Blagojevich's Crime: Honesty

[jberryhill]

Have YOU ever heard of freedom of speech and do you have any idea of what it legally means? Ever heard of conspiracy?

Conspiracy requires two things:

1. An agreement to commit an illegal act.

2. An act in furtherance of the conspiracy.

Example 1:

You and I are sitting around and I say, "How about we rob the bank tomorrow? We'll get some ski masks, go in, and demand the money?" You say, "Okay, let's do that. I'll run out tomorrow morning and pick up the masks." I say, "Great. See you tomorrow."

In this example, there has been an agreement to commit an illegal act. There has not been the offense of conspiracy, because there has not been an act in furtherance thereof.

Example 2:

Same as example 1. At 9 the next morning, you go to the store and buy some ski masks.

In this example, then there are the elements of conspiracy. Even though it is legal to purchase ski masks, the purchase of the masks is an act in furtherance of the conspiracy. Hence, you have both elements of (a) the agreement to commit an illegal act, and (b) an act in furtherance of the agreement.

I don't know much about the Blago allegations. From what I understand, he was nailed actually threatening the Tribune editors. Concerning the senate seat, there are conversations of him complaining that nobody is offering him anything in exchange, and him specifying things he'd like. Are these conversations with potential nominees, or other people?

As far as "horse trading" being illegal, consider the following examples.

Example 1

You see a woman on the street, and you'd like to sleep with her. You duck into a flower shop, buy flowers and give them to her with your phone number. She calls your number. You ask her out. You buy dinner and a movie. Subsequent dates go well. Eventually, you propose marriage. You buy her a diamond ring. You get married. She then sleeps with you.

Example 2

You see a woman on the street, and you'd like to sleep with her. You say, "Hey, I'll give you $100 to sleep with me."

Example 1 is an unexceptional biography. Example 2 is the crime of soliciting prostitution.

Blagojevich seems not to understand the distinction.

 

[Skeptic Guy]

The NY Times had an article today that seemed to suggest that the prosecutors may have acted too quickly. No money had changed hands, no deals were consumated, so the worst charges may not stick. I don't know, but I really can't believe that the slime will get off.

 

[Galileo]

The NY Times had an article today that seemed to suggest that the prosecutors may have acted too quickly. No money had changed hands, no deals were consumated, so the worst charges may not stick. I don't know, but I really can't believe that the slime will get off.

Unlike Bush & Obama, where money has changed hands.

 

[Galileo]

The NY Times had an article today that seemed to suggest that the prosecutors may have acted too quickly. No money had changed hands, no deals were consumated, so the worst charges may not stick. I don't know, but I really can't believe that the slime will get off.

I'm sorry, the JREF forum has already declared Blago guilty.

 

[Alferd_Packer]

Actually, in a way, I have to agree. The concept of Quid Pro Quo is essential to the political process.

BloJo's problem was that he was trying to set himself up for after he left politics.

 

[Skeptic Guy]

Oh, I think he's guilty, it's just that politics is a dirty business. The thing that BloJo may have working against him is that he's pissed off a bunch of people.

 

[Drudgewire]

Actually, in a way, I have to agree. The concept of Quid Pro Quo is essential to the political process.

Even if that's the case, the argument here is equivilant to saying "the only difference between a run of the mill murderer and a guy who has the corpses of seventy-nine corpses he ran through a woodchipper and made soup out of is the woodchipper guy is more honest about it."

 

[Tricky]

I don't think that there is any doubt in anyone's mind here that such deals have been done in the past. I don't think there is any doubt that such deals still go on today. I don't think that there is any doubt that BloJo (love than nickname) would have gotten away with it if he hadn't been caught on digital media.

And yet, it is still a criminal act. We should not let the fact that we do not catch all criminals restrain us from punishing the ones we do catch. Are we too outraged about this? No. We're not outraged enough. We need to send a clear message that such behavior it so far beyond the bounds of acceptable that it deserves a lifetime banishment from politics. Maybe that will make others who haven't been caught a little more wary of doing such things.

Maybe it is a little unfair that BloJo is suffering simply for getting caught when others go scot free. Too bad. You break the law, you take your chance.

 

[Drudgewire]

corpses of seventy-nine corpses

Way to proofread you ing idiot.

 

[Tricky]

Way to proofread you ing idiot. http://www.lethalwrestling.com/upload/doh.gif

I'll edit it for you if you'll make me a Senator.

 

[Drudgewire]

I'll edit it for you if you'll make me a Senator.

I'm more from the NY school of politics than Chicago's.

Will a four thousand dollar hooker do?

 

[Tricky]

I'm more from the NY school of politics than Chicago's.

Will a four thousand dollar hooker do?

I'm more from the Idaho school of politics. Just let me take a wide stance in one of your public restrooms.

 

[Cicero]

I'm more from the NY school of politics than Chicago's.

Will a four thousand dollar hooker do?

Better 4 hookers for $1k each. Variety is the spice of life.

 

[Drudgewire]

I'm more from the Idaho school of politics. Just let me take a wide stance in one of your public restrooms.

*taps stall twice to signal approval of these terms*

 

[Travis]

So Blago should not be prosecuted because politics is viewed with abject cynicism? That's the strangest defense I've ever heard.

 

[Tricky]

So Blago should not be prosecuted because politics is viewed with abject cynicism? That's the strangest defense I've ever heard.

LOL. That's not particularly strange around here. I'm always hearing that something is no big deal because (Bush/Clinton/Reagan/Carter/Lincoln) did worse.

 

[Drudgewire]

LOL. That's not particularly strange around here. I'm always hearing that something is no big deal because (Bush/Clinton/Reagan/Carter/Lincoln) did worse.

Lincoln being the most relevant, because we all know there's no such thing as an honest politician from Illinois.














*Yes I know... it's still better than being a heart murmur away from "President Palin."

 

[Tricky]

Lincoln being the most relevant, because we all know there's no such thing as an honest politician from Illinois.

True, but Abe was really from Kentucky.

 

[Drudgewire]

True, but Abe was really from Kentucky.

I ALMOST mentioned that, except:

A) His early political career was in Illinois, and
B) I'd already used the asterisk to make the Palin joke

 

[gdnp]

You just defend political corruption as usual. Doesn't surprise me in the least.

You seem to be the one who is defending political corruption. Everyone else here is saying Blago should be prosecuted.

Oh, and make up your mind. The does not go with the phrase "doesn't surprise me in the least". It is an expression of great surprise.