CEOs Get Paid Too Much, Says Everyone

[Belz...]

No, not really.

The scenarios you describe might apply to traders. I'm an investor.

If I invest in Coke today, sure, they might introduce a new soda tomorrow that is a big hit and share prices rise 30% over the next 6 months. It could also be a huge dud, and share prices might drop 30% over the next 6 months. But over a period of 20-30 years, it doesn't matter. They'll have plenty of hits and plenty of bombs, and as long as the hits out number the bombs, the share price should reflect that over the long term. Same for the drug company.

Unless they fold in 8 years. You can't predict that.

 

[Belz...]

Assuming that all that talk about risk is meaningful, can anyone deny that there is no random element in the stock market?

I think you didn't mean to put that double negative in there.

Steve Jobs getting pancreatic cancer was a random event that affected Apple's future.

I'd in fact argue that the jury's still out on the long-term impact of his death on his company.

 

[luchog]

My opinion of corporate ladder climbers, including almost all non-founder CEOs, is actually worse than that. My observation is that not only do they take credit for good luck and deny responsibility for bad luck, they actually take credit for others' success and lay blame for their own failures on their subordinates. In 30 years of observations from the cubicles, I've seen it again and again.

Sounds like an old co-worker of mine.

That perfectly describes my former department director. I've seen a number of people do that, but none so blatantly and transparently as he did. He clearly thought he was all smooth and slick; but was pretty painfully obvious about it. He was also one of those types of people that never encountered a situation so bad they couldn't make it worse. He did encourage department solidarity and cooperation in a twisted sort of way -- well all worked together to find ways to work around him, and get the job done with a minimum of interference by him.

 

[Meadmaker]

Sounds like an old co-worker of mine.

If you work in the cubicle jungle, it probably sounds like more than one of them.

I would say that when it comes to first level managers, there a many that don't sound like that. When it comes to second level and above managers, I have met very few that didn't sound like that. Some are worse than others about it, but in the atmosphere of a large company, it's almost impossible to advance without some of those skills. (i.e. without the ability to dodge blame or to take credit for others' work.)

 

[LSSBB]

If you work in the cubicle jungle, it probably sounds like more than one of them.

I would say that when it comes to first level managers, there a many that don't sound like that. When it comes to second level and above managers, I have met very few that didn't sound like that. Some are worse than others about it, but in the atmosphere of a large company, it's almost impossible to advance without some of those skills. (i.e. without the ability to dodge blame or to take credit for others' work.)

I think it depends on the corporate culture. My employer I left a year ago was chock full of Peter Principles. My new employer has middle management that seems to actually be able to lead and manage, and the CEO seems to earn his pay. Proof is in the pudding - old company is slowly circling the flush hole, current company is on the upswing, making good mergers and taking time to focus efforts where it counts.

 

[Meadmaker]

I think it depends on the corporate culture. My employer I left a year ago was chock full of Peter Principles. My new employer has middle management that seems to actually be able to lead and manage, and the CEO seems to earn his pay. Proof is in the pudding - old company is slowly circling the flush hole, current company is on the upswing, making good mergers and taking time to focus efforts where it counts.

Is the new company by chance a younger company that has a founder CEO? I suspect that founder CEOs are different than ladder climbing CEOs. The founder got where he was by having a vision and making it happen. The ladder climber started out inside, and climbed onto someone else's ship, and rose through the ranks.

While he was doing that rising, he had to look around and make sure that whatever he did, he ended up looking good, and in particular he had to look better than everyone else. That means when something went wrong, he had to make sure that someone else took the blame. That means when everything goes right, he has to position himself to take credit.

 

[LSSBB]

Is the new company by chance a younger company that has a founder CEO? I suspect that founder CEOs are different than ladder climbing CEOs. The founder got where he was by having a vision and making it happen. The ladder climber started out inside, and climbed onto someone else's ship, and rose through the ranks.

While he was doing that rising, he had to look around and make sure that whatever he did, he ended up looking good, and in particular he had to look better than everyone else. That means when something went wrong, he had to make sure that someone else took the blame. That means when everything goes right, he has to position himself to take credit.

No, it's a well established company, and he is a ladder climber. He doesn't seem to be a gloden boy suit, though.