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Are the Markets all Manipulated or not?

as I have posted before in other threads, it is the successful (pre) identification OF this manipulation that has allowed me to crack this.
Idiot! If you had kept quiet about your discovery then you could have continued to make money out of it.

But no, you just had to tell us about it. Now it's only a matter of time before the banks find out that you're on to them, and then we they will crush you like a bug! :eye-poppi

the same group of big banks who have and are proving they will manipulate anything they can, for money, drive 70% of the world's currency trading volume between them.
When you have 70% of the trading volume between you, you are the market. This should not come as a surprise...

that would leave us living in an era of undisguised, real-world conspiracy, in which the prices of currencies, commodities like gold and silver, even interest rates and the value of money itself, can be and may already have been dictated from above.
Sadly that era is already upon us. The other day I took some cash into the bank, and they would only give me face value for it! :rolleyes:
 
Idiot! If you had kept quiet about your discovery then you could have continued to make money out of it.

But no, you just had to tell us about it. Now it's only a matter of time before the banks find out that you're on to them, and then we they will crush you like a bug! :eye-poppi

When you have 70% of the trading volume between you, you are the market. This should not come as a surprise...

fortunately, the reason it has always been like this, is the reason it will never change. they have to trade like they do, because of their volume.

a few thousand individuals who can "see" but even then not always get it right is zero threat to them, its the cost of doing business. its the other 95% they're fleecing, large specs, your employers, your pensions funds etc etc.

and they were doing it before I was ever around and will still be doing it after I'm gone.
 
All? No there are plenty of markets too insignificant for anyone to get around to manipulating. For example various obscure chemical precursors (although said markets tend to be highly dysfunctional for other reasons). Larger markets probably have someone at least trying to manipulate them but then its a question of does a tenth of 1% change in value matter to you that much? Sure larger manipulation does happen (Enron comes to mind) but that is separate from Libor type messes.
 
:rolleyes: once again. this has exactly what to do with the subject at hand?

I am presenting evidence for debate. you are making smart alec quips about something you literally know next to nothing about.

The answer is no. The Jews....errr...I mean the "banks" are not manipulating the "markets". Whatever that means.

It would be illegal to do so. One wonders why the author or the gold bugs don't call the police or the SEC or some other regulatory or enforcement agency. I bet I know why.
 
It would be illegal to do so.

When you are dealing with people who can afford the best lawyers in existance "illegal" doesn't mean as much as you might expect.

One wonders why the author or the gold bugs don't call the police or the SEC or some other regulatory or enforcement agency. I bet I know why.

Err there is already an ongoing investigations into ISDA which is what the opening article is about. There is also an ongoing investigation into the Libor fixing mess. On a practical level there is a limit to what regulatory or enforcement agencies can do in such cases since conventional civil damages payouts would probably destroy the banking system.
 
The answer is no. The "banks" are not manipulating the "markets". Whatever that means.


because you say so?

It would be illegal to do so. One wonders why the author or the gold bugs don't call the police or the SEC or some other regulatory or enforcement agency. I bet I know why.


patently ridiculous answer. lets lay it out a bit more formalized, top down.


[*]1. BIS Central Bank of Central Banks. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank_for_International_Settlements

- regulates Forex banks. sets daily and weekly range limits on them for pairs. (cant have them actually trashing economies with their nonsense, can we?)

-advertises "currency & gold market interventions in its brochure (P17)

adr.png



[*]2. Central Banks whose very job has become manipulating interest rates and bond markets. They have also taken to "investing" in stock markets globally.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-...n-equities-as-low-rates-kill-bond-yields.html

[*]3. Forex banks - personal "evidence" as above.

a clear explanation of "market cycle" ie accumulation, mark-up, distribution and mark down can be found here for those not familiar enough with basic market principles to comment (Scrut)

Roger Ramjets said:
When you have 70% of the trading volume between you, you are the market. This should not come as a surprise...
Market Size $4trillion per day, $1000+trillion per year - Forex Marketmakers trade for their own accounts as well as processing business flow for customers. whose priorities do you think come first?

How a market maker makes money http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_maker

A market maker aims to make money by buying stock at a lower price than the price at which they sell it, or selling the stock at a higher price than they buy it back. Ordinarily, they can make money in both rising or falling markets, by taking advantage of the difference between "bid" and "offer" prices.

Thomas Murray - Why FX is not a market

(Bio - Thomas Murray has since 1999 provided a subscription-based guide to the local market rules for trading clearing and settling securities transactions in over 100 markets around the world. The guide is supported by daily updated news flashes on developments in any market which have an impact on risk.

Thomas Murray also provides public and private ratings of global custodian banks, domestic custodian banks, sub-custodian banks and CSDs, and risk ratings of the entire market infrastructures in different countries around the world. The global custodian, domestic custodian and sub-custodian bank ratings, which date back to 1997, enable institutional investors to assess the operational as well as the counterparty risk to which a particular bank exposes them.

In short, whatever the type of customer (corporate, institutional or retail) and however they approach the market (single bank, multi-bank platform, inter-dealer broker, retail aggregator) it is almost always a bank on the other side of the trade. It is also virtually impossible to engage in a foreign exchange transaction without engaging with a bank directly or appointing one as agent.
One reason banks dominate is that foreign exchange means changing money, and only banks hold money in the conveniently exchangeable form of demand deposits. But it owes more to marsupial relationships between governments (which impose national currencies) and banks (which governments underwrite). Without national currencies, there is no need for foreign exchange.

..

The only time banks take a serious risk in the foreign exchange markets is when they take positions in pursuit of speculative profits. One classic instance is short-selling a currency expected to devalue. Even then, their counterparties are likely as not central banks seeking to defend a particular parity, almost always with inadequate reserves, so the risk of loss is not large.

Other classic instances of position-taking include momentum trades (in which the bank bets that the weight of money will push a currency in a particular direction) and the carry trade. Carry trades vary, but all are ultimately bets that a higher-yielding currency will not depreciate enough against the lower-costing currency in which the trade is funded to offset the interest rate differential.

Position-taking is of course entirely voluntary. Indeed, it is not even necessary to be a bank to place bets on the direction of currency values. Hedge funds do it all the time. Nor is it necessary to be a bank to engage in arbitrage trading, where the trades are by definition riskless, since the dealer sells in the second market what is bought in the first.

The truth is that, in the foreign exchange market as in any other financial market, banks are almost always better informed than their counterparts. This information asymmetry, as economists describe it, is a principal reason why banks are able both to extract enormous profits from foreign exchange, and hardly ever make large losses.


[*]4. LIBOR manipulation - global interest rate benchmark. CT actual manipulation Forex banks guilty of manipulating rates with CB knowledge


[*]5. ISDAfix derivatives global benchmark rates - investigation underway



[*]6. JPMorgan Whale trade - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_JPMorgan_Chase_trading_loss - clear market manipulation by the biggest TBTF at highest levels.

Bruno Iksil a/k/a The London Whale, Voldemort - Credit derivatives trader

“Everyone knows The Whale, whenever there was a big move in CDS markets, you knew it was the Whale”[38]

a/k/a "The Caveman" "for pursuing trades that rivals sometimes thought were overly aggressive but often led to huge profits"[39]


[*]7. Gold - clear evidence of price manipulation. if you disagree, please explain why in particular. I would draw you to figure 4.

Figure 4 is a cross-plot of the cumulative intraday gold price change against the cumulative overnight gold price change.

The chart shows that the cumulative amount that gold has declined between the AM Fix and the PM Fix at any time in the last nine years displays a linear correlation with the cumulative amount that gold has risen from the PM Fix to the following AM fix for the same period. The correlation coefficient R2 is 0.95 which is very close to a perfect correlation of 1.0.

This shows that someone is consistently selling down the PM Fix and the amount of the cumulative sell down is almost perfectly linearly proportional to the cumulative amount by which gold trades up overnight. That can not happen by chance.


CTFC investigating Gold Fix - http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324077704578358381575462340.html ("fix" has been an inside joke for those that know for many years now)


U.S. regulators are scrutinizing whether prices are being manipulated in the world's largest gold market, according to people familiar with the situation.

The Commodity Futures Trading Commission is examining the setting of prices in London, in which a handful of banks meet twice daily and set the spot price for a troy ounce of physical gold, the people said.

The CFTC is looking at issues including whether the setting of prices for gold—and the smaller silver market—is transparent. No formal investigation has been opened, the people said.


transparent my backside, it is the most secretive and opaque market in the whole world.

[*]8. Silver http://plus.cnbc.com/rssvideosearch/action/player/id/3000145988/code/cnbcplayershare


Bart Chiltern CTFC
As an investigation of the silver market by the top U.S. commodity regulator entered a third year, a member of the Commodity Futures Trading Commission said today there have been “repeated attempts” to influence prices.

There have been fraudulent efforts to persuade and deviously control that price,” said Commissioner Bart Chilton at a hearing today in Washington, alleging there have been violations of the Commodity Exchange Act. “Any such violation of the law in this regard should be prosecuted,”

The five-member commission began investigating allegations of price manipulation in the silver futures market in September 2008.


Over and over and over again for years he said that kind of thing, then in 2013.. case dropped. :rolleyes: Yep, nothing to see here, move along..

I could go on and on, it is endemic at every level, and my contention that it is all one big manipulated farce from the very top down.
 
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lulz. obviously. you dont much like evidence do you?

It's unfortunate that a person can come into a skeptics discussion forum, drop nothing but fallacies and "witty" comments, and try to discourage discussion of the topic, yet no amount of reporting them will do anything.

But hey it keeps his post count climbing.
 
the "banks" are not manipulating the "markets".
Banks are corporations and like all corporations, they are in the business of amassing as much money as possible.

Interest rate and other liquidity swaps are not necessarily illegitimate since banks deal in debts and need to take some protective measures. Other derivative dealings are definitely more questionable.

It would be illegal to do so.
:dl:
 
It's unfortunate that a person can come into a skeptics discussion forum, drop nothing but fallacies and "witty" comments, and try to discourage discussion of the topic, yet no amount of reporting them will do anything.

But hey it keeps his post count climbing.

I often think its an auto-spambot, we use automated article spinners that make more sense frankly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_spinning
 
Everybody knows that the dice are loaded
Everybody rolls with their fingers crossed
Everybody knows that the war is over
Everbody knows the good guys lost

Everybody knows the fight was fixed
The poor stay poor and the rich get rich
That's how it goes
And everybody knows
 
I will read the post later but from what I have read is that financial markets are rigged so that the biggest players move their shares first. That means they get the best deal while the smaller players move when the stocks are at their highest. This book was written before etrade and the like so that might have changed.
 
So I decided a couple/few years ago to just ride piggyback on their schemes. It has been quite profitable for me, so I am sure it has been an astronomical boon for the bigger fish.

Although I can't stand Matt Taibbi personally (whenever I see him, he strikes me as a high functioning Asperger's boy), he is quite often dead on target. I have not read this article yet, but look forward to perusing it this weekend.

Whenever you see him? What, you socialize with often?
 
The market is definitely rigged, and anyone who actively trades, as I do, knows it. It is common knowledge. It is also common knowledge the government is complicit and impotent at the same time.

I resigned myself years ago that this was here to stay, and that the crooks are operating openly without fear of prosecution. The whistleblowers have been holding the hands of the regulators for years. Look here, see that. Look over here, here is what is going on. And yet the feds do absolutely nothing despite these gift-wrapped evidence bombs.

So I decided a couple/few years ago to just ride piggyback on their schemes. It has been quite profitable for me, so I am sure it has been an astronomical boon for the bigger fish.


Allow me to call your bluff.

You haven't been "riding piggyback" on anything, nor has it been "quite profitable" for you.

Why do I know this? Because I know how the market works, and I know this kind of advantage, when it exists, is limited and extremely short-lived. It's the nature of the market.

Your claims are false.
 

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