Archeologly proves the Bible?

[amb]

The Roman historian Tacitus said Jesus received the ultimate penalty from Pontius Pilate. And all four gospels said Jesus was put in a tomb. We know from the evidence that 1st century tombs existed outside a gate of the wall of Jerusalem. It is rational to conclude that Jesus was put in one of those first century tombs that we know existed. Also, as famous as Jesus was and as fast as Christianity spread all over the Roman Empire certainly some people in the 3rd century knew where Jesus died. If you travel on the East coast of the US there are historical markers all over the place of things that happened hundreds of years ago.

There are far to many contradictions in the gospels to piece together any viable story. The birth in Bethlehem is not regarded as history by all biblical scholars who are honest.
The flight from Egypt is the same, the slaughter of the inoccents, the number of women at the tomb, it goes on and on. The gospels have between them thousands of contradictions. How on Earth can anyone take this story and proclaim it as the word of god? More like the word of a mental patient I think.

 

[amb]

And whaddya know, the "Oxford Archaeological Guide to the Holy Land" was written by a Catholic priest.

So what else is new?

 

[eccles]

"The flight from Egypt"
That bring up in interesting question. How did the Holy Family fly to Egypt? El-AL Airlines flown by Pontius the Pilot.

em hotep

 

[joobz]

I doubt he called it complete nonsense do you have a link.

Here's the link:

Very true. Posts aren't threads. But if a thread drifts into discussing a topic, is it wrong to describe the thread by the new topic being discussed?

Actually, don't answer that. It's not important.

What's important here is that this biblical scholar clearly questions Luke's historical accuracy. Indeed, I believe he used the term "complete nonsense" in describing Luke's census story.

Time 5:57-7:00
Here's a transcript of that interview.

Because I'm feeling nice, I'll post a transcript of the interview:


O'Connor: Luke made a mistake. Ah, then howcome he was born in Bethlehem. So he has to invent the census to get him to Bethlehem.
Interviewer:So, how do you know that it was Luke that made the Mistake?
O'Connor:Because the census was nonsense. The census we’re told was for the Roman Empire. This wasn’t part of the Roman Empire, this was an independent Jewish kingdom. It's complete nonsense. But Luke had to try and find a motive why a heavily pregnant woman would travel the length of the country. He made a guess and he got it wrong.

But I do not think you actually want to look at this. Last time I provided this you said:

I don't want a video, I have dial up and it takes a long time to download on my computer. Surely there must be a written source somewhere and not a video.

So, I wonder if you will actually look at that evidence now.

Well, I doubt you will, so here's a link to a report by O'Connor where he goes into more detail regarding why the census story is a lie. (although he doesn't use the word lie as he is a priest and wouldn't want to be so negative toward the bible.

Indeed. Dr. O'Conner wrote about that as well and agrees that that is another critical failing in the Census story.
http://www.bib-arch.org/online-exclusives/nativity-03.asp

 

[Akhenaten]

"The flight from Egypt"
That bring up in interesting question. How did the Holy Family fly to Egypt? El-AL Airlines flown by Pontius the Pilot.

em hotep

 

[eccles]

I have to read that O'Connor article thorougly, but a glance at it showed that o"Connor missed one point:

"The first Christian emperor, Constantine, had the original Church of the Nativity constructed above the site."

He was ordered by his boss, his WIFE to have that church built.

em hotep

 

[eccles]

Love it Akenanten. I thought Herod was wating on delivery of more ground-to-air-missiles. He must have got them on the black market.

em hotep

 

[amb]

"The flight from Egypt"
That bring up in interesting question. How did the Holy Family fly to Egypt? El-AL Airlines flown by Pontius the Pilot.

em hotep

Very funny eccles. The flight from Egypt is a figure of speech.
But true. I would sugest an Iranian airways. Imagine the turmoil as the captain welcomes his passengers aboard? ''Welcome aboard, infidels.''

 

[joobz]

I have to read that O'Connor article thorougly, but a glance at it showed that o"Connor missed one point:

"The first Christian emperor, Constantine, had the original Church of the Nativity constructed above the site."

He was ordered by his boss, his WIFE to have that church built.

em hotep

I think you mean his Mother (not wife), Helen.

 

[eccles]

I think you mean his Mother (not wife), Helen.

Thank you, I stand corrected. His Mother Helen

 

[amb]

Very powerful kook was Constantine's mother. Didn't she also discover the tomb of Jeebus?

 

[Akhenaten]

Very powerful kook was Constantine's mother. Didn't she also discover the tomb of Jeebus?

Probably a few times.

Jerusalem was still rebuilding from the destruction of Hadrian, a previous emperor, who had built a temple to Venus over the site of Jesus's tomb, near Calvary.

According to legend, Helena entered the temple with Bishop Macarius, ordered the temple torn down and chose a site to begin excavating, which led to the recovery of three different crosses. A woman from Jerusalem, who was already at the point of death from a certain disease, was brought; when the woman touched the first and second crosses, her condition did not change, but when she touched the third and final cross she suddenly recovered and Helena declared the cross with which the woman had been touched to be the True Cross.


On the site of discovery, she built the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, while she continued building churches on every Holy site.

wikipedia


Holy Barnum and Bailey, Batman!

 

[zooterkin]

According to legend, Helena entered the temple with Bishop Macarius, ordered the temple torn down and chose a site to begin excavating, which led to the recovery of three different crosses. A woman from Jerusalem, who was already at the point of death from a certain disease, was brought; when the woman touched the first and second crosses, her condition did not change, but when she touched the third and final cross she suddenly recovered and Helena declared the cross with which the woman had been touched to be the True Cross.

So, Jesus was supposed to have been buried with the cross?

 

[dafydd]

when i read in those Jesus this and God that, Bible there Gospel here threads i always have to ask myself.

are we really in the Year 2009?

We are, but Doc is about a thousand years behind us.Keep 'em coming Doc,funniest thread ever.

 

[eccles]

I love how the excerpt quoted says "According to legend". So much of Christianity fits that description.

em hotep

 

[RoboTimbo]

In your mind what's the strongest argument for the divinity of Jesus.

The bible. Sad, isn't it?

 

[zooterkin]

So, I wonder if you will actually look at that evidence now.

He somehow avoided it last time, for no good reason I could see (except that it disagreed with his point). I thought this was familiar ground.

Well, I doubt you will, so here's a link to a report by O'Connor where he goes into more detail regarding why the census story is a lie. (although he doesn't use the word lie as he is a priest and wouldn't want to be so negative toward the bible.

That's the same one I posted above, found with a couple of seconds googling (obviously, that's beyond DOC). The second link I gave is an independent report of the TV show you gave the transcript of, which has the quote of 'nonsense'. Again, found very quickly in google.

So, DOC, are you going to admit that a Catholic priest accepts that Luke made things up?

 

[joobz]

He somehow avoided it last time, for no good reason I could see (except that it disagreed with his point). I thought this was familiar ground.



That's the same one I posted above, found with a couple of seconds googling (obviously, that's beyond DOC). The second link I gave is an independent report of the TV show you gave the transcript of, which has the quote of 'nonsense'. Again, found very quickly in google.

So, DOC, are you going to admit that a Catholic priest accepts that Luke made things up?

Sorry if I repeated your posting. I was just flabbergasted by DOC's ability to claim doubt on something he refused to look at last time.

 

[Akhenaten]

So, Jesus was supposed to have been buried with the cross?

They couldn't get those damned nails out, so . . .

 

[zooterkin]

Sorry if I repeated your posting. I was just flabbergasted by DOC's ability to claim doubt on something he refused to look at last time.

Oh, no, no apology needed at all. You did all the work last time, and it's good to point out yet another example where DOC is choosing to ignore or forget that his assertions have been demolished before.

My point was that it was trivially easy to find the references he was asking for. Probably took less time than it took him to type the question. I think the only thing I really added was an independent confirmation that your transcription was accurate (though that was easily checked if anyone doubted, simply by watching the video).