AP source not who he claimed to be

[varwoche]

So does anybody else here notice the lack of newsworthy big nasties happening in Iraq since the doubts about AP's coverage came up?

Er, no.

12/07/06 Iraq violence claims 10 members of U.S. military
12/08/06 23 die in Iraq violence
12/09/06 Suicide car bomb kills seven in Iraq
12/09/06 Soldier Among 5 Killed By Iraq Bomb
12/12/06 Iraq Bomb Attack Targeting Laborers Kills Up to 63
12/13/06 Bomb at Bus Stop Kills 11 in Baghdad
12/13/06 At least 55 die in Iraq violence
12/18/06 Bomb kills 5 in Baghdad
12/18/06 Dozens taken at Red Crescent in Baghdad

This is a hasty sampling of the past 10 days -- there's more where this came from.

 

[The Fool]

Oh yeah? What steps are those? Have they been able to explain why the Iraqi DOI doesn't seem to know who he his?

Who is the Iraqi source for this claim? What is thier name? Can I have a picture of them with thier family? Maybe the American sailor was duped by someone and given a fake list delivered by a fake delivery guy driving a cardboard cutout fake delivery van? I'm not a conspiracy theorist I'm just asking questions.

PRODUCE THE LIST!!!.....PRODUCE THE LIST!!!..... PRODUCE THE IRAQI DOI PERSON WHO SAID THIS!!! OH DAMMIT, LETS GO THE FULL MONTY....PRODUCE THIS SUPPOSED "Lt DEAN"...AND HIS DOG!!! Until I see him on Letterman he remains suspect..... this is fun.

Oh, I see, they checked with one of their own reporters who remembers meeting the guy at some unknown time in the past, plus he's in the rolodex. Does that explain away why the Iraqi DOI claims not to know him?

Deliberate misrepresentation of the evidence 1. That there is only one reporter that has met him and 2. that the time is "unknown". You know this is not the case yet you broadcast it.

If the Iraqi DOI claims this guy doesn't work for them, that's an issue for concern, wouldn't you agree?

Or maybe you think it's normal for a police captain to be repudiated by the government he works for?

of course, as this is something you want to hear you don't scream for the Iraqi DOI source to be produced....you simply accept it and parrot it as fact. Why don't you simply join Rik and declare it is a fact Jamil Hussein doesn't exist?

 

[casebro]

Er, no.

12/07/06 Iraq violence claims 10 members of U.S. military
12/08/06 23 die in Iraq violence
12/09/06 Suicide car bomb kills seven in Iraq
12/09/06 Soldier Among 5 Killed By Iraq Bomb
12/12/06 Iraq Bomb Attack Targeting Laborers Kills Up to 63
12/13/06 Bomb at Bus Stop Kills 11 in Baghdad
12/13/06 At least 55 die in Iraq violence
12/18/06 Bomb kills 5 in Baghdad
12/18/06 Dozens taken at Red Crescent in Baghdad

This is a hasty sampling of the past 10 days -- there's more where this came from.

Well yes, I know the war is still going on. I guess I'm hardened to bombings. By "Big Nasties" I meant:
How many imolations? How many decapitated bodies found? I was implying the possibility that the worst atrocities were made up news. Hmmm, any links to the batch of articles originating with "Hussein" ?

 

[Mycroft]

Who is the Iraqi source for this claim? What is thier name? Can I have a picture of them with thier family? Maybe the American sailor was duped by someone and given a fake list delivered by a fake delivery guy driving a cardboard cutout fake delivery van? I'm not a conspiracy theorist I'm just asking questions.

PRODUCE THE LIST!!!.....PRODUCE THE LIST!!!..... PRODUCE THE IRAQI DOI PERSON WHO SAID THIS!!! OH DAMMIT, LETS GO THE FULL MONTY....PRODUCE THIS SUPPOSED "Lt DEAN"...AND HIS DOG!!! Until I see him on Letterman he remains suspect..... this is fun.

If the Iraqi DOI repudiating this person is not a concern to you, fine. Please allow those of us who choose to be more skeptical than you to inquire further.

Deliberate misrepresentation of the evidence 1. That there is only one reporter that has met him and 2. that the time is "unknown". You know this is not the case yet you broadcast it.

Then fill in the blanks. Who is the reporter(s) and when did they meet him? If you can't answer those questions, then the time is "unknown", and that more than one person claims to have met him is unverified.

of course, as this is something you want to hear you don't scream
for the Iraqi DOI source to be produced....you simply accept it and parrot it as fact. Why don't you simply join Rik and declare it is a fact Jamil Hussein doesn't exist?

Ah, now you're personalizing the issue by claiming special knowlege of my thoughts. When you claim Randi's million for your telepathy, I'll start wearing the tinfoil beenie to protect myself from your mind-probes.

Or, if you would like to join us in the real world, pleas refrain from speculating on my thoughts and wants.

 

[varwoche]

Well yes, I know the war is still going on. I guess I'm hardened to bombings. By "Big Nasties" I meant:
How many imolations? How many decapitated bodies found? I was implying the possibility that the worst atrocities were made up news.

In other words, you took a Rorschach test, posted your "results" to a skeptical forum, got called on it, and now you've moved the Rorschach goalposts. This is no more than crevice-derived speculation.

Is he a Sunni cop? How do you know?

I thought it was on record. However I've re-read the thread and the AP articles and find no mention -- thanks for pointing out my error.

Does he have reason to be afraid? If so, how come he allowed himself to be named in the press a dozen or so times in the past?

(1) New rules about approved spokesmen and (2) warnings from the Iraqi government concerning repercussions for press reports deemed false.

Would increased attention place his family at risk?

Defies credulity.

 

[Mycroft]

(1) New rules about approved spokesmen and (2) warnings from the Iraqi government concerning repercussions for press reports deemed false.

Fascinating. In a previous post you said he should be afraid because he lived in one of Baghdad's most dangerous neighborhoods, a place where "...al-Sadr death squads have been purportedly running rampant" and now you turn 180 degrees and claim its the Iraqi government he should be afraid of.

All the while apparently forgetting that it's this very event, that Captain Hussein can't be found, as their reason for creating these new rules about approved spokesmen.

Look, with enough imagination you can rationalize anything. It's clear you don't think that the Iraqi DOI failing to verify this guys employment is a big deal, and you will sit back all day long making up excuses for why nothing more should be expected of AP or Captain Hussein.

Some of us, however, are more skeptical than that. Some of us, myself included, believe the issue requires further investigation. We have a contradiction in that the AP believes there is an Iraqi police captain named Hussein who has been the source of many stories, but the Iraqi DOI who employs the Iraqi police force claims he doesn’t exist. One way or another, the situation demands more evidence.

 

[Mycroft]

Update:

Michele Malkin writes on checking other sources for the mysterious Captain Hussein. Could it be an Iraqi police officer named Jamil Ghdaab Gulaim? Well, it doesn't seem likely.

Read it all:

http://michellemalkin.com/archives/006579.htm

 

[The Fool]

Update:

Michele Malkin writes on checking other sources for the mysterious Captain Hussein. Could it be an Iraqi police officer named Jamil Ghdaab Gulaim? Well, it doesn't seem likely.

Read it all:

http://michellemalkin.com/archives/006579.htm

from the link......According to two CPATT officials.......

Produce them! along with pictures of thier families.

 

[Mycroft]

from the link......According to two CPATT officials.......

Produce them! along with pictures of thier families.

Monkey fling poo.

 

[The Fool]

Monkey fling poo.

But surely you are concerned that these sources have not been verified...are you?

 

[daredelvis]

But surely you are concerned that these sources have not been verified...are you?

Please stop feeding this Troll. He reads Malkin and preaches about skeptical thinking, isn't that enough evidence? Haven't you figured out yet that you are talking to Virgil Goode ?

Daredelvis

 

[Mycroft]

But surely you are concerned that these sources have not been verified...are you?

Why would I?

Captain Jamil Hussein needs to be verified because there is evidence he doesn’t exist. That doesn’t mean in general we need to track down every person used as a source by the media and get a full biography of them. Capt. Hussein warrants special attention because the Iraqi Department of the Interior (DOI), who employs all Iraqi police officers, claims he doesn’t work for them and is not a police officer.

If you can tell me why that isn’t an issue that needs further investigation, I’d love to hear it.

On the other hand, you seem to prefer to “fling poo”, which is your standard tactic of addressing every argument by making a personal attack on the person you disagree with, or by just making jokes of the argument without addressing any of the issues, go ahead. You behave according to your nature, I don’t expect that to change.

Please stop feeding this Troll. He reads Malkin and preaches about skeptical thinking, isn't that enough evidence? Haven't you figured out yet that you are talking to Virgil Goode ?

Daredelvis

Okay, so once again you believe insulting the person you disagree with is the same as refuting him?

Is that skeptical at all?

The Iraqi DOI says this guy doesn't exist. Why is that not an issue, can you explain?

 

[daredelvis]

Okay, so once again you believe insulting the person you disagree with is the same as refuting him?

Is that skeptical at all?

The Iraqi DOI says this guy doesn't exist. Why is that not an issue, can you explain?

If the person I disagree with is putting up unnamed sources in a game of he said she said about a named source, I am going to insult away.

Daredelvis

 

[varwoche]

Fascinating. In a previous post you said he should be afraid because he lived in one of Baghdad's most dangerous neighborhoods, a place where "...al-Sadr death squads have been purportedly running rampant" and now you turn 180 degrees and claim its the Iraqi government he should be afraid of.

How bleakly amusing. I'd accuse you of being inattentive to the thread except it's worse than that -- you're inattentive to your own question...

If so, how come he allowed himself to be named in the press a dozen or so times in the past?

... and I replied with two recent changes to the landscape -- changes that in no way negate the fact that the police station sits in a most dangerous neighborhood in a city/country rapidly deteriorating into civil war. (Or maybe I should call it sectarian conflict, so as not to provide you fodder for more inane sophistry.)

 

[The Fool]

Why would I?

Thats right...why would you want verification of a source in a Malkin story?.....after all......its Malkin.....whereas AP stories.....well now, thats a different kettle of fish.

 

[Mycroft]

Thats right...why would you want verification of a source in a Malkin story?.....after all......its Malkin.....whereas AP stories.....well now, thats a different kettle of fish.

Once again you prove your personal dishonesty by selective editing. Here, let me cut and past the rest of that post that specifically addressed your insinuations:

Captain Jamil Hussein needs to be verified because there is evidence he doesn’t exist. That doesn’t mean in general we need to track down every person used as a source by the media and get a full biography of them. Capt. Hussein warrants special attention because the Iraqi Department of the Interior (DOI), who employs all Iraqi police officers, claims he doesn’t work for them and is not a police officer.

If you can tell me why that isn’t an issue that needs further investigation, I’d love to hear it.

On the other hand, you seem to prefer to “fling poo”, which is your standard tactic of addressing every argument by making a personal attack on the person you disagree with, or by just making jokes of the argument without addressing any of the issues, go ahead. You behave according to your nature, I don’t expect that to change.

 

[Mycroft]

Eason Jordan's take:

Today, nearly a month after the reported incident, Jamil Hussein's existence remains in question.

When IraqSlogger debuted in beta form last week, I offered in an IraqSlogger post to send Michelle Malkin to Baghdad to search for Jamil Hussein, and I offered to accompany her on the trip. Michelle accepted the offer, asked if I'd also pay for Curt to make the trip, I said yes, and now I'm working with Michelle offline to make the trip happen -- a hugely challenging, risky journey that will take some time to arrange.

Now the story becomes murkier and perhaps more intriguing with Mark Danziger's most recent post on the "Winds of Change" blog. Danziger, who's not in Iraq, and contacts of his who are in Baghdad are among those hunting for Jamil Hussein. In short, doubts remain about whether there's a captain Jamil Hussein, but there's no conclusive evidence, either way.

http://www.iraqslogger.com/index.php/post/259/Captain_Jamil_Hussein_Fact_or_Fiction

 

[Cylinder]

From the Society of Professional Journalists' Code of Ethics:

Journalists are accountable to their readers, listeners, viewers and each other.

Journalists should:

— Clarify and explain news coverage and invite dialogue with the public over journalistic conduct.
— Encourage the public to voice grievances against the news media.
— Admit mistakes and correct them promptly.
— Expose unethical practices of journalists and the news media.
— Abide by the same high standards to which they hold others.

 

[fishbob]

The Iraqi DOI says this guy doesn't exist. Why is that not an issue, can you explain?

You believe Malkin. You believe the DOI. Apparently without reservation.
One is a partisan hack, the other has motivation to be less than truthful, yet you believe.

Turn in your skeptic badge and secret decoder ring.
You may re-apply after the 90 day cooling off period.

 

[Mycroft]

You believe Malkin. You believe the DOI. Apparently without reservation.
One is a partisan hack, the other has motivation to be less than truthful, yet you believe.

Turn in your skeptic badge and secret decoder ring.
You may re-apply after the 90 day cooling off period.

It seems to me you're the one who is letting political biases cloud your judgement.

Michelle Malkin certainly has a political bias, but she didn't create this issue, and her politics don't alter the facts of the case.

You claim the Iraqi DOI has motivation to be less than truthful, yet it's unclear what those motivations are. Why would they lie about the existance of a man who is known to the Associated Press? That seems like a quick way to lose credibility and for very little gain.

You, on the other hand, offer no reason at all why this shouldn't be an issue. It's been more than three weeks now, and the existence of Jamil Hussein still has not been confirmed.