Cont: Brexit: Now What? Part 5

[ceptimus]

It's just the language of "not knowing what it wants" is wrong.

Say I want to own a Ferrari and a Porsche. I know what I want and I also know that I'm unlikely to ever get that. Still, someone saying that I don't know what I want would be wrong.

 

[Garrison]

It's just the language of "not knowing what it wants" is wrong.

And yet the evidence of the actions of May and co. say the exact opposite.

 

[quadraginta]

I think it's unfair to say that the UK government doesn't know what it wants. What it has always wanted is all the benefits of belonging to the EU but without any of the perceived drawbacks - so it would like an end to freedom of movement, no more payments to the EU, the ability to ignore EU law and EU courts, the right to make independent trade deals with countries outside the EU, but most everything else remaining the same as at present.

<snip>

So you agree. They want all the benefits of being a member (of the club ) with none of the obligations or shared burden of operation.

But somehow it is always the EU that is being unreasonable about the exit negotiations.

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

It's just the language of "not knowing what it wants" is wrong.

Say I want to own a Ferrari and a Porsche. I know what I want and I also know that I'm unlikely to ever get that. Still, someone saying that I don't know what I want would be wrong.

The Leave position is more like wanting to own a Ferrari and a unicorn. While everyone in Northern Ireland gets a Porsche and a perpetual motion device.

 

[Francesca R]

The UK has blinked every time.

The EU has blinked also. The required amount of blinking on both sides (well all three sides if one considers the UK to have at least two sides) has happened to keep a soft girlie Brexit in the frame. It's not as if the EU has been immovable, or as if the Brexiteer group has forced any of their issues to a brink.

 

[Francesca R]

So you agree. They want all the benefits of being a member (of the club ) with none of the obligations or shared burden of operation.

Why do you think "free movement" is a burden?

 

[Information Analyst]

Why do you think "free movement" is a burden?

It's certainly perceived as one by Leaver supporters, although obviously only in the sense of free movement for foreigners. Brits can and should have free movement, because we're not foreigners.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

Have they never heard of car sharing?

I don't the the concept of sharing is particularly natural to them.

 

[ceptimus]

Why do you think "free movement" is a burden?

Why do you think that every country outside the EU doesn't allow it?
Why do think the EU itself doesn't allow it from countries outside the EU?
Answer those two questions and you'll have the answer to your own question.

 

[fagin]

Because they are not the EU?
Because they are not in the EU?

I still don't have the answer - could you assist.

 

[Pixel42]

Is the free movement of people across county and country boundaries within the UK a burden?
Is the free movement of people across state boundaries in the USA a burden?

 

[Francesca R]

Why do you think that every country outside the EU doesn't allow it?
Why do think the EU itself doesn't allow it from countries outside the EU?
Answer those two questions and you'll have the answer to your own question.

Do you think it is?

Why?

 

[Francesca R]

It's certainly perceived as one by Leaver supporters, although obviously only in the sense of free movement for foreigners. Brits can and should have free movement, because we're not foreigners.

Do you think free movement in the EU is a burden?

 

[Amazer]

Is the free movement of people across county and country boundaries within the UK a burden?
Is the free movement of people across state boundaries in the USA a burden?

Depends on whom you ask this question.
I know from my discussions with American conservatives that free movement is sometimes considered a burden because it allows liberals to move to places where conservatives live.. and they don't appreciate the changing landscape that comes with it.

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

 

[Pixel42]

There are economic benefits to free movement of people across boundaries, both to individuals and to the constituents of the area within which it is allowed. There are also downsides, but the opposition to it is in my experience mostly due to prejudice.

Being able to live and work anywhere within the EU provides opportunities to people in every EU country, including Britain. My young great nephews and nieces are about to have their choices drastically reduced, thanks to the wilful ignorance and blind prejudice of their own grandparents.

 

[Henri McPhee]

There is some more recent information about Arron banks, the Brexiteer, at this website:

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/brex...es/ar-AAzJmSc?MSCC=1531040109&ocid=spartandhp

Brexit’s biggest funder, Arron Banks, met the Russian ambassador at least 11 times in the run-up to the EU referendum and in the two months beyond, documents seen by the Observer suggest – seven more times than he has admitted. The same documents suggest the Russian embassy extended a further four invitations but it is not known if they were accepted.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Jacob Rees-Mogg says there isn't enough detail in yesterday's Cabinet agreement for him to say whether he supports or opposes it.

Apparently there was enough detail in "leave the EU" for everyone to make an informed decision.

Boris strongly criticised the PM and her Brexit plans before voting for them. That's him covered both ways then. If they work out he voted for them, if they don't he objected but 'cabinet responsibility' and all that.

 

[Francesca R]

Sucks to not be in the cabinet then

 

[Mr Fied]

Why do you think "free movement" is a burden?

I think the main argument against free movement was the access to benefits in the UK.

It was perceived (by some) that everyone was coming here not to work but to claim benefits.

I must admit that I think there should be some sort of qualifying period before benefits are allowed to be claimed. Whether that be time in the country or amount of time paying into the system.

When I lived in Spain you had to pay into the system before you qualified to take something out. So I can't see why we couldn't do that in the UK.

 

[Aber]

When I lived in Spain you had to pay into the system before you qualified to take something out. So I can't see why we couldn't do that in the UK.

EU require same rules are applied to all EU citizens - do you want to exclude all under 21s from benefits?