Can anyone tell me about The Creature from Jekyll Island?

[TimCallahan]

I usually hang out on the religion and philosophy forum, so I don't know what's been said here about The Creature from Jekyll Island by Edward Griffin. The reason I'm asking about this is that some of my in-laws - including a lady of some intelligence, but one addicted to conspiracy theories - have been going on about it. These relatives have been urging me to read it.

I'm loath to wade through a bunch of verbiage - and run down footnotes to see if what the author quoted is for real or, as has often proved to be the case, it was quoted out of context - for what looks to be a long, convoluted text. As far as I can tell, the gist of it is the the Federal Reserve Board was created as an instrument of control by THEM.

In addition, from what I've heard, it's Griffin's assertion that the environmental movement was created by THEM as a means to control us.

What I've found out about Griffin is that he's a Bircher who thinks he's found Noah's Ark on Mt. Ararat. This, obviously, sends up all kinds of red flags, and my inclination is to dismiss him out of hand. However, if I do that, my relatives will come at me with the charge that I'm refusing to look at the evidence. I might add that the lady I referred to thinks the whole global warming thing is a hoax and conspiracy.

Can anyone give me some ammunition, or does Griffin have some valid points?

 

[Architect]

Well the Wiki entry on him doesn't exactly encourage confidence, I have to say.

 

[Myron Proudfoot]

well

Well, I'm a professional historian who specializes in the Progressive Era and Woodrow Wilson.* I think "Jekyll island" is complete and utter ********. The Federal Reserve Act was a compromise between the banks, who wanted as little oversight as possible, and those who wanted something just shy of nationalizing the banks. The resulting compromise was not popular with the bankers, but did get the support of William Jennings Bryan and his allies in Congress who were, to put it mildly, NOT big friends of Morgan and his allies.

If the Reserve disappointed those who wanted a heavier federal hand overseeing the banks, it wasn't because it was designed to give the banks free rein. It was designed to dilute the power of the New York banks. It did not do so nearly as much as its supporters hoped.

The commonly-seen Wilson quote about his later regretting creating the Federal Reserve is also total ********e.


* I have a Ph.D. in American history, teach the subject in a small university, and have published books, articles, and essays on Wilson and his era with reputable, peer-reviewed scholarly presses and journals. I other words, i have knowledge of the subject beyond watching Glen Beck and/or Wikipedia.

 

[Sceptic-PK]

I haven't read the text but the parts quoted by CTers are all nonsense. You could start here with a brief yet adequate debunking:

http://www.publiceye.org/conspire/flaherty/Federal_Reserve.html

and

http://www.publiceye.org/conspire/flaherty/flaherty1.html

 

[TimCallahan]

Thanks to all of you. I will definitely read the cited material more deeply. I had already read the Wiki entry on G. Edward Griffin. His belief in Noah's Ark, the fact that he was a Bircher and his advocacy of Laetrile, as I said earlier, sent up red flags. With respect to Laetrile, I have a personal interest: After having surgery, my father was told that they hadn't gotten all of the cancer, that it had metastasized, and, though he was largely symptom-free, he had about a year to live. He started taking Laetrile, driving down to Mexico once a week to get treatments. Had Laetrile been capable of doing what was claimed for it, it should have at least slowed the rate of cancer growth. It did nothing, and my father died on schedule.

The one question I still have is how Griffin figures that the Fed and its nefarious manipulators are behind the environmental movement.

 

[LightinDarkness]

The one question I still have is how Griffin figures that the Fed and its nefarious manipulators are behind the environmental movement.

That would be because hes not an actual scholar nor concerned with the truth, hes more concerned about finding conspiracies to sell to the eager CT masses that will lap up anything.

The reason why Federal Reserve conspiracy mythology is so popular is because central banking is complex and takes some time to really understand. Conspiracy theorists aren't exactly the top of the intellectual crop anyways, so for them simply discarding reality and relegating the Federal Reserve as a massive conspiracy is much easier.

The Creature from Jekyll Island is a masterpiece of conspiracy propaganda, and it will occasionally fool even the smarter people around you. Why? Because were in a recession right now, and people want answers. The answers are complex and provide little comfort (that the US economy goes in cycles, and recessions are normal), but The Creature from Jekyll Island provides them with what they want to hear: all of this is the fault of a malevolent conspiracy from the fed (as are all other economic problems).

 

[uk_dave]

* I have a Ph.D. in American history

So, what did you do with all that free time?

 

[Myron Proudfoot]

I haven't read the text but the parts quoted by CTers are all nonsense. You could start here with a brief yet adequate debunking:

http://www.publiceye.org/conspire/flaherty/Federal_Reserve.html

and

http://www.publiceye.org/conspire/flaherty/flaherty1.html

Those are very handy links, thank you. I am going to add them to my class material...

So, what did you do with all that free time?

I was going to get a Ph.D. in a hard science but I decided to go on dates with girls instead.


(I realized later my initial reply to the OP could easily be read as being pretty snotty. I apologize for that. I tried to make the point that I had some relevant expertise in the subject (specifically the history of the Fed being created) and did a poor job of it....)

 

[therival58]

The Jekyll Island meeting DID happen, just not according to the popular account.

Frank Vanderlip wrote about it in his biography From Farm Boy to Financier.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_A._Vanderlip

He spoke of meeting with Morgan, Rockefeller, Paul Warburg, and a few others while crafting the legislation.

It's a rare text to find but that's because only one edition was published in the 30's. If you manage to get a copy though, you will find that

The only online version (most of it, anyway) appears here by someone claiming to be Vanderlip's great grandson (go figure).
http://www.marketskeptics.com/2009/06/frank-vanderlip-and-creation-of-federal.html

Here's a direct quote from pages 210 and 214 of his book:

DESPITE my views about the value to society of greater publicity for the affairs of corporations, there was an occasion, near the close of 1910, when I was as secretive, indeed, as furtive as any conspirator. None of us who participated felt that we were conspirators; on the contrary we felt we were engaged in a patriotic work. We were trying to plan a mechanism that would correct the weaknesses of our banking system as revealed under the strains and pressures of the panic of 1907. I do not feel it is any exaggeration to speak of our secret expedition to Jekyl Island as the occasion of the actual conception of what eventually became the Federal Reserve System.

The servants and the train crew may have known the identities of one or two of us, but they did not know all, and it was the names of all printed together that would have made our mysterious journey significant in Washington, in Wall Street, even in London. Discovery, we knew, simply must not happen, or else all our time and effort would be wasted. If it were to be exposed publicly that our particular group had gotten together and written a banking bill, that bill would have no chance whatever of passage by Congress.

Yet, who was there in Congress who might have drafted a sound piece of legislation dealing with the purely banking problem with which we were concerned? Indeed, there were surprisingly few bankers, besides those of us who had been called together, who had given the special matters under consideration any thorough study whatever. Most bankers were reluctant to accept any change; George Baker was.

Anyone who wants to confirm the text can search it here
http://books.google.com/books?id=SB...ook_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CEQQ6AEwAA

So yes, it did happen, but according to Vanderlip's testimony in writing, the meeting was done in secret because there was massive anti-banking sentiment, and the people would go nuts if they found out bankers had crafted a banking bill in secret. But again, Vanderlip asserts the act was meant to stabilize the banking industry.

 

[LightinDarkness]

The Jekyll Island meeting DID happen, just not according to the popular account.

Frank Vanderlip wrote about it in his biography From Farm Boy to Financier.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_A._Vanderlip

He spoke of meeting with Morgan, Rockefeller, Paul Warburg, and a few others while crafting the legislation.

It's a rare text to find but that's because only one edition was published in the 30's. If you manage to get a copy though, you will find that

The only online version (most of it, anyway) appears here by someone claiming to be Vanderlip's great grandson (go figure).
http://www.marketskeptics.com/2009/06/frank-vanderlip-and-creation-of-federal.html

Here's a direct quote from pages 210 and 214 of his book:




Anyone who wants to confirm the text can search it here
http://books.google.com/books?id=SB...ook_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CEQQ6AEwAA

So yes, it did happen, but according to Vanderlip's testimony in writing, the meeting was done in secret because there was massive anti-banking sentiment, and the people would go nuts if they found out bankers had crafted a banking bill in secret. But again, Vanderlip asserts the act was meant to stabilize the banking industry.

I find it interesting the Wiki says:

Interestingly, in the final month and a half before the Act's enactment on December 23, 1913, Vanderlip's alternative plan for a Federal Reserve Act nearly derailed the one that President Wilson and the Democratic leadership were promoting.

It would then make perfect sense for Mr Vanderlip to over-dramatize and exaggerate the meeting to the negative, since his proposal ultimately failed.

 

[therival58]

I find it interesting the Wiki says:



It would then make perfect sense for Mr Vanderlip to over-dramatize and exaggerate the meeting to the negative, since his proposal ultimately failed.

does his tone sound that negative though? To me it reads almost the opposite.

 

[Myron Proudfoot]

Check out these essays showing how much Griffin distorts and lie sin his book. in other words, how much he acts like a typical CT head.

http://web.archive.org/web/20041011225116/http:/www.floodlight.org/theory/twist1.html

http://web.archive.org/web/20041011225921/http:/www.floodlight.org/theory/twist2.html

http://web.archive.org/web/20041011230407/www.floodlight.org/theory/twist3.html

http://www.shoah.plus.com/801/nwo/bank.html

http://web.archive.org/web/20021206141427/www.floodlight.org/theory/bofe2.html

I found these links at Crooks and Liars.

http://crooksandliars.com/david-neiwert/predicted-beck-goes-full-bore-birche

 

[carlitos]

I get references to this in a 9/11 Truth meetup email almost daily. A few weeks ago they claimed the author was going to be on Glen Beck. I figured it was spam, not realizing that Beck really is that paranoid. Looks like the interview took place.

Anyway, if you want to see the author of the book in action, along with chalkboards full o'crazy, here you go:

 

[ngc6205]

The Jekyll Island meeting DID happen, just not according to the popular account.

What many of the conspiracy theorists also fail to realize or accept is the meeting on Jekyll Island resulted in the Aldrich plan which was ultimately rejected. Parts of the Aldrich plan were incorporated into the Glass-Owen bill but the final result was different from the plan discussed on Jekyll Island.

The commonly-seen Wilson quote about his later regretting creating the Federal Reserve is also total ********e.

This is also correct. The commonly-seen Wilson quote starts with "I am a most unhappy man..." That first section of the quote cannot be found anywhere in Wilson's writings and is not attributed to him by any reliable source. The rest of the quote is actually copied word for word from two sections of Wilson's book, The New Freedom and are taken out of context. The New Freedom was published in 1913 before the passage of the Federal Reserve Act and it is actually a compilation of several of Wilson's campaign speeches during his campaign in 1912. The New Freedom is available at the Gutenberg Project at this link.

As for The Creature from Jekyll Island, whenever someone mentions it, I simply inform them that the author has a Bachelor's degree in communications and that he is not an economist, banker, lawyer, or historian. If you want to know about how a nuclear plant works, do you ask your doctor or do you ask a nuclear engineer? If you want to know about a particular item in law, do you ask your barber, or do you ask a lawyer? If you need your appendix removed, do you ask a doctor or do you ask your lawyer? If you want to know about the Federal Reserve, do you ask a person with a degree in communications, or do you ask an economist?

 

[therival58]

What many of the conspiracy theorists also fail to realize or accept is the meeting on Jekyll Island resulted in the Aldrich plan which was ultimately rejected. Parts of the Aldrich plan were incorporated into the Glass-Owen bill but the final result was different from the plan discussed on Jekyll Island.

Not according to Vanderlip

From Page 218

Now, although the Aldrich Federal Reserve plan was defeated when it bore the name of Aldrich, nevertheless its essential points were all contained in the plan that finally was adopted. It provided an organization to hold the reserves of all member banks and arranged that they would always be ready to relieve a member-bank under pressure by rediscounting loans that it held. The law as enacted provided for twelve banks instead of the one which the Aldrich plan would have created; but the intent of the law was to coordinate the twelve through the Federal Reserve Board in Washington, so that in effect they would operate as a Central Bank. There can be no question about it: Aldrich undoubtedly laid the essential, fundamental lines which finally took the form of the Federal Reserve Law.

But again, the parts in bold are quoted out of context. Nothing sinister sounding there.

 

[randman]

Not according to Vanderlip

From Page 218


But again, the parts in bold are quoted out of context. Nothing sinister sounding there.

That depends on whether you feel central banking and a central bank controlling the currency is sinister or not. Most of the founding fathers would find it sinister. Others may think it's a lot better than Congress handling such concerns of our economy.

 

[randman]

Well, I'm a professional historian who specializes in the Progressive Era and Woodrow Wilson.* I think "Jekyll island" is complete and utter ********. The Federal Reserve Act was a compromise between the banks, who wanted as little oversight as possible, and those who wanted something just shy of nationalizing the banks. The resulting compromise was not popular with the bankers, but did get the support of William Jennings Bryan and his allies in Congress who were, to put it mildly, NOT big friends of Morgan and his allies.

If the Reserve disappointed those who wanted a heavier federal hand overseeing the banks, it wasn't because it was designed to give the banks free rein. It was designed to dilute the power of the New York banks. It did not do so nearly as much as its supporters hoped.

The commonly-seen Wilson quote about his later regretting creating the Federal Reserve is also total ********e.


* I have a Ph.D. in American history, teach the subject in a small university, and have published books, articles, and essays on Wilson and his era with reputable, peer-reviewed scholarly presses and journals. I other words, i have knowledge of the subject beyond watching Glen Beck and/or Wikipedia.

I don't think the idea that some progressives liked the idea to be that comforting. I like Bryan but at the same time, creating a semi-private central bank did outsource a massive and key component of the economy.

Maybe that's better than Congress doing it and having a national bank as we did earlier? I don't know.

But Wilson was kind of scary as a president. We may well have come the closest to a police state as we ever have though Lincoln during the Civil War had a heavy hand in some states.

 

[Travis]

That depends on whether you feel central banking and a central bank controlling the currency is sinister or not. Most of the founding fathers would find it sinister. Others may think it's a lot better than Congress handling such concerns of our economy.

If the founding fathers thought it sinister then they would be wrong. And it is a hell of a lot better than leaving currency control either up to congress or the banks.

 

[fallout]

If the founding fathers thought it sinister then they would be wrong. And it is a hell of a lot better than leaving currency control either up to congress or the banks.

Are you saying you prefer money policy and control/issuance to be left to a unauditable , unaccountable private central bank, than to a congress that at least can be pressed by the taxpayers into transparency and accountability?

 

[fallout]

Can anyone give me some ammunition, or does Griffin have some valid points?

Anyone that pinpoints the deception of a central bank creation and establishment, like the FED, gotta have some valid points, even if by going over all the quibbles, we may find some bias and misquotations.