Robin
Penultimate Amazing
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2004
- Messages
- 14,971
That is not what "through a glass, darkly" means. It does mean "pessimistically", it means seeing very unclearly.
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena, Pronouns: he/him
Yes, it's from Storm. This is one of the best versions:
Produced by Tracy King, once a member of this very forum.
Produced by Tracy King, once a member of this very forum.
quadraginta
Becoming Beth
How about a humorless fundamentalist?
Or several of them, since they rarely seem to travel alone?
Parsman
Muse
I'm an Atheist and a supporter of Dunfermline Athletic FC. You have to be an optimist to be the later, and believing they are a good soccer team probably takes up all the belief my body and brain can hold!
(Just in case the OP responds)
This question, or variations on it is a frequently on heard from atheists by theists. The ego does rebel against the notion that there will be a permanent death, and to some this may make all the actions of life futile. To be fair though some religious doctrines can be interpreted in this way as well, making all of earthly existence meaningless and almost created a longing for death to be reunited with a spiritual existence again.
Buddhism is often given as an example of spirituality that does not require an active God. I would also suggest that the OP look into Epicureanism if one wants a philosophy from the western tradition that provides some comfort in the face of pain and ultimate nonbeing.
As an atheist myself I see no reason why atheists are more pessimistic (I guess this is what you mean by ”seeing the world though a glass darkly”). My mood is more directly affected by material things such as whether I am hungry, tired, or thirsty, than any existential angst. It took me a long time to really accept that for all I know the material world is all we get, and once I stop functioning in this material world, I stop being. But once this is accepted, it is a source of calm relief actually. Wanting to be responsible for an existence for all eternity makes me feel tired just contemplating it. I just have the responsibility of making the world better for those around me in the here and now.
That is enough Scorpion.
Any more is just your subconscious making irrational demands that are silly once you unravel their physical purpose and meaning.
This question, or variations on it is a frequently on heard from atheists by theists. The ego does rebel against the notion that there will be a permanent death, and to some this may make all the actions of life futile. To be fair though some religious doctrines can be interpreted in this way as well, making all of earthly existence meaningless and almost created a longing for death to be reunited with a spiritual existence again.
Buddhism is often given as an example of spirituality that does not require an active God. I would also suggest that the OP look into Epicureanism if one wants a philosophy from the western tradition that provides some comfort in the face of pain and ultimate nonbeing.
As an atheist myself I see no reason why atheists are more pessimistic (I guess this is what you mean by ”seeing the world though a glass darkly”). My mood is more directly affected by material things such as whether I am hungry, tired, or thirsty, than any existential angst. It took me a long time to really accept that for all I know the material world is all we get, and once I stop functioning in this material world, I stop being. But once this is accepted, it is a source of calm relief actually. Wanting to be responsible for an existence for all eternity makes me feel tired just contemplating it. I just have the responsibility of making the world better for those around me in the here and now.
That is enough Scorpion.
Any more is just your subconscious making irrational demands that are silly once you unravel their physical purpose and meaning.
winter salt
Critical Thinker
- Joined
- May 24, 2017
- Messages
- 484
When I was religious I thought I should not have children for this corrupt world would very likely rob their eternal happiness by making them infidels,
and when I became irreligious/infidel I thought I should still not have children for other reasons.
I guess I'm not very upbeat about life.
Although I'm known to be pessimistic and humorous at the same time.
Also when I was religious I focused a lot on doomsday stuff..
Now I can't wait for WW3.
and when I became irreligious/infidel I thought I should still not have children for other reasons.
I guess I'm not very upbeat about life.
Although I'm known to be pessimistic and humorous at the same time.
Also when I was religious I focused a lot on doomsday stuff..
Now I can't wait for WW3.
Athyrio
Hipster Doofus
Tkingdoll? Wow, I had no idea.
Still a member, but no posts for over 8 years. Pity.
Hellbound
Merchant of Doom
I refer to myself as an optimistic pessimist.
I always expect the absolute worst in every situation.
That way, even in a worst case scenario, at least I saw it coming! Everything else is a pleasant surprise.
For example, I'm totally stoked because an airplane didn't fall on my house and kill me in my sleep last night. I'm already a step ahead!
I always expect the absolute worst in every situation.
That way, even in a worst case scenario, at least I saw it coming! Everything else is a pleasant surprise.
For example, I'm totally stoked because an airplane didn't fall on my house and kill me in my sleep last night. I'm already a step ahead!
wasapi
Penultimate Amazing
- Joined
- May 27, 2008
- Messages
- 17,585
Interesting, that is exactly the way I see things as well!
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
Nope. I'm an optimist despite some fairly challenging episodes in my life. I enjoy my work and always have a smile and a friendly word for everyone I meet.
Don't need any god or spirits for that.
Back in the 2008 crash, I was left without a home and ca. 1 million in debt. Yet here i am today, no debt and own my own home outright. No god/s did that. No spirits did that. I did it. The hard way. Without any imaginary spooks to assist me.
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
Oh and before I forget, YOU believe it is wrong to mitigate suffering at all. Because karma.
Scorpion
Illuminator
- Joined
- Feb 28, 2013
- Messages
- 3,812
I have never said we should not help the suffering. Nor that we should inflict it.
I have said suffering forces growth and change in the soul.
I have said all souls will ultimately be redeemed, and there is no hellfire.
We progress from one lifetime to the next and face karma from past lives.
The spirits I have listened to speaking through trance mediums have said we can help ourselves, and we do not always have to suffer to learn. We can also work for the good, and settle our karma by service to others instead of doing it all the hard way.
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Dude if you need an excuse to be a psychopath just say so.
"Suffering is okay because it makes you stronger" makes you the bad guy from Saw, not better then the rest of us.
abaddon
Penultimate Amazing
Correct.
Correct.
Correct
And there is your blunder. Morally, in your system of belief, you are obliged to NOT mitigate suffering at all because to do so would interfere with someone else's opportunity to grow and change and develop spiritually. Who are you to interfere with someone else's spiritual journey? By mitigating anyone's suffering, you might well be consigning them to have to repeat an incarnation to learn the lessons that you stopped by your intervention. Thus, in your system of belief, the correct and moral course of action is to let people suffer. It is, after all, their karma and something they must do in this life or the next, or the next, or the next. Are you going to intervene and condemn a suffering person to have to repeat the same suffering because you stopped it this time around the reincarnation merry-go-round? Or are you going to just let them suffer because they are "learning" valuable lessons?
This is where your crank belief fails. You, by your system, are morally bound to NOT helping the suffering because that hinders their "spiritual" development as a "soul".
Are you going to help some homeless person in need? According to your belief, you shouldn't because that would hinder their upward progression "spiritually".
It could be that you will help such a person. But that would be you looking out for your karma at the expense of the homeless persons karma. Just a tad narcissistic, no? You are OK and the devil take the hindmost, right?
Well perhaps if the religious stopped creating so much suffering in the first place atheists would see the world in a better light?
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
Credulous nonsense sheathed in new age lingo.
Why is it that every individual who has ever explained to me about their 'past lives" was some shining something-or-other rather than a farmer, builder or stable hand?
I've met "Warriors," "Queens," "Courtesans," etc. Sounds like too many chiefs and not enough Indians, but where's the fun in having a past life if it wasn't glamorous?
Scorpion
Illuminator
- Joined
- Feb 28, 2013
- Messages
- 3,812
Have you ever had feelings of having been somewhere before that you know you had not been to, or things like that ?
I have, when I was a boy I visited the maritime museum, and I came to a cabinet with Nelsons sword in it. I seemed to recognise it and I felt a flood of emotion. I do not think I was Nelson, but I think I might have been a sailor on his ship. Because his crew all loved him like a father.
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
I've had just about every "feeling" a human can experience but never assumed that those feelings were caused by invisible forces, spirits, ghosts, gods or angels.
I've had a pretty good time living my life as is w/o any imaginary friends or lives.