WildCat
NWO Master Conspirator
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Yes. You are "other".
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timhau
NWO Litter Technician
I think we have a special term for men who take up sports seriously and have an unnaturally high biological level of testosterone. It's 'Star Athlete'.
And yes, it's very unfair. I grew up wanting to be the starting goalie for the Finnish national Ice Hockey team, but they keep giving the job to guys who have talent.
Checkmite
Skepticifimisticalationist
Running up and down stairwells carrying 20# of gear ... 16 hours on watch, 8 hours off ... seemingly endless drills and training ... 5 hours of sleep out of every 24 (if you're lucky) ... close quarters with people you would otherwise avoid ... no privacy ...
It has more to do with endurance and dedication than with any specific athletic skill.
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
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The supposted rational behind this has been that she has an advantage from the differences in her endocrine system.
And if it is just about sex then we really should have banned Lance Armstrong, loosing his balls means he is no longer an man and should never have been allowed to compete in mens sports. Hey the rules are the rules right?
tyr_13
Penultimate Amazing
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Oversimplify much?
timhau
NWO Litter Technician
But since Lance certainly did not transform into a woman, that would leave him entirely without a class to compete in, which doesn't sound like a fair outcome. If Caster Semenya doesn't, for some reason, qualify to the women's 800m, she is still free to compete with men. She'll lose by 10 seconds to guys who have no chance of World Championship medals and whom you've never heard of, but she can compete.
Dave Rogers
Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through
Since the quality of your writing indicates that you're not an idiot, exactly what's the attraction you find in impersonating one?
The rationale is that men, as a group, have a sufficiently great performance advantage over women that women would very rarely be able to compete against men, therefore a separation between men's sport and women's sport has been enacted by regulation. Since the regulations only contain these two classifications, for the purposes of eligibility for competition, Caster Semenya must be classified as either a man or as a woman. The same is true of Lance Armstrong, of course, but since his testosterone levels had pretty much finished regulating his physical development by the time he was unfortunate enough to need his testicles amputated, it's fairly clear that he can be defined as a man for the purposes of regulation.
Still, don't let me stop you constructing your non sequiturs, since you seem to enjoy the activity so much.
Dave
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
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Exactly. We need to keep the keep the freaks like those 'star athletes' and Semenya out of athletics.
Rolfe
Adult human female
As far as I know, the further into endurance exercise you go, the more the male/female gap diminishes.
Rolfe.
That's one claim, but does it apply to every woman between the ages of 18 and 40?
Let's put it to a test - specifically, the one that I proposed - that isolates a group of men and a group of women in two segregated and identical stress-filled industrial environments, and then measure the efficiency and efficacy of their respective systems after the experiment has run for a full year.
Two identical naval destroyers. One crewed entirely by men, the other entirely by women. For one full year, they both operate in the same region, under the same conditions, and for that year, no man would be allowed on the woman's ship, and no woman would be allowed on the man's ship. At the end of the year, the admiralty performs a detailed inspection of both ships, and an audit is performed on the maintenance, training, medical and watch logs. Each individual of both crews would also undergo a physical readiness test that holds to the exact same standards for both men and women. The ship that passes the inspection with a higher score than the other would (by correlation) "prove" or "disprove" this whole idea of male-female equality.
This would really be a test of endurance and dedication, as well as physical fitness and raw athletic performance (sit-ups, push-ups, running, and swimming). Numerical values would be derived, and it would be a matter of record.
Let's do this thing and settle the issue once and for all.
timhau
NWO Litter Technician
The best marathon time in the world for a man is 2h03:59 by Haile Gebreselassie. The best time for a woman is 2h15:25 by Paula Radcliffe. The difference is about 9.3%; however, Radcliffe's time is something of an outlier -- it's more than 3 minutes better than the all-time second-best result (and it was achieved by using male pace-setters, so if the IAAF recognized official WRs for the marathon, it might not qualify; Radcliffe's best time in a women-only race was more than two minutes slower). The difference between all-time 3rd-best times is just over 12% (the times are 2h04:27 for men, 2h19:12 for women).
The World Records for 100m are 9.58 (Usain Bolt) and 10.49 (Florence Griffith-Joyner), a difference of 9.5%. Both of those times are more than .1 seconds better than all-time second-bests; however, the difference between all-time third bests is 9.6%.
That's just a quick play with numbers, but it certainly does not show the gap diminishing as the running distance grows longer.
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shandyjan
Master Poster
Just a nit picking question... Lance Armstrong had A testicular tumour and the testicle removed. (that is from what I read.)That means he still has one testicle doesnt it? How does that make him not a man?
Yep. And that is why we have:
The World Masters;
Little League;
Minor Leagues;
The Football Pyramid;
The Special Olympics;
The Paralympics; and
Amateur Sports in general.
Among thousands of other events. It is why I have a trophy for Squash even though I never won a match (except by default).
You know, at some point, there became a virtue of speaking your opinion, when it really was quite a bit too pig ignorant to be worthy of discussion.
I'd like to blame our modern educational system, but I can't.
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A person with XY chromosomes is a male.
A male that's been castrated and emasculated is still a male - albeit a mutilated male.
A male with man-boobs ("Moobs") is still a male.
A male that willfully undergoes cosmetic surgury is still a male.
A male that willfully undergoes cosmetic surgury to remove his penis and testicals, has a vagina constructed in their place, and undergoes hormonal therapy or cosmetic surgury to acquire a pair of prominent breasts is still a male, no matter what he wants people to believe.
It's like I told one of my more pervy friends, "That ain't a chick with a d**k, that's a guy with t**s!"
*sigh*
Edited by Lisa Simpson:
Edited to remove personal remarks.
Chromosomes are neither as simplistic, nor as straightforward as you have made it out. What did you do, make a Punnett Square of XY and XX, and then assume you've got it all figured out? Oh, of course, make a Punnett Square! XX and XY, no others need apply! Genetics can be figured out with a square I can show a 12 year old! Damn fools spending thousands of dollars getting degrees in this stuff, what a bunch of stoned wankers.
Too bad genetics doesn't quite work that way. Y genes are not necessary to be male. All you have to have is one X gene. XO is... drumroll... Female. One X chromsome. XXY? XYY? XXYY?
Oh, wait, this is the very tip of the iceburg. I'm sure you can use your incredible ignorance to assign a gender to all of those.
But how about XX/XY? Mosaics. Yes, genetics is not even as straightforward as you having a single set of genes. Mosaics occur in early development, and result in an individual with both XX and XY parts of the body.
Oh, I'm sorry, they're XY. They're male. I remember. I mean nevermind the fact that the individual is a woman who can have kids. She has an XY right arm. Sure, there's no glands in the right arm. Sure, it basically has absolutely no influence on the woman whatsoever. But, XY! She's definitely got XY genes. Male.
It gets even more complicated then this. I haven't even SAID the word Chimera yet (I just did. It makes life more complex. Lets leave it be, because you're ignorant enough already, that'll just get you confused).
The International Olympic Committee convened a group of biologists and scientists to discuss this. They reached the conclusion that there is no standard or sets of standards that define a gender.
But I know! You're smarter than all those scientists, have more expertise in biology, and more knowledge! That's why you know the earth was created 6,000 years... err... you can define gender!
Edited by Lisa Simpson:
Edited to remove personal remarks.
Please keep in mind the Membership Agreement and do not use personal attacks to argue your point.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic Posted By: Lisa Simpson
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ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
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