Brexit: the referendum

lobosrul said:
Please explain why you find that to be so? I see more and more non-American actors in US TV shows and Hollywood movies for example. And seemingly about every 3rd film I watch has central London in it.
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Exactly, they star in American shows and in HOLLYWOOD movies because England doesn't produce much very successfully on their own. The fact that you wrote this thinking it shows "English leads culturally" just demonstrates what I mean. For a country that's been around as long as England has you'd think they'd been leading in innovations in science, technology, medicine and culture. But they aren't.

This Brexit vote is an indication of how out of touch with reality they are. They really think they can go it alone? :boggled::boggled: Good luck

Another article pointing out the dire future for England.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/thin...university-students-are-being-sold-a-lie.html

Teenagers are illiterate, those with higher level education are often majoring in junk degrees that are utterly useless and will not help them get a job. We have the same gripe here in the States but the difference is, tax payers aren't paying for some liberal media illiterate's degree. We pay for them ourselves. ;)

So now that the country is turning how the heck is it going to work out when you have no real infrastructure and have basically alienated your allies by being arrogant xenophobic ijits!?

Only an Englishman would equivocate "culturally innovative" with "actors on television shows in Hollywood." Sigh.

When a sizeable chunk of today’s students leave, they discover they’ve been sold a pup. Graduate with a Bachelor’s in a soft subject from a low-rent uni and you jump a couple of places in the line for a call-centre job. You’d have been far better off spending the last three years working because by now, you’d probably be a manager in the call centre and you’d have a decent car, not £40,000 in student loans.

The taxpayer would have been better off, too, as tuition fees do not represent the whole cost of the course and people in work pay tax. It’s a dreadful lose-lose situation.

So, what are we going to do?

We should start by facing the facts. When people are worrying about our health service and worrying about not paying teachers enough, we cannot afford the luxury of sending 50% of our people to university. We also have a huge dearth of technically qualified people. People that industry (you know, that stuff we’re supposed to be encouraging) desperately needs.
We also have a higher percentage of people in tertiary education than both the OECD and EU average – and more than Germany and the US. Yet we are way down the league tables when it comes to numeracy and literacy amongst 16 -24 year olds; the OECD has England 22nd for literacy out of 24 countries.

The solution’s pretty obvious, isn’t it? Admit that our great educational leap forward hasn’t worked very well. Recognise we’re not delivering what the economy wants and that we’re deluding large numbers of university-goers - and decide that we’re going to stop.
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truethat said:
We'll see. Like I said, I may have to eat crow but I think it's exaggerated in the US and it's not in England. I think most Americans are horrified by Trump. But who knows, maybe on election day we'll get a shock as well. But it is true that America leads the world culturally. Wish others would make more relevant modern contributions instead of expecting to be applauded for the past.
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Everything is larger than life in the US; promotion is its unique contribution to the modern world. The dark arts of persuasion and publicity refined like nowhere else on Earth.

Who needs torture?

What's more shocking than the great unwashed voting against their own interests is the vacuousness of our British elite. It can't be blamed on comprehensivisation or deprived childhoods, and it's a stretch to blame it on the EU. What has happened to all the people of stature that our elite education system has for so long produced?

Are they standing off-stage, ready to step in and "Save the Nation" when they've created enough chaos? Who can say. I for one would welcome our new Whig overlords.
 
truethat said:
Exactly, they star in American shows and in HOLLYWOOD movies because England doesn't produce much very successfully on their own. The fact that you wrote this thinking it shows "English leads culturally" just demonstrates what I mean. For a country that's been around as long as England has you'd think they'd been leading in innovations in science, technology, medicine and culture. But they aren't.

This Brexit vote is an indication of how out of touch with reality they are. They really think they can go it alone? :boggled::boggled: Good luck
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Yeah no one is watching British TV these days... :rolleyes: They work over here because of the much larger market and higher pay checks.

I think you may want to do some investiGoogling on the pharma industry in the UK.

I'm proud to be American... but jesus the silly ignorant chest-thumping is too much sometimes.

ETA:
Only an Englishman would equivocate "culturally innovative" with "actors on television shows in Hollywood." Sigh.
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I've never even been to the UK. I live in Albuquerque (that's part of the USA FYI, says so on our license plates).
 
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MikeG said:
There is some connection you can dream up between the general educational performance of British teens and the referendum result. Wonderful. How clever of you to just find some excuse to tell us all how thick and racist we all are despite our accents.



Marvelous. Americans are the best, Brits are ill educated racists. Such a cogent argument. I can't find any holes in that.
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The fact that you can't figure out what having a good education and being literate have to do with the referendum results is a sad example of exactly what I'm talking about. Thank you for proving my point.

Why so sensitive? You guys bash the US all the time mercilessly

I'm sorry. England is really the bestest. ;) They lead culturally with lots of things like Harry Potter. :thumbsup::D
 
truethat said:
The fact that you can't figure out what having a good education and being literate have to do with the referendum results is a sad example of exactly what I'm talking about. Thank you for proving my point.

Why so sensitive? You guys bash the US all the time mercilessly

I'm sorry. England is really the bestest. ;) They lead culturally with lots of things like Harry Potter. :thumbsup::D
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I'll ask again, what do you mean the US leads the world culturally? Please explain.
 
truethat said:
This vote underscores what I've been pointing out for years about the English public. The world has been basically sold the idea that they are sophisticated, educated thinkers. However this has not been true for decades. I remember years ago, just naturally having the impression that if someone had an English accent, they were probably smarter or more educated than the average American. But over the years in conversations I've been shocked to find the opposite is true. Most encounters I've had with the English is that they are very similar to Trump supporters in America. Uneducated except in their own narrow focus in the world, uneducated in the true sense ...meaning they might "have a degree" but they are basically illiterate and racist, xenophobic arrogant people.

Just a few weeks ago I was talking to a typical Englishman who kept arguing with me that Christopher Columbus actually landed in America and how typical Americans don't know history.

It's strange how it's shifted over the years. English teenagers are now considered the most illiterate in the entire developed world. So we can only imagine what the future is bringing.

I love this vote because it shows people what I've been saying for years. It's time to stop letting the English piggy back off the reputation of the past and actually be accountable in the here and now.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/e...-developed-world-report-reveals-a6841166.html
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I agree with some provisos.
There isn't a typical Englishman. There is as much difference between a Cockney and a Scouse or Geordie and Cornishman as there is between an Englishman and a Scot.

There are no more 'sophisticated educated thinkers' in England than anywhere else.
There are however a lot of Stephen Fry types who think they are sophisticated and educated because they went to the right school or university.

As for racists and xenophobes, most people I know dislike most foreigners. For example, I don't know anyone apart from myself that likes Americans. I don't know anyone apart from myself that has actually met or knows an American. There just seems to be a resentment against them for a whole load of different reasons including WW2, fast food, tourists, perceived arrogance, Gulf War and their dominant position in Nato among others.
Similarly I don't know anyone that has met a German, Frenchman or Italian. They are still all disliked for a variety of reasons.
 
truethat said:
.........Teenagers are illiterate, those with higher level education are often majoring in junk degrees that are utterly useless and will not help them get a job. We have the same gripe here in the States but the difference is, tax payers aren't paying for some liberal media illiterate's degree. We pay for them ourselves. ;).......
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Before you make yourself look even more ridiculous, do yourself a favour. Do some research. You'll maybe discover that we have some of the highest university fees in the world, and those are paid for by the students, not the state.

I've just had a couple of kids get through the education system, and guess what? They're not illiterate. One is a teacher, and one is doing a PhD in Biology. They're both multi-lingual (how's your Latin, by the way?). Please tell me again how our kids are useless, and how superior the USA is. We all find it so amusing.
 
truethat said:
The fact that you can't figure out what having a good education and being literate have to do with the referendum results is a sad example of exactly what I'm talking about. Thank you for proving my point........
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No, for you to prove your point via my comment you would have to show that I am poorly educated. Do you really want to go along that path? You'll lose.
 
lobosrul said:
Yeah no one is watching British TV these days... :rolleyes: They work over here because of the much larger market and higher pay checks.

I think you may want to do some investiGoogling on the pharma industry in the UK.

I'm proud to be American... but jesus the silly ignorant chest-thumping is too much sometimes.

ETA:

I've never even been to the UK. I live in Albuquerque (that's part of the USA FYI, says so on our license plates).
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The pharma industry is ONE area that I would say is really strong in England and Ireland. But again, it's not innovative.

This really isn't about "chest thumping" it's about reality. For the last few decades we've been watching as Europe turns and drags the US over the coals for everything but oddly can't seem to get their own countries together.

I once made the suggestion of looking at a Pacific Centric map instead of a Eurocentric Map. It's quite fascinating when you do. Because you see where the world innovations are coming from are all areas around the Pacific and Europe is off to the side with Africa which is also struggling.

But this "standing on reputation of history" is the opposite of innovation. So while the US has been building and innovating itself into a position of World Power in about 200 years. Europe is still standing around thinking it's great because it USED to do stuff that was important.

Germany seems to have figured out how to move forward. But this vote in Brexit is a clear example of what English laziness, arrogance and illiteracy have created. And I've been predicting it for years. So I'm sorry if it's coming across "mean." I thought all was far in politics. People seem to rip Americans apart in political forums. Are we supposed to tip toe in here because people can't handle the truth?

Here's a Pacific Centric Map China, Japan, India, Malaysia The United States, etc THOSE are the countries that are innovating.


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/74/NewZealandEmbassies-PacificCentric.png
 
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truethat said:
The fact that you can't figure out what having a good education and being literate have to do with the referendum results is a sad example of exactly what I'm talking about. Thank you for proving my point..........
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Oh, and in your rush to show we're stupid, you managed to achieve the polar opposite effect with your example: British youngsters overwhelmingly voted to Remain in the EU. You know, those thick, ill-educated, illiterate youngsters doing junk degrees and so on...........yep, they did the very opposite of what you posited. Those stupid kids voted to remain. You see that big hole in your foot with the blood spurting out? It'll be something to do with the gun in your hand.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
... most people I know dislike most foreigners ... I don't know anyone apart from myself that has actually met or knows an American ... I don't know anyone that has met a German, Frenchman or Italian.
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Is this some kind of joke? What on earth?
 
I work over in Durham snd yes I eould say it's exactly the same in Durham among the actual population not the Students st 5he University who tend to be disliked by the locals as much as they dislike foreigners.
 
MikeG said:
Oh, and in your rush to show we're stupid, you managed to achieve the polar opposite effect with your example: British youngsters overwhelmingly voted to Remain in the EU. You know, those thick, ill-educated, illiterate youngsters doing junk degrees and so on...........yep, they did the very opposite of what you posited. Those stupid kids voted to remain. You see that big hole in your foot with the blood spurting out? It'll be something to do with the gun in your hand.
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Um you need to read your data better. The entire infrastruction is collapsing because you are outnumbered and those 'junk degree idiots" do not have the skills to fix the problem. Period the end. The future.

I specifically compared it to Trump Supporters because we have them here in the US as well. The difference is that they don't outnumber those that are rational in this country. (That's why I said I might have to eat crow this election if he wins. But I don't think he will win because he's an idiot.)

So again. While you have spent all your energy wagging your finger and whinging about how Americans are idiots and how Trump should be banned in your country, you totally IGNORED the fact that your own people were even worse and your country is getting destroyed because of it.

Still don't get it right? It's just burning your butt that you can't act superior to an American any more. I'd be laughing my ass off if I didn't feel so bad for your country.
 
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Craig B said:
Is this some kind of joke? What on earth?
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No, I am deadly serious, my mother not only dislikes Americans she will actaly change the channel or put the TV off if there are any Amerucan actors or shows on.
I know a lit of ex services people from WW2 vintage up to the present day including ex shipmates from my years in the Navy. Not one of them has any respect for any US forces. I know first Gulf War vets that despise the US Air Force.
 
3point14 said:
I'm hoping. What I'm actually hoping for is a whole new outlook for the British Isles in respect of Europe and that this absolute *************** of a situation might bring a little light on the lies told about Europe by the national press (The press who I believe should carry a large dose of blame (yes, blame) for where we are now.
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The Remainers should have held the Leavers' feet to the fire over them but they were too fixed on their prepared strategy.

I think it's very clear that no Leaver is going to get what they thought they were voting for out of actually leaving, and not by a long shot. In the meantime every bit of bad economic news can be put down to the Leave vote.

(Edit - weird, the forum doesn't like the word cluster if followed by asterisks.)
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Try clusterhump. I find it serves. :cool:
 
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