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Anger upon athiesm conversion.

'Conversion' for me took a long time. I went through phases of it:

Catholic
Extremely strong Catholic
Not Catholic (I wanted a religion but I didn't want it to be Catholicism)
Not Religious (Didn't want to have anything to do with Organized Religion)
Theist
Deist
Agnostic
Athiest

When I finally became an athiest, I think the hard part was that I spent most of my life feeling very strongly that we should respect each others' cultures (I travelled a lot with my family, growing up) and therefore other people's religion. Becoming an Athiest made me feel like I was realizing that all those religious people were 'wrong' and I was very uncomfortable with that feeling. I still put 'wrong' in quotes back there, you'll notice - I have a hard time even now. I don't like telling people that their religion is crap. Even if it is :) It seems disrespectful to me!

But I'm getting better. Just yesterday, I kicked a Buddist in the head.

KIDDING! :)
 
Getting angry is often a counterproductive or harmful response. For one thing it takes time and generally accomplishes nothing. Emotions are not rational and lead to actions that are not rational. This results in wife beating and child beatings and other pointless violence and harmful responses to stimuli. So feeling anger is ok only if you can control your actions when you are angry. Generally unless it stimulated you to take useful action on some issue it is pointless. Typically it is just an emotion you need to release to keep it from building up.

I just typed half of a long response to this and it was lost to the void, but here goes again.

I agree with much of what you're saying - anger can often lead to negative consequences. Sure. On the other hand it can lead us to do things that are good for us too.

It may lead a man to beat his wife, but it can also lead his wife to be unwilling to accept being beaten. She may get so angry she leaves him, fights back, calls on the aid of friends or relatives or the police, gives him an ultimatum, or some other course of action to deal with the problem (she may just nip it in the bud the first time he raises her hand to her by shouting "don't you ever ****ing hit me" and meaning it). I think that's one of the reasons we have this emotion at all - because sometimes we need it to spur us to do dangerous or difficult things that nonetheless we should do. Then again, sometimes it doesn't work out in our favour and a guy shoots his wife and her lover and ends up in prison for the rest of his life.

That's not good for anyone involved, but sometimes anger (or it's potential) can be good for everyone. The fact that you know that I would be angry if you tried to steal from me makes you think twice about doing it - you know that I might become physically violent, call the police, or again, do something else to "get back at you", and the threat of this helps to deter you from stealing from me, or in any other way taking advantage of me.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm a pretty laid back guy. Usually if something makes me angry I think about it for a while, decide it's nothing, and an hour later I've completely forgotten about it. But sometimes it doesn't work out that way.

The problem is that I used to be a little too laid back for my own good. I assumed that other people wouldn't want to take advantage of me, because I would never want to harm them, and I based my view of others on my view of myself. Well, then I got a glimpse of the real world. After actually being taken advantage of a few times (though never horribly) I realised that it was better to protect myself. I started getting angry when it seemed like someone was going to take advantage of me.

For example, shortly after moving to china my employer sorted out my visa. When we were negotiating before I came here we made some agreements, amoung them I said that I expected them to get me a work visa.
Well, when it came time to do the paperwork they expected me to pay for:
- The hospital bill to get the health check necessary for a visa. (around 1000rmb)
- The visa application and processing fees. (don't remember but something similar I think)

This made me very angry. Because of that anger I refused to pay. This may sound eminently reasonable, but understand that I had very little money, had been unemployed for four months, and didn't have anywhere else to go. Then again, they didn't know that.

When I demonstrated my anger by first talking calmly, but later rather agitatedly, loudly and forcefully, particularly when pointing out that they were not being true to their word, they relented and got the documents sorted out and payed for. I am glad I got angry in that case.

There have been a few more clashes between me and them and in every case anger is the only reason that I fight back. I'm glad that I do as I can tell that they are testing me to see how far I can be pushed, and if I give an inch, they'll take it. (For instance, one of my colleagues wasn't carefully checking if she was being payed for all of her working hours, then one day she found out that she was being underpaid every month.)
The most recent example is when they said that I would have to double my working hours without being payed any more, and that this was in accordance with Chinese labour laws. We went back and forth between them saying "according to your contract and the laws of the country we can do this" (and on and on for about 10 minutes of that) and me interrupting them yelling "I don't care. I won't do it. I have plenty of other options. If you don't back down I'll just leave."

After a while they suggested that this new policy would only apply to the Chinese staff. After much more yelling on my part (and some more subdued arguing one the part of one of the Chinese girls) they said they'd think about it, and we never heard about it again.

On all of those occasions I'm quite glad that I got angry. I think that both I and some of my colleagues are better off because of it. So I don't think that anger is always a bad thing - but I agree that was should try to be rational about it. If you think about something that made you angry and find that it's just ego, or something meaningless, often it is better to just let it pass, but sometimes the opposite will turn out to be the case.
 
I was much angrier before I became an atheist. If God exists, he's a [rule 8] and deserves a lot of anger. The universe has it's low points, but it's still far more wonderful than the self-indulgent doll house I was taught about in Sunday School.
 
I was much angrier before I became an atheist. If God exists, he's a [rule 8] and deserves a lot of anger. The universe has it's low points, but it's still far more wonderful than the self-indulgent doll house I was taught about in Sunday School.
I did a couple of years in Sunday School, it was easy time, my older brother was there and there were crayons and stories and singing. I realised a lot later that this was more about young parents of two boys getting some quality time together on a Sunday morning than it was about religion. The church was literally next door; our flat was one floor of the old rectory. When we traded up to a house with solid internal walls a bus-ride away, no more need for Sunday School. We was brought up proper anyway.

I remember preferring the OT stories to the Jesus stuff. Gideon was a particular favourite of mine. Robin Hood another, at the same time. All that stuff about "the greatest story ever told", utter nonsense, what about Jason, or the Odyssey? Sinbad? Gimme a break, the New Testament is one long yawn as a story. However it's cut and released - without ever, I gather, the director's express premission.
 
I maintain a bit of anger towards Xtianity because here, in the USA, those *(&! keep trying to make the USA a theocracy.
 
I just typed half of a long response to this and it was lost to the void, but here goes again.

I agree with much of what you're saying - anger can often lead to negative consequences. Sure. On the other hand it can lead us to do things that are good for us too.
I hope your post, which is excellent, proves cathartic. If you're going to find an understanding ear it's here, and I'm one. As a self-confessed freelance, established people will try to shaft you, assuming that you're vulnerable because you're freelance. A situation that terrifies them, sad bastards, but not us. We're freelance because we have something to sell, they try to screw us because they haven't and want to give their lives some meaning. Stand your ground and their employers will put them in their place. They need you, with your skills, far more than they do some back-office jerk-off trying to score brownie-points.

So we have to live off grass and bark for the odd month or two here and there, are we disheartened? We are not. We will not be put upon.
 
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I maintain a bit of anger towards Xtianity because here, in the USA, those *(&! keep trying to make the USA a theocracy.
Not all of them. But unfortunately, the vocal minority is quite unbearable.
Faith-based initiatives? What's with that?!?!?
 
I'd say a majority of them, based on the anti-homosexual marriage laws that have been approved by vote.
 
I'd say a majority of them, based on the anti-homosexual marriage laws that have been approved by vote.
In this instance, I can't deny it.

However, I would say that many voted in that way are confused on the issue. The rather few that I talked to who feel this way think that the law is to "force churches" to marry gays. It's the fact that most in america are confused that there is a difference between a civil service and a religious one.
 
They voted, and they are confused. I blame their churches and religious idealogy for that confusion.
 
They voted, and they are confused. I blame their churches and religious idealogy for that confusion.
Good place to start. I place the blame at the ones who abuse people's faith to assert a political agenda. I'm just happy that the last election cycle wasn't as terrible as the last couple.
 

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