AA77 FDR Data, Explained

[Baylor]

I'm sorry, let me type slower so more of you can understand:

Government conflicting data: NTSB and FAA support north side

13 witness accounts on video supporting north side

The testimonies are admissible because the interviewers did not follow the proper interviewing methods. If you read the NIST report on WTC 7 (which I know you have not), you'd know where to find the proper methodology.

 

[DavidJames]

Many of those moved to AAH were on topic and germane to the discussion in this thread. I'm really at a loss to see why they were moved.

Is it not allowed to question the qualifications of the Pilots for Truth?

Is it not allowed to question their motives?

Is it not allowed to question their methods?

Perhaps this section of the forum should be shut down entirely if no actual discussion of 9/11 conspiracy theories will be allowed.

I'm getting increasingly frustrated with the coddling of the CTists. It's okay to accuse people of mass murder as long as they're not members, but if you insult the poor babies, your out of line.

The best approach is to ignore them, TF is clearly trolling, he lives and dies by the responses he receives here. I wish people would stop feeding him.

If you saw an ugly flower, or heard a horrible song, would you engage them in debates and try to change them? It's no different engaging TF, Red, 911-Investigator and the rest of them. BFD, some of them are polite, they are accusing people of mass murder without evidence. Would you give a lesser sentence to a serial killer because he was polite?

Stop coddling 9/11 CTists. Doing so isn't furthering constructive debating it's enabling ignorance.

 

[A W Smith]

Convergence of evidence

Convergence of evidence

Convergence of evidence

Steve Anderson

Shortly after watching the second tragedy, I heard jet engines pass our building, which, being so close to the airport is very common. But I thought the airport was closed. I figured it was a plane coming in for landing. A few moments later, as I was looking down at my desk, the plane caught my eye. It didn't register at first. I thought to myself that I couldn't believe the pilot was flying so low. Then it dawned on me what was about to happen. I watched in horror as the plane flew at treetop level, banked slightly to the left, drug it's wing along the ground and slammed into the west wall of the Pentagon exploding into a giant orange fireball. Then black smoke. Then white smoke

Convergence of evidence

Deb Anlauf

Anlauf was watching TV coverage of the Trade Center burning shortly before 9:30 a.m. when she decided to return to her 14th-floor room from another part of the hotel. Once in her room, she heard a "loud roar" and looked out the window to see what was going on. "Suddenly I saw this plane right outside my window," Anlauf said during a telephone interview from her hotel room this morning. "You felt like you could touch it; it was that close. It was just incredible. "Then it shot straight across from where we are and flew right into the Pentagon. It was just this huge fireball that crashed into the wall (of the Pentagon). When it hit, the whole hotel shook."

Convergence of evidence

Gary Bauer

“I was in a massive traffic jam, hadn’t moved more than a hundred yards in twenty minutes. My office called to tell me about the first plane in New York, the reaction was ‘horrible accident.’ And then they called about the second plane, and clearly that meant something much worse was going on. It was only then that I really noticed where I was in that traffic jam. I was going past the Pentagon, really inching a yard or so every couple of minutes. I had just passed the closest place the Pentagon is to the exit on 395 . . . when all of a sudden I heard the roar of a jet engine. I looked at the woman sitting in the car next to me. She had this startled look on her face. We were all thinking the same thing. We looked out the front of our windows to try to see the plane, and it wasn’t until a few seconds later that we realized the jet was coming up behind us on that major highway. And it veered to the right into the Pentagon. The blast literally rocked all of our cars. It was an incredible moment.

Convergence of evidence

Sean Boger

"I just looked up and I saw the big nose and the wings of the aircraft coming right at us and I just watched it hit the building. It exploded. I fell to the ground and covered my head. I could actually hear the metal going through the building."

Convergence of evidence

Donald R. Bouchoux

At 9:40 a.m. I was driving down Washington Boulevard (Route 27) along the side of the Pentagon when the aircraft crossed about 200 yards in front of me and impacted the side of the building. There was an enormous fireball, followed about two seconds later by debris raining down. The car moved about a foot to the right when the shock wave hit. I had what must have been an emergency oxygen bottle from the airplane go flying down across the front of my Explorer and then a second piece of jagged metal come down on the right side of the car."

Convergence of evidence

Pam Bradley

I work in Washington DC area, and was on my way to work, in my car, sitting on a bridge, and saw the plane hit the Pentagon. I am in a complete state of shock.

Convergence of evidence

Joseph Candelario
Captain

He was first alerted that the day was drastically changing when one of the medics told him that a plane hit the World Trade Center. While watching the tower burn, another plane hit the second tower. “Thinking that this was a very serious terrorist attack, I went outside to the river to take a break. As I was looking across the river towards the direction of the Pentagon, I noticed a large aircraft flying low towards the White House. This aircraft then made a sharp turn and flew towards the Pentagon and seconds later crashed into it.

OOps Captain Candelario was in a perfect position to witness the alleged flyover. sorry didnt see it

Convergence of evidence

Daryl Donley

I could see the windows. I saw the entire plane and then saw it fly right into the Pentagon."

Convergence of evidence

Bobby Eberle​

We set out in the car and immediately turned on the news radio to follow what was happening in New York City. After fifteen minutes into our trip, a new report came over the radio stating that a second aircraft (another passenger airliner) had struck the World Trade Center. ... As we slowly crept along in traffic at about 9:30 am, we rounded a bend and had the Pentagon in our sites -- right in front of us. ... Riding in a convertable with the top down, I then heard a tremendously loud noise from behind me and to my left. I looked back and saw a jet airliner flying very low and very fast. It's amazing what can run through your mind in just a matter of seconds. As a pilot, I can't help but look at an airplane and think about airplane topics. What I saw sent a shiver down my spine as I realized something was not right. The aircraft was so very low -- as an aircraft would be on its final approach to an airport. However, if you have watched any aircraft come in for a landing, even though the aircraft is descending, it is angled up slightly. This aircraft was angled downward. In addition, landing gear would also be visible on a aircraft so low and so near landing. This aircraft had its landing gear retracted. Finally, an aircraft on final approach is traveling rather slowly. This aircraft sped by very loudly an very quickly. All of this flashed in my mind as the aircraft passed from behind my left shoulder to in front of me. It was then that the other events of the morning crystallized in the realization that tragedy was about to occur. With all of these images spinning in my head, the only words that came out of my mouth were "Oh no!" With that, the airliner crashed into the Pentagon and exploded

Convergence of evidence

Albert Hemphill

"Having just witnessed the CNN coverage of New York" "with a head full of the horror in New York, I walked in the office and stood peering out of the window looking at the Pentagon. ... As I stood there, I instinctively ducked at the extremely loud roar and whine of a jet engine spooling up. Immediately, the large silver cylinder of an aircraft appeared in my window, coming over my right shoulder as I faced the Westside of the Pentagon directly towards the heliport. The aircraft, looking to be either a 757 or Airbus, seemed to come directly over the annex, as if it had been following Columbia Pike - an Arlington road leading to Pentagon. The aircraft was moving fast, at what I could only be estimate as between 250 to 300 knots. All in all, I probably only had the aircraft in my field of view for approximately 3 seconds. The aircraft was at a sharp downward angle of attack, on a direct course for the Pentagon. It was "clean", in as much as, there were no flaps applied and no apparent landing gear deployed. He was slightly left wing down as he appeared in my line of sight, as if he'd just "jinked" to avoid something. As he crossed Route 110 he appeared to level his wings, making a slight right wing slow adjustment as he impacted low on the Westside of the building to the right of the helo, tower and fire vehicle around corridor 5. What instantly followed was a large yellow fireball accompanied by an extremely bass sounding, deep thunderous boom. The yellow fireball rose quickly as black smoke engulfed the entire Westside of the Pentagon, obscuring the whole of the heliport. I could feel the concussion and felt the shockwave of the blast impact the window of the Annex, knocking me against the desk.

Convergence of evidence

Michael James

"The plane came over the top of us and brushed the trees. Then it looked like it hit the helicopter pad and skipped up and went right into the first and second floors."

Convergence of evidence

Terrance Kean

"I saw this very, very large passenger jet," said the architect, who had been packing for a move. "It just plowed right into the side of the Pentagon. The nose penetrated into the portico. And then it sort of disappeared, and there was fire and smoke everywhere. . . . It was very sort of surreal."

Convergence of evidence

Aydan Kizildrgli

Aydan Kizildrgli, an English language student who is a native of Turkey, saw the jetliner bank slightly then strike a western wall of the huge five-sided building that is the headquarters of the nation's military. "There was a big boom," he said. "Everybody was in shock. I turned around to the car behind me and yelled ‘Did you see that?' Nobody could believe it."

Convergence of evidence

David Marra

he saw an American Airlines jet swooping in, its wings wobbly, looking like it was going to slam right into the Pentagon: "It was 50 ft. off the deck when he came in. It sounded like the pilot had the throttle completely floored. The plane rolled left and then rolled right. Then he caught an edge of his wing on the ground." There is a helicopter pad right in front of the side of the Pentagon. The wing touched there, then the plane cartwheeled into the building.

I can continue as I am only about 40% through the witness testimony.
but this post is already too long. And This is just the tip of the iceberg as far as "flight data" is concerned. Then there is the DNA of the passengers.
The plane wreckage, The personal belongings of the passengers found in the wreckage. The complete lack of flyover witnesses, Not a one. Any sane person would conclude that flight 77 hit the pentagon.

 

[BCR]

And Then There Is The Radar Data

Unfortunately, I can't link my source material yet, but just type my id into Google and you'll find all of the data I am referring to.

I have NEADS and SEADS radar (ARSR-3 and ARSR-4) data. I have the TRACON radar (ASR-9) from IAD, DCA, ADW and BWI. They all tell the same story, a primary target flew in from the west, completed a 330 degree turn over Arlington/Alexandria and then disappeared from radar just west of the Pentagon. There are no primary targets to evidence a plane flying past the Pentagon.

I have the ATC recordings from IAD, DCA and ADW. Not one reference to a plane flying over and to the east of the Pentagon. To the contrary, the IAD and DCA audios indicate the primary target ended with a fireball at the Pentagon. I also have the written statements of the IAD ATC's which verbally confirm the radar primary track, and not one of them mention seeing it past the Pentagon area.

I even went to Arlington and confirmed the radar track with Arlington County Police officers (I even have the audio from their radio reporting real-time) and witnesses in the area. They all confirm the radar track as it headed towards the Pentagon just south of Columbia Pike.

Should I mention that all of this agrees with the flight data recorder up until it ends 6-8 minutes before impact? Now why it ends prematurely is another discussion entirely and quite frankly that is a mystery that we will have to wait for more from the NTSB and FBI to resolve. However, all of this agrees with the "Convergence of Evidence" by AW above.

I am open to ANY evidence that indicates anything flying over the east side of the Pentagon. Yet as CNN arrived, people on that side of the building were associating the event to a helicopter that flew around the building from that side 10 minutes earlier. Not one of them mentioned seeing a plane fly over. Now if they saw a little ole helicopter, don't you think they would have noticed a big ole 757?

 

[Baylor]

Welcome to the forums. If you can provide a link to those ACP recordings it'd be greatly appreciated.

 

[BCR]

Forum rules, I can't post links until after 15 posts. I have a site set up for my data AAL77 dot COM. Hopefully that won't get censored

 

[A W Smith]

http://www.aal77.com/

 

[Baylor]

Thanks for the info. I'll post it here for you and everyone else.

Arlington County Police Dispatch - 911

 

[dtugg]

Unfortunately, I can't link my source material yet, but just type my id into Google and you'll find all of the data I am referring to.

I have NEADS and SEADS radar (ARSR-3 and ARSR-4) data. I have the TRACON radar (ASR-9) from IAD, DCA, ADW and BWI. They all tell the same story, a primary target flew in from the west, completed a 330 degree turn over Arlington/Alexandria and then disappeared from radar just west of the Pentagon. There are no primary targets to evidence a plane flying past the Pentagon.

I have the ATC recordings from IAD, DCA and ADW. Not one reference to a plane flying over and to the east of the Pentagon. To the contrary, the IAD and DCA audios indicate the primary target ended with a fireball at the Pentagon. I also have the written statements of the IAD ATC's which verbally confirm the radar primary track, and not one of them mention seeing it past the Pentagon area.

I even went to Arlington and confirmed the radar track with Arlington County Police officers (I even have the audio from their radio reporting real-time) and witnesses in the area. They all confirm the radar track as it headed towards the Pentagon just south of Columbia Pike.

Should I mention that all of this agrees with the flight data recorder up until it ends 6-8 minutes before impact? Now why it ends prematurely is another discussion entirely and quite frankly that is a mystery that we will have to wait for more from the NTSB and FBI to resolve. However, all of this agrees with the "Convergence of Evidence" by AW above.

I am open to ANY evidence that indicates anything flying over the east side of the Pentagon. Yet as CNN arrived, people on that side of the building were associating the event to a helicopter that flew around the building from that side 10 minutes earlier. Not one of them mentioned seeing a plane fly over. Now if they saw a little ole helicopter, don't you think they would have noticed a big ole 757?

Are you John Farmer? If so, thank you for your work it is appreciated. Of course you realize that all your info was faked, right? The USAF/FAA/NTSB was obviously in on it.


Here is a link to your site.

ETA: You said the FDR data ends 6-8 minutes before impact. You mean 6-8 seconds, right?

ETAA: I see that you updated your site to show how the supposed NSA intelligence analyst, ULTIMA1 had no idea what he was talking about when he was arguing with me about the RADAR tracks. Thanks!

 

[WildCat]

Forum rules, I can't post links until after 15 posts. I have a site set up for my data AAL77 dot COM. Hopefully that won't get censored

Welcome 911files! Nice work, it's about time the government hired someone who knows how to construct a web site to cover up The Truth.

 

[BCR]

ETA: You said the FDR data ends 6-8 minutes before impact. You mean 6-8 seconds, right?

Duh...thx for the catch, and yes I am CIT's favorite government agent.

 

[dtugg]

Just curious, have the idiots of CIT responded to the RADAR info that you have? If so, I am sure what their response is, but I am just wondering.

 

[BCR]

Just curious, have the idiots of CIT responded to the RADAR info that you have? If so, I am sure what their response is, but I am just wondering.

It is all FAKE!

 

[dtugg]

It is all FAKE!

Of course! Do you have a link to a thread somewhere that they actually told you this if you don't mind?

 

[BCR]

Of course! Do you have a link to a thread somewhere that they actually told you this if you don't mind?

Can't do links yet. Just visit their Pentcon forum under responses to detractors.

Here is one from Aldo before I blocked them from the blog.

Comment by Aldo Marquis CIT

March 4, 2008 @ 3:36 pm |Edit This

>>>Sorry Aldo, the radar data does not support the departure you mention.

I know, it supports the pilot’s statements. Not the data that was released because I critically analyzed his statements and discovered what it really meant.

>>>Saying the 84 RADES data is fradulent does not make it so.

Yes but fatal contradicting anomalies do.

>>>>I assure you that if I (or one of the far better qualified than I experts working behind the scenes) find evidence (empirical) to determine it fradulent then you’ll be the first (or second) I let know.

You are not an expert and you have no experts. you have innuendo. That’s one of the tools of people like you.

In fact, prove who you are. I can prove who I am. I can prove I am who I say I am and my past is verifiable. Is yours? Can we see some credentials? Maybe the name police department where you were a “detective”? Can we verify John Farmer is who he says he is? I’m just a little nutty conspiracy theorist who listens to that horrible rap music, what have you got to lose? (Cue Farmer’s accusations/innuendo of us being disinfo which is highly laughable and 100% false)

>>>In the meantime, subject human accounts that cannot be verified don’t really mean much. But thanks for the feedback.

Um they’ve been verified and corroborated. After all, that’s why you are here being paid to do your job.

I don't think Aldo likes me too much.

 

[dtugg]

I’m just a little nutty conspiracy theorist

Straight from Aldo's mouth. This will be in my sig. Awesome. Thank you!

 

[BCR]

Craig on NEADS

Of course! Do you have a link to a thread somewhere that they actually told you this if you don't mind?

I found one from Craig on a post I did regarding the NEADS time anomaly.

Craig | [email protected] | IP: 68.96.87.51

The real question is how you handle this.

The fact that you were able to find this anomaly doesn’t mean that you should be able to think you can possibly know or definitively figure out all the exact reasons WHY and all the exact places WHERE it was altered and therefore be able to determine that everything else in the data is legitimate.

Between the FDR, the citgo video, and now this there is a clear pattern.

Any signs of manipulation AT ALL render the entire data set invalid and magnify any other discrepancies in the official story such as the north and east side evidence.

It’s 100% clear there has been a coordinated effort to falsify data. The implications of this precedent means that ALL government data should be automatically considered invalid in support of the official story.

Just as in any criminal case if the suspect is cold busted falsifying evidence they are pretty much cold busted.

Only purely independent evidence can be considered a valid means to figure out what really went down.

It will be extremely disingenuous If you tout this as a mere effort to cover up their failure to respond implicating LIHOP.

That time anomaly is still being investigated with the assistance of those in the know. I also pointed out in that post, which I later confirmed, there is also SEADS data for the Pentagon area which exhibits normality and can be used to verify the NEADS data (OCA site). I did a later one-to-one alignment for an extensive data set that showed that there were no positional anomalies.

Here is the straight from 84 RADES explanation for the anomaly.

Raw radar data does not have time associated with it. The radar data is assumed to be real-time (or near real-time) upon input into the military command and control systems and/or the FAA ATC systems. The 84 RADES data recorders time stamp the data as the data is recorded at the ADSs.

I'm not sure what our timing source was in 2001 (NTP, GPS, or ?) but a precise timing method was used to periodically update our recorders and keep them time synched. There evidently was problem with the way our NEADS recorder time was being updated as seen in the 25 second late timing during the 911 event. Without periodic time updates, our data recorders internal time it used which we found can drift considerably.Since 911 we have changed the architecture of our recorders to prevent the time drift.

Also, there can be considerable system delays from the radar antenna to the C2 / ATC facilities caused by local radar site data processing, the comm systems, and the central C2 and/or ATC computer system processing that in total can amount to a couple of seconds.

I'll leave it to you to decide which is the more constructive response.

 

[jhunter1163]

911files:

Welcome to the forum. You might want to head over to Humor, make six jokes, then you can post all the links you want. That was what I did back in the day.

Cheers, John

 

[jaydeehess]

............

I can continue as I am only about 40% through the witness testimony.
but this post is already too long...

That's OK, after all that is 14 witnesses saying the plane hit the building whereas the CiT have 13 who's statements put the plane on a flight path taking it NoC.

To put it consisely All witnesses in position to observe it occur state that the plane hit the Pentagon. Some of those have the plane approaching from a different path than the lamp post described path.

Logic would dictate that the point of convergence of all witnesses is the most accurate part of all those statements but the CiT and Pft would instead argue that the minority report of a plane NoC be the one that is considered the most accurate despite the wide variance even among those descriptions and the fact that some of them absolutly contradict the ability of other witnesses to even have seen the aircraft at all from where they were at the time. (such as Morin and Paik if the aircraft approached from the far side of the Navy Annex)

 

[jhunter1163]

That's OK, after all that is 14 witnesses saying the plane hit the building whereas the CiT have 13 who's statements put the plane on a flight path taking it NoC.

Let's not forget, all of CIT's witnesses also say the plane hit the building.