AA77 FDR Data, Explained

[DavidJames]

Sniff, sniff, sniff...... Do I smell something?

Just for the record, I posted my very innocent (and very ignored) question before Gravy's edit.

 

[Baylor]

Hi Scott Milner. I just want to say welcome to the forums.

 

[Scott_Milner]

I did not say there was manual entry at all, I said the animation must be manually manipulated to match the CSV.

Do you understand the amount of data that would need to be input from the technician manually?

What flight software package requires this manual manipulation?

The person who did that forgot to consider magnetic variation in the final phase. It is a working copy that was used for nothing Official at all. Why are you so concerned about this?

"The Person"? The file is loaded into the software, there is no human input required.

Aside from magnetic variation, there are a host of other issues to consider. Are any of you sotfware/programming savvy by chance? These replies are not making sense.

 

[Scott_Milner]

Just for the record, I posted my very innocent (and very ignored) question before Gravy's edit.

My apology, I didn't see this. I did a search via Google and this thread appeared first.

 

[Gravy]

You seem to know a lot more than you hinted at in your initial post. Why don't you tell us what you think the problem MIGHT be. This could go on forever unless you state your point...

Motion seconded! We all Most of us like to learn here.

 

[Reheat]

Aside from magnetic variation, there are a host of other issues to consider. Are any of you sotfware/programming savvy by chance? These replies are not making sense.

You seem to know more than those answering you, so why don't you tell us the problem and what you think it means.

 

[Gravy]

In the third post in my link above, Apathoid, a 757/767 avionics technician, covers some of those additional issues, Scott.

 

[dtugg]

Well, obviously, the rational answer is that no plane hit the Pentagon and all this data is fake.

 

[Scott_Milner]

Motion seconded! We all Most of us like to learn here.

I have already stated mypoint and clarified my question. The point/question is:

How is the CSV file different from the animation as the source file is the same?

Here is a link to flight analysis software. Read the site to understand how the animation is created. Basically, loading a file and clicking a few buttons creates the animation.

The CSV data is exported through a menu with a couple more clicks of the mouse.

cefa-aviation[dot]com

I would still like to know what software you claim requires manual entry of 100,000's of data points by an operator to create the animation.

 

[Pinch]

You seem to know more than those answering you, so why don't you tell us the problem and what you think it means.

I'll add my name to the list of those waiting for an answer from the new forum CVR expert.

I'm sniffin' something, as well.

 

[Gravy]

Thanks for the link, Scott. Was that the software used to create this animation?

Btw, I made no such claim about inputting hundreds of thousands of data points manually, so please be careful there. As I said, I'm always willing to learn.

 

[Hokulele]

I would still like to know what software you claim requires manual entry of 100,000's of data points by an operator to create the animation.

The "manual entry" portion isn't the data points, but how they correspond to the real world. For example, I can take a surveying data collector out into the field, shoot thousands of points, and then return to the office. From the data collector, I can then download the information either to a CSV file, or directly to mapping software.

However, if I use an assumed benchmark, the map will not correlate to the real world until I manually adjust the benchmark to its true coordinates.

In the case of the flight data, it isn't a benchmark that is off, but the magnetic deviation, which will cause the animation software to use the wrong direction as North until it is manually adjusted.

 

[TJM]

I'll add my name to the list of those waiting for an answer from the new forum CVR expert.

Well I for one welcome our new CRV overlord with open arms. I've never posted in this thread because The subject matter is way out of my field. But I, like the others have stated, never pass up an opportunity to learn.

So let's hear it Scott, I'm all ears.

 

[Scott_Milner]

The "manual entry" portion isn't the data points, but how they correspond to the real world. For example, I can take a surveying data collector out into the field, shoot thousands of points, and then return to the office. From the data collector, I can then download the information either to a CSV file, or directly to mapping software.

However, if I use an assumed benchmark, the map will not correlate to the real world until I manually adjust the benchmark to its true coordinates.

In the case of the flight data, it isn't a benchmark that is off, but the magnetic deviation, which will cause the animation software to use the wrong direction as North until it is manually adjusted.

Why are we talking about magnetic deviation alone when there are several parameters conflicting?

For example, the easiest to clarify is the altitude. The animation shows 300 feet, while the CSV shows 40 feet while on the runway.

Since both files are created from the same source file, these values should be equal.

Gravy, I'm sorry I may have misquoted. I believe "Reheat" suggested the animation was created manually by an operator to match the CSV file.

Reheat:
I said the animation must be manually manipulated to match the CSV. Th

 

[DavidJames]

My apology, I didn't see this. I did a search via Google and this thread appeared first.

Thanks Scott and no problem, it's easy to miss a post.

My question was more along the lines of why? What made you think the FDR and animation was even an issue? Where else have you done research?

 

[Jonnyclueless]

Am I understanding this right? There is software, you click a button and no matter where the plane is, it knows where to draw trees and buildings and maps and everything else? How exactly does this software know how to do this?

 

[Reheat]

Gravy, I'm sorry I may have misquoted. I believe "Reheat" suggested the animation was created manually by an operator to match the CSV file.

No, I didn't. You keep misstating my point. I'm saying exactly the same thing as Hokulele, but in a different way. You seem to be the expert here, so tell us what is wrong....

 

[Gravy]

Sorry, had to reboot...seem to be having software issues of my own.

That CEFA software is cool, but I'm not familiar with what the NTSB used. Was that info included with the FOIA responses they gave?

 

[Gravy]

Reading that CEFA brochure. Reheat, did you call your cockpit audio alert "Bitching Betty?"

"Terrain...terrain...ask for directions..."

 

[Reheat]

Why are we talking about magnetic deviation alone when there are several parameters conflicting?

For example, the easiest to clarify is the altitude. The animation shows 300 feet, while the CSV shows 40 feet while on the runway.

While you may be a software expert, do you have a clue as to what the data your viewing in the CSV file tells you? What is the field elevation at Dulles?