KingMerv,
Well then here is a question:
Why define yourself as an atheist at all if it is identical in every way to agnosticism?
Surely doing so leads to confusion.
Several reasons.
First of all, not everybody defines those terms as you do, and under their definitions, there may be important differences.
For example, I would define agnosticism to mean simply that I do not claim to know whether or not there are any gods. I would define atheism to be simply the absence of theism, meaning that anybody who is not a theist is, by definition, an atheist. And I would define theism to be the belief in a particular type of god or gods, namely ones which are defined to be sentient beings of some sort.
A key point here being that agnosticism has to do with what you
know, and theism/atheism have to do with what you
believe.
By my definitions, I am
both an agnostic
and an atheist. Likewise, by the definitions I am using, it is possible to be an agnostic theist, a non-agnostic theist, and a non-agnostic atheist.
I would consider either of the non-agnostic positions to be inconsistent with the evidence. I would consider agnostic theism to simply be irrational.
One must also consider what is meant by "god". For example, if you limit the term god to refer only to personal gods (gods which are defined to be sentient beings), then my definition of atheism would be a lack of belief in gods. But there are, of course, other definitions of god out there. My usage of the terms "theism" and "atheism" simply do not refer to such concepts at all. I have no control over what other people choose or do not choose to call "gods", so I cannot possibly define my terms in a general way that will apply to all possible definitions of "god".
Many people who call themselves atheists, however, are referring to very specific conceptions of god. Such people may very well claim that they know these gods do not exist, but that does not mean that they are claiming to have knowledge of non-existence of anything that somebody might choose to call a god. For example, with respect to many of the various gods worshipped by man throughout history, I would claim knowledge that such beings do not exist. But I cannot make any knowledge claims about conceptions of god which I have never even heard of.
That said, under your definitions I would be neither an agnostic nor an atheist. Let's look at your definitions:
Agnosticism-The belief that there can be no proof either that God exists or that God does not exist.
This depends on your definition of god. There are some definitions of god which are simply logically self-contradictory. They don't really have any relevance, since it is meaningless to talk about such things existing or not existing. There are other definitions of god which we can certainly have evidence of the non-existence of. For example, just about any god worshipped by any religion throughout history. It is not clear what you mean by proof here, but if you mean compelling evidence, then agnosticism with respect to gods like Zeus and Yahweh is simply false. If you mean formal logical proof, then your very definition of agnosticism is nonsensical, because there is no such thing as a formal logical proof for claims about reality.
Incidentally, the classical notion of agnosticism is that the existence of god is
unknowable, not that it is
unprovable. That said, while it is clear that for some conceptions of god, his existence is unknowable, there are other conceptions of god for which this is not the case. So if agnosticism is supposed to refer to all conceptions of god, then it is untenable. If it is referring to some specific conception of god, then it depends entirely on which conception of god it is referring to.
Atheism- The doctrine that there is no God or gods.
This is simply incoherent. Without stipulating which definitions of the word "god" are being referred to, it is meaningless. If I call my cat "god", does that make atheism false? How about if I choose to refer to the totality of existence as "god"? Or if I choose to refer to the laws of nature as "god"?
This is why I define atheism to simply be the absence of theism. None of the above conceptions of god qualify as being theistic.
Dr. Stupid
