Atheism Plus/Free Thought Blogs (FTB)

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Diogenes said:
I think he tops himself by 27. Is that a Godwin's Law moment?

Someone does call it out by 179.

Defended in 181.
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Neither of those captions are funny nor do they make any sense. I think that's the biggest sin of all.
 
adamwho said:
You are surprised that a bunch of yes-men are not calling out their leader? Are you sure that you are an Aplusser?
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I doubt even Myers is now, from that last APlus thread posted , he dropped in early on when it got set up and made only 4 posts. They fawned over him as their "leader" and since even he seems to be distancing himself.
 
The start of the speech is what shocked me:
Atheists are now a community
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Must... find... religion...

Solipsism sounds attractive. Unless there's... a community of solipsists out there already?
 
Mr. Scott said:
The A+ forum has indeed made it clear it welcomes people with mental problems.

I have a policy to not debate with people who are mentally ill, so reserve the right to not engage in debate with defenders of A+ in this thread.
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You reserved a right that you always had against everyone. What was the point of saying it?
 
Foolmewunz said:
Now, I have a lot of empathy for people with weight/obesity problems. My mom carried far too much weight for most of her adult life and was basically crippled from about the age of sixty.
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I hope you meant to say "differently abled". Hater.

Foolmewunz said:
Obese people do not go out a lot, that's a fact. They have taken to shopping on line in a big way. Rather than railing about the stores oppressing you, rail at your fellow plus-sizers for not getting out and supporting the stores that were offering you the products you needed. This is like all the people who shop at Walmart for the lower prices and then piss and moan about the store on the high street (that they haven't been into more than twice year for the last decade) being run out of business by Big Retail.
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Stop fatsplaining.
 
Lorentz said:
The start of the speech is what shocked me:


Must... find... religion...

Solipsism sounds attractive. Unless there's... a community of solipsists out there already?
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Yes but we don't believe in you.
 
Mr.Samsa,

Let me reiterate the sentiment that has already been expressed, that you do a very good job of explaining some of the reasoning behind A+.
This does not of course, imply that I agree with any of it. I'd like to ask a few more questions.

Mr.Samsa said:
An opinion on a social issue is "valuated" only in the sense that people who try to direct or inform experiences which they have not had are presenting a problematic perspective. If the topic is affirmative action, for example, and you say that you don't personally know what it's like to be black and trying to find a job but you have dealt with understanding discrimination as a child, then your opinion on how blacks should handle or feel about the affirmative action situation will be quickly, and correctly, dismissed. .
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Whenever someone has an opinion on how someone else should feel, that should of course be dismissed. I have the impression it's a strawman, as I rarely if ever witness people opining on how others should feel. Ethnicity, gender or other handicaps don't even enter into it.

The other aspect you mention in the example, is how they "should handle it". Here I disagree entirely, assuming that the purpose of the "handling" is to achieve a desired outcome. If the handling includes shouting. sulking, or throwing household items, then for me that comes under the heading of how they should "feel" (unless the thrown items injure someone). Personal experience can't IMO trump rational analysis there, so ones membership of whichever group shouldn't be a factor.

Mr.Samsa said:
The point is that the viewpoints are evaluated on their own merits. They aren't rejected because you're white (or whatever, depending on the situation). Rather it's because you're white (or whatever, again) that your experiences lead you to a viewpoint that lacks merit.
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This is a novel concept for me. A viewpoint is not objectively correct or incorrect, applicable or inapplicable, but it lacks "merit"? How do I get myself some of this merit so I can win discussions on Internet forums?

On a more serious note, what DO you mean by "merit" here? Can you give an example?

Mr.Samsa said:
But often they won't because privilege blindness makes it difficult/impossible to see how much of the picture you're actually missing.
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Everyone has privilege with regards to everyone else (admittedly, Bill Gates' lack of privilege may be a bit limited). Everyone has unique experiences that nobody else has had. To enable communication in spite of this enormous hurdle, people talk about their experiences. Some have even written books about them, so I can have some sense of what if was like to be in the Belgian trenches of WW1. In the case of being black/female/transgendered/paranoid/depressed and the like, there are whole bookcases out there to read. Beyond that, we are social creatures, we are conditioned to empathise, to have a sense for what others are feeling. There are some who lack this ability, or refuse to use it, but most people actually listen to others and mentally put themselves in their shoes if you give them a chance. On A+, this chance is not given to anyone, regardless of which groups they belong to.

To paraphrase: experience is not magic!

Mr.Samsa said:
It is not a minor thing when we consider the context: a safe space where minorities have gathered to avoid facing the discrimination they have to deal with in their daily lives.
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Wait a moment please. We are communicating on the Internet, where I can be black, white, Inuit, a 13 year-old hermaphrodite in a wheelchair, or a hyperintelligent shade of the colour blue, for all anyone knows. Various minorities often experience some discrimination in their lives, yes. But on the Internet? If you don't want to be discriminated against for being blue, be pink. It's easy to not be discriminated against here and you don't need a special forum for it.

Of course if you want to share yourself, your personal problems, beliefs and frustrations, then that does rather take away from your anonymity. So if you were to claim "to share their identity and their feelings without being discriminated against", that would make more sense to me. Is that though, what you meant? And is that a need they have that goes beyond sharing with their Facebook friends?

Mr.Samsa said:
To ruin someone's safe space by just having to make a stupid joke is pretty serious.
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To verbally abuse people as is routine on A+ is pretty serious. It is to me, at least. It's the Pharyngula comments section squared; one of the most unsafe spaces I could find myself in online. YMMV.

Thanks in advance if you choose to respond.
 
Lorentz said:
The start of the speech is what shocked me:

Must... find... religion...

Solipsism sounds attractive. Unless there's... a community of solipsists out there already?
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I was considering a multilevel company selling time shares to solipsists. I could tell them that they would live there exclusively.
 
Rrose Selavy said:
adamwho said:
You are surprised that a bunch of yes-men are not calling out their leader? Are you sure that you are an Aplusser?
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I doubt even Myers is now, from that last APlus thread posted , he dropped in early on when it got set up and made only 4 posts. They fawned over him as their "leader" and since even he seems to be distancing himself.
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I've brought this up a couple times also, Rose. Sure doesn't look good for the only A+ forum to be virtually ignored by Myers. Far as I know even on his site he only indirectly referred to it once in what appeared to be a critical remark, and his total absence at A+ since last October's 4 short chatty posts is telling.

@Qwints and Mr. Samsa: Here's a challenge for you, and a way to provide evidence that A+ is as you envision it. Try starting a thread asking why PZ hasn't ever returned to make even a short few posts or in any way been openly supportive of the forums; anywhere! I triple dog dare ya!

It won't happen. I think you both know no matter how diplomatically you framed the OP-you know, you are asking in hope someone can provide links to where he has been supportive elsewhere and you just missed it, w/e-it would not be appreciated by the guardians of the sacred secret forum. But aren't you a little bit curious about why such a vaunted guru like PZ has distanced himself from the only forum just for A+?

Can anyone tell me if any of the more notable SJW's have ever made any positive public statements about the A+ forums? Is Setar, ceepolk, et al the A team there? :boggled:
 
recursive prophet said:
I've brought this up a couple times also, Rose. Sure doesn't look good for the only A+ forum to be virtually ignored by Myers. Far as I know even on his site he only indirectly referred to it once in what appeared to be a critical remark, and his total absence at A+ since last October's 4 short chatty posts is telling....
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But...apparently that forum isn't the movement. You can find more information about the movement on....er...hm...no idea where.
 
recursive prophet said:
Try starting a thread asking why PZ hasn't ever returned to make even a short few posts or in any way been openly supportive of the forums; anywhere! I triple dog dare ya!
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I don't see the point of such a post. It's not like people on the forum could answer the question.

recursive prophet said:
Can anyone tell me if any of the more notable SJW's have ever made any positive public statements about the A+ forums?
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Not to my knowledge. The most "notable" person whose comment I've heard about the forums is Matt Dillahunty. I wouldn't categorize his statements about the forums as positive.
 
qwints said:
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Not to my knowledge. The most "notable" person whose comment I've heard about the forums is Matt Dillahunty. I wouldn't categorize his statements about the forums as positive.
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Though he expected a completely different outcome and that he would be able to report positively.
 
Before I forget, PZ and Dawkins used to be close. They went to a screening of EXPELLED together, that absurd anti-evolution flick. I can't imagine them being chummy now that PZ is a poster boy for A+ and Dawkins for rich old white man rape apology privilege. Anyone know the skinny on how those two are getting along?

From Lying For Jesus

Not a man to hide behind a false name or false beard, PZ openly sported his own [name at the preview screening for EXPELLED]. Like many other people, including his daughter and Kristine Harley (see her Amused Muse website), PZ took advantage of the generous offer to let him book guests in as well, and then kindly invited me to be one of them.
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Iain Banks has a novel which features a solipsist gang. Or guerrilla army. Or something like that. Anyway, their leader's authority is based on the general conviction that he is currently the strongest fragment of the gang's collective personality. He occasionally has to fight off coup attempts from gang members who believe their own will is stronger. His (their?) motivation for helping the protagonist is the conviction that she represents some as-yet unresolved psychological conflict, and aiding her on her quest will ultimately improve them all.
 
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