• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Being a racist while having a soft skull

tyr_13 said:
Someone mentioned that being like blaming a rape victim for what they were wearing. This really shouldn't need explained but that's abject nonsense. The 'fight or flight' mechanisms activated by such provocations is simply nowhere near as controllable as lust.
Click to expand...

<insert side-eye smiley here>

Are you looking at the same animal kingdom that I am? I'm not so certain as you that the reproductive urge is lesser in strength than fight-or-flight... especially as the urge to reproduce is very often the direct cause of fighting.

That said, I think it's entirely reasonable to expect that humans should be able to use their big brains to override their base instincts on both topics. Unfortunately, both rape and violence remain struggles.
 
Belz... said:
It doesn't matter that they are not. They are still expected consequences.

Say I go to a biker's bar and start insulting someone's mom or girlfriend or whatever... sure, they can't legally hurt me, but wouldn't you expect me to come back from there... scathed in some way?
Click to expand...

:boggled: I don't agree that "killed" is an expected outcome for "says something mean".

What part of Canada are you from again? Seriously, you seem to live in a much more violent part of the country than the namby-pamby BC that I've visited...
 
plague311 said:
In my world? No, not at all. Maybe in yours, but as I just posted our worlds are obviously very different.

If someone walked up to me I didn't know and said, "Hey you fat piece of ****" I'd probably ignore them thinking they were crazy.

If someone like an uncle, or a neighbor I've known for years, or someone I was familiar with came up and screamed that in my face I'd lay them out flat. I don't care what random people say, I do put a very miniscule amount of stock in what people I know say.
Click to expand...

Interesting perspective. Aside from me being incredibly disinclined to engage in violence, let along be the aggressor... I can also agree with the sentiment. Random strangers calling me really, really bad things is a lot less hurtful than someone I know and respect calling me a much less bad thing.
 
Mumbles said:
All possible. But truthfully, I'm guessing he just wanted to hit the guy because the guy called him the N word. And in truth, he probably could have called the cops on the old man for trespassing. But for whatever reason, they both decided to fight, and now the old guy is dead, and Pujols will likely end up in prison for manslaughter.
Click to expand...


If I lived in America, and I was black, then for reasons that are obvious to anyone paying attention, I would be very, very hesitant about calling the cops for anything.
 
Emily's Cat said:
:boggled: I don't agree that "killed" is an expected outcome for "says something mean".
Click to expand...

Pissing off people who are bigger, stronger and more aggressive than you sure carries that risk. Why take the chance?

What part of Canada are you from again? Seriously, you seem to live in a much more violent part of the country than the namby-pamby BC that I've visited...
Click to expand...

What are you talking about? You think bikers are different here than over the border?

Or maybe you're deliberately missing the point.
 
smartcooky said:
If I lived in America, and I was black, then for reasons that are obvious to anyone paying attention, I would be very, very hesitant about calling the cops for anything.
Click to expand...

I live in America, and am black, and don't like dealing with the cops ever.

But the truth is still that that one time, he'd likely be safe. Most cops never draw a gun on duty. And for ****'s sake I should be able to call them and expect them to act like professional. If I'm the manager, and I say he's trespassing, they should remove him from the premises, right?
 
Mumbles said:
I live in America, and am black, and don't like dealing with the cops ever.

But the truth is still that that one time, he'd likely be safe. Most cops never draw a gun on duty. And for ****'s sake I should be able to call them and expect them to act like professional. If I'm the manager, and I say he's trespassing, they should remove him from the premises, right?
Click to expand...

Absolutely. But expecting the police to behave in an acceptable fashion is well beyond the clear ability of many officers and departments. Hopefully the manager of a donut shop would have a clear idea how blatantly racist the local cops are, and thus have an informed opinion on the matter unlike online conjecture.
 
Emily's Cat said:
Well that explains it. You're not a real Canadian, you're *French*!!!! :p

ETA: Total curiosity - do you speak French? And is the French spoken in Quebec different from the French spoken in France in any significant way?
Click to expand...

Effectivement, je parle français. C'est ma langue maternelle. Et oui on a un vocabulaire et un accent assez différent de celui de France ou d'autres pays francophones.
 
Mumbles said:
I live in America, and am black, and don't like dealing with the cops ever.

But the truth is still that that one time, he'd likely be safe. Most cops never draw a gun on duty. And for ****'s sake I should be able to call them and expect them to act like professional. If I'm the manager, and I say he's trespassing, they should remove him from the premises, right?
Click to expand...

Pretty much agree.

Media makes it really difficult to keep things in perspective. The reality is that *most* police are good people, and that *most* interactions with the cops aren't a problem for *most* black people. But... there are enough cops that exhibit discriminatory behaviors that it justifies black people being skeptical of the cops as a group. Our justice system is skewed enough that there's a disproportionately negative affect on black people in aggregate. Those are things that definitely need to be addressed, and they deserve some solid undivided attention. Just maybe not blowing it all the way out of proportion.

Very similarly, *most* males are good people, and *most* interactions that females have with males are completely fine and innocuous. But... there are enough males that engage in predatory and dangerous behavior toward females that it justifies females being skeptical of males as a group. Our society is skewed enough that there's a disproportionately negative affect on females in aggregate, and that deserves some attention too. But again, we don't have to blow it all out of proportion.
 
Belz... said:
Effectivement, je parle français. C'est ma langue maternelle. Et oui on a un vocabulaire et un accent assez différent de celui de France ou d'autres pays francophones.
Click to expand...

:D No hablo frances.

On the other hand, I really do enjoy how easy it is to get the general gist of written romance languages, even if I don't speak them!

So, not a perfect translation, but "I effectively speak French. It's my primary language. It has a vocabulary and accent that is different from that spoken in France or other French-speaking places."
 
Emily's Cat said:
:D No hablo frances.

On the other hand, I really do enjoy how easy it is to get the general gist of written romance languages, even if I don't speak them!

So, not a perfect translation, but "I effectively speak French. It's my primary language. It has a vocabulary and accent that is different from that spoken in France or other French-speaking places."
Click to expand...

The correct translation would be:

I indeed speak French. It's my first language. And yes, it has a different vocabulary and accent from those in France or other French-speaking places.

Close enough.

If you want me to woo you with my beautiful French accent, say so at any time.
 
It looks like we have a bit more clarity into the events that happened on that day, if you can trust floridapolitics.com. I did a bit of looking around but didn't find much about their reputation.

It goes into some details that we were wondering about, but doesn't list the word the old man called Pujols. They still don't name the old man.

TL; DR version. The man was in the drive thru, it said he was asked to leave "by staff" but came in and Pujols told a staff member to call the cops. They argue, old man says something racist, Pujols steps out from behind the counter and tells him not to say that again, the old man says it again to his face, and he takes one to the jaw.
 
plague311 said:
It looks like we have a bit more clarity into the events that happened on that day, if you can trust floridapolitics.com. I did a bit of looking around but didn't find much about their reputation.

It goes into some details that we were wondering about, but doesn't list the word the old man called Pujols. They still don't name the old man.

TL; DR version. The man was in the drive thru, it said he was asked to leave "by staff" but came in and Pujols told a staff member to call the cops. They argue, old man says something racist, Pujols steps out from behind the counter and tells him not to say that again, the old man says it again to his face, and he takes one to the jaw.
Click to expand...

You sure about the hilited? I see that it says Pujols remained on the opposite side of the counter, and that upon saying the first slur, "Pujols then closer (sic) to the man and warned him not to repeat the slur". Sounds more like Pujols leaned closer, not actually crossed the counter. If he did, that sounds more threatening and premeditated.
 
Thermal said:
You sure about the hilited? I see that it says Pujols remained on the opposite side of the counter, and that upon saying the first slur, "Pujols then closer (sic) to the man and warned him not to repeat the slur". Sounds more like Pujols leaned closer, not actually crossed the counter. If he did, that sounds more threatening and premeditated.
Click to expand...

I had read in another article that he came out from behind the counter, but I won't argue with it either way.

I don't think it shows any difference at all. There's no way it was premeditated whether he was in front of or behind the counter. Premeditation would require him to have planned it, and there was no way he planned to have this guy show up, be an ******* out of nowhere, and use a racial slur. That's why Pujols is getting charged with manslaughter and not any of the murders.
 
Yeah, this is the article I read previously:

During the argument, police say the man called Pujols a racial slur. The state attorney's office says Pujols slowly walked through the counter's swinging door and came face-to-face with the man, "hands at his side," warning him not to say the slur again.
Click to expand...

It couldn't have been premeditated as Pujols had no intentions of the old man dying. Per the prosecutors:

The state attorney's office says the manslaughter charge is appropriate "because Pujols intentionally punched the victim without legal justification, and the victim died as a result."
Click to expand...

Sucks for both sides.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom