Chávez - Load up the rubber bullets.

[DC]

I notice that that nice man Mr Tascon was one of the main talking heads ensuring the MP's voted through the changes to allow the referendum.

The church were not too happy with Chavez trying to extemnd his power. I guess that they are US puppets eh?

Never mind, having the Maisanta list which shows how everyone votes will ensure there are still some who are wary of voting against Chavez again. I'm sure that he will get it through by hook or by crook.

They didnt have to do anything to get the referendum true the NA. Thanks to the opposition boycoting elections.

but for people like you, they especially collected 4.5 million signatures, which is more than 15% of the populations, far more than needed to get the referendum.

OH my god the Church, well the church shall not stick its nose in Politics they shall stick to their invisible man in the sky.....

btw.

British Prime Ministers have never been elected directly by the public. They have all become Prime Minister indirectly because firstly, they were members of either the Commons or Lords; secondly, they were the leader of a great political party; and, thirdly, they either inherited a majority in the Commons, or won more seats than the opposition in a general election.

How many terms is a british PM alowed to run?
and will you start a referendum to limit the terms of british premiers?
while your at it, dont you want to remove the monarchs?

 

[DC]

Violent overthrow of countries leaders are wrong. That is why Chavez went to jail for doing it.

America encouraging the people to overthrow leaders they do not like is the same thing they have been doing for years to more than just Venezuela. You only seem to cry when some people dare to criticize your hero Chavez. You are exactly what you accuse others here of. Very ironic.

Oh i was interested in a debate about Morales in Bolivia, but almost nobody else seemed interested.

We can also talk about Lulas reforms in Brazil, he did a great job.

or any other country you want to talk about, just start a thread.
i have nothing against critising Chavez, i even read opposition blogs in english.
and most Docus from the Bolivarian Movement, does include interviews with opposition people, even people that simply hate Chavez.

eveyone is free to critizise the Venezuelan Hero Chavez, but i will defend him and especially the Bolivarian movement against lies.

I guess would someone have brought a coup against Saddam, we in the west would hate hm for such an undemocratic act, isnt it?

 

[funk de fino]

They didnt have to do anything to get the referendum true the NA. Thanks to the opposition boycoting elections.

but for people like you, they especially collected 4.5 million signatures, which is more than 15% of the populations, far more than needed to get the referendum.

OH my god the Church, well the church shall not stick its nose in Politics they shall stick to their invisible man in the sky.....

I wonder if those petiton signatures will be used by the Tascon badman to punish people?? Did Chavez make them do it again and accuse then of being riddled with fakes?

Saddam and Mugabe were/are democratically elected. Doesn't make them good.

How many terms is a british PM alowed to run?
and will you start a referendum to limit the terms of british premiers?
while your at it, dont you want to remove the monarchs?

I am scottish, I do not believe in the union of the UK. I am a nationalist and want independance for my country. You can slate the Uk all you want and it means nothing to me. The UK voted Tony Blair in as PM. Not Gordon brown however. As for the queen she has no power and means nothing to me.

Two wrongs do not make a right. Unless its Tascon and Maisanta eh?

 

[funk de fino]

Oh i was interested in a debate about Morales in Bolivia, but almost nobody else seemed interested.

We can also talk about Lulas reforms in Brazil, he did a great job.

or any other country you want to talk about, just start a thread.
i have nothing against critising Chavez, i even read opposition blogs in english.
and most Docus from the Bolivarian Movement, does include interviews with opposition people, even people that simply hate Chavez.

eveyone is free to critizise the Venezuelan Hero Chavez, but i will defend him and especially the Bolivarian movement against lies.

I guess would someone have brought a coup against Saddam, we in the west would hate hm for such an undemocratic act, isnt it?

I guess you can show me the lies I have told about Chavez then eh? Very strange that you claim to read opposition blogs about Chavez and venezuela but I had to tell you things you knew nothing about and had to go and get the sources that proved me right.

You defend him even against things that if any other country or ruler did them you would complain. Chavez is a convicted criminal who attempted a coup and you rail against others for suggesting similar coups. Hypocrite.

If someone had brought about a coup against Saddam it would be just as wrong as any coup. Incuding Chavez failed attempt. Which cost lives.

 

[DC]

I wonder if those petiton signatures will be used by the Tascon badman to punish people?? Did Chavez make them do it again and accuse then of being riddled with fakes?

Saddam and Mugabe were/are democratically elected. Doesn't make them good.




I am scottish, I do not believe in the union of the UK. I am a nationalist and want independance for my country. You can slate the Uk all you want and it means nothing to me. The UK voted Tony Blair in as PM. Not Gordon brown however. As for the queen she has no power and means nothing to me.

Two wrongs do not make a right. Unless its Tascon and Maisanta eh?

good luck with gaining independence.

 

[DC]

I guess you can show me the lies I have told about Chavez then eh? Very strange that you claim to read opposition blogs about Chavez and venezuela but I had to tell you things you knew nothing about and had to go and get the sources that proved me right.

You defend him even against things that if any other country or ruler did them you would complain. Chavez is a convicted criminal who attempted a coup and you rail against others for suggesting similar coups. Hypocrite.

If someone had brought about a coup against Saddam it would be just as wrong as any coup. Incuding Chavez failed attempt. Which cost lives.

So the violent removal of Saddam was wrong?
darn, one of the only things i liked about the war in iraq.....

 

[funk de fino]

good luck with gaining independence.

Thanks. One of the most annoying things in my lifetime has been that my country has not had the chance to vote on its own independance. The UK govt would not let us decide. They said we could not look after ourselves.

The very same govt that along with the US and other NATO allies have been pushing eastern bloc states to break away from Russia.

I believe that the day is closer and the mood is getting more pro independance. If however my fellow countrymen vote against independance I will accpet it as the will of the people and will not lead a coup or violent protests.

 

[funk de fino]

So the violent removal of Saddam was wrong?
darn, one of the only things i liked about the war in iraq.....

The second Iraq war was wrong. So was Saddam gassing Kurds and Iranians and invading Kuwait. The outcome of the war has been good but it does not excuse te fact it should not have happened the way it did.

It should have been a strong UN who moved to get rid of Saddam in other ways. I beleieve that the UN is for this very thing but it is too slow and too weak.

 

[DC]

Thanks. One of the most annoying things in my lifetime has been that my country has not had the chance to vote on its own independance. The UK govt would not let us decide. They said we could not look after ourselves.

The very same govt that along with the US and other NATO allies have been pushing eastern bloc states to break away from Russia.

I believe that the day is closer and the mood is getting more pro independance. If however my fellow countrymen vote against independance I will accpet it as the will of the people and will not lead a coup or violent protests.

is there a movement active to gain Independence?
and do you have any democratic ways to get a say in that issue? (Besides of mass protests)

 

[RandFan]

you dont care that your government is a threat to the venezuelan people. it must wait..........

I don't accept the proposition.

 

[RandFan]

but the World must act, when the US pisses off some 20 islamists hijacker, then suddenly the US is top priority for the whole freaking planet.

So you are on the side of the terrorists? You support what they have also done in Europe and other nations?

then we even have to close our eyes to the US violations of human rights etc, when it is about protecting the USA its all top priority, everything goes then.

Strawman. Americans on this forum were outraged at the abuses and called for Bush's impeachment.

when the Venezuelans their country is threted by the biggest terror network in the world, it has time to wait,

If this were true we would be in Caracas right now.

 

[DC]

The second Iraq war was wrong. So was Saddam gassing Kurds and Iranians and invading Kuwait. The outcome of the war has been good but it does not excuse te fact it should not have happened the way it did.

It should have been a strong UN who moved to get rid of Saddam in other ways. I beleieve that the UN is for this very thing but it is too slow and too weak.

how do you want to remove someone like Saddam?

i would have supported a popular uprising, but never expected one because we the west let those people beeing killed by Saddam when they rised up.

i think the situation is somehow comparable to Venezuela.
After the Caracazo, where 1000's died, the people was scared, but the coup gave em hope, they saw they are not alone, and there is support inside the Army.
I know it is violence, but sometimes, it seems to be needed to get the changes.
In Venezuela they didnt belive in the 2 Party system anymore, because that system let them down for decades, so they took the violent way for short, but then learned that the Democratic way is still open, and has been betterd alot with the new constitution.

I would like everyone would gain his goals the way Gandhi did, but that is mostly not the case.

 

[RandFan]

DC, you see the world in a very black and white, with us or against us mode. This has been the problem of many Americans. But then that is typical of human nature as you clearly illustrate.

 

[DC]

I don't accept the proposition.

how would you formulate it?
the majority of Venezuelans wants Chavez, the US wanted to remove him, i see that as a threat against the Venezuelan people, atleast against the majority.

 

[DC]

DC, you see the world in a very black and white, with us or against us mode. This has been the problem of many Americans. But then that is typical of human nature as you clearly illustrate.

No way.
look i got pissed, not because you dislike his Socialism.
But because you seemed to deny what your country did and seem to not care about it at all.
they do those things in your name.

 

[DC]

So you are on the side of the terrorists? You support what they have also done in Europe and other nations?

Strawman. Americans on this forum were outraged at the abuses and called for Bush's impeachment.

If this were true we would be in Caracas right now.

did i say i support theyr terrorism?
or
do you support the installment of an US friendly government in Venezuela, no mather wath the Venezuelans want?

for me, the CIA is the biggest terrornetwork in the world. Listen to inteviews of old CIA agents, wen they tell how they fought the commis and how they spread terrorism in foreign countrys.

when you look at Bolivia and Venezuela, you can see the same thing is still going on.

 

[funk de fino]

is there a movement active to gain Independence?
and do you have any democratic ways to get a say in that issue? (Besides of mass protests)

Scottish National Party. They are the largest party in the Scottish Parliament (a present from the labour Govt fought tooth and nail by the Tories). They want to put out a referendum in 2010 but most likely the english based parties in the Parliament will block it. There is not overall majority mainly because of a version of proportional representation.

 

[DC]

i thought 9/11 would have teached the US people to take more care wath their politicans and CIA etc do in foreign relations, and maybe even stopp some things they do.

The more you mess with foreign countrys, the higher the chance you get another blowback.

 

[DC]

Scottish National Party. They are the largest party in the Scottish Parliament (a present from the labour Govt fought tooth and nail by the Tories). They want to put out a referendum in 2010 but most likely the english based parties in the Parliament will block it. There is not overall majority mainly because of a version of proportional representation.

I hope for you your goals can be reached if your fellow country men agree.

 

[funk de fino]

you dont care that your government is a threat to the venezuelan people. it must wait..........

I also disagree.