.