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Split Thread A second impeachment

DevilsAdvocate said:
How cold does your heart have to be to watch the video presented and listen to Rep. Raskin's speech and still believe that there should be no consequences and that we should risk allowing all of this to happen again in four years, perhaps with more planning and perhaps with the success of ending democracy in the United States of America?
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I understand some Republican senators turned their backs whilst the video was played. I'm only surprised they didn't also put their fingers in their ears and go "la la la".
 
Pixel42 said:
I understand some Republican senators turned their backs whilst the video was played. I'm only surprised they didn't also put their fingers in their ears and go "la la la".
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I've looked for any reporting of this and can find none. From the WAPO:

As the Democratic video played, nearly every senator was glued to the screens in the Senate chamber — although Paul doodled on a paper pad in his lap and Sen. Tom Cotton (R-Ark.) also focused most of his attention on papers in front of him.

Some focused intently, others stared blankly, and some frowned. Sen. Dan Sullivan (R-Alaska) appeared to redden at one point.
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If any had turned his/her back, I'm sure it would have been mentioned.
 
Stacyhs said:
I've looked for any reporting of this and can find none. From the WAPO:

If any had turned his/her back, I'm sure it would have been mentioned.
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My source was a poster on another board who I assumed was watching live, but possibly got it from elsewhere. So disregard, apologies for not checking.
 
What can you do when you have Republicans this dumb? Granted, this is a State Senate Majority leader, not a Congress member, but still.....
Shirkey falsely claims US Capitol attack was staged, not carried out by Trump supporters

Senate Majority leader Mike Shirkey, the highest ranking Republican elected official in Michigan, recently said he believes the Jan. 6 assault on the U.S. Capitol was not carried out by supporters of former president Donald Trump, calling the idea a "hoax" and stating that the attack was "staged."

The inaccurate comments from Shirkey, R-Clarklake, were made during a meeting with Hillsdale County Republican Party officials one day before the party censured him for not doing enough to stand up to Gov. Gretchen Whitmer and supporting a ban on firearms at the Capitol, among other charges. A video of the meeting was first reported on by Detroit Metro Times.

Shirkey also takes aim several times at the governor in the video, sexualizing her in comments about budget negotiations and saying he contemplated challenging her to a fistfight outside the state Capitol.

In the video, Shirkey makes a number of false claims about the deadly assault on the Capitol, which left one police officer dead.

"That wasn’t Trump people. That’s been a hoax from day one," Shirkey says in the video. "It was all staged," he adds.
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The video in linked in the article. It's quite long.
 
Stacyhs said:
What can you do when you have Republicans this dumb? Granted, this is a State Senate Majority leader, not a Congress member, but still.....
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The obvious conclusion is that Trump is a member of the Deep State and must be barred from office so that he can never be allowed to attempt to overthrow the government. Again.
 
DevilsAdvocate said:
The obvious conclusion is that Trump is a member of the Deep State and must be barred from office so that he can never be allowed to attempt to overthrow the government. Again.
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Are we sure Trump is really Trump? I mean, has anyone really seen Hillary and Trump together since 2016? Just asking......
 
dirtywick said:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...-of-trump-s-lawyers/ar-BB1dxZon?ocid=msedgntp

from a few of the hardcore R senator's comments today, i don't think his acquittal is that cut and dry. if trump's lawyers don't do significantly better, he might lose.
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Nah.. those GOP senators are just upset that the poor impeachment defense is making the republican support for terrorism too obvious. They will still vote to acquit. After all, it was pretty obvious the impeachment was constitutional but most still voted it wasn't

Frankly we have been down this road far too many times to expect any sort of sane or ethical behavior to get our hopes up.... Racist Bannon would remove trump via the 25th (he didn't), Moscow Mitch really wanted trump gone (but he failed to recall the senate early).

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Well, tonight I sat through the whole enchilada - four hours. It's now 3:45 am and I am questioning my sanity.

My comments: I thought the second T**** lawyer (Shoen ??) had a decent argument but should have 1) cut his presentation down by at least two-thirds, and 2) limited his argument to only that where he had a plausible case to make, namely, the constitutionality of the proceedings themselves. I hasten to add that I don't at all agree with his case; I think that is the only area in which he had a leg to stand on. I thought his political arguments weakened his presentation.
 
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The Atheist said:
Superb analogy!

What happened at the Capitol was exactly the same as Pearl Harbour.
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Yup - very true. The protesters EXACTLY used the DA3 aircraft with twin 130lb bombs to devastate the Capital building entrance, allowing the Nakajima B5N to use torpedo's to penetrate the interior.

Oh wait.. no.. that didn't happen did it ? It was just a few hundred people who broke a couple of glass doors, and wandered around the interior doing no damage (other than stealing a few keepsakes), before peacefully leaving.

dirtywick said:
I don’t get the opposition to this. he literally did one of the worst things an American could do. trying to overthrow a democracy that governs over 350M people.
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And how - precisely - do you envisage the few hundred aforementioned people overthrowing the American democracy ? I mean.. really ? How ? By the time the crowd entered the capital building, the politicians had been evacuated. What did you anticipate ? Insurrection by Selfie ? Because that's all that most of the crowd DID. Take photographs of each other.

This significance of this entire event has been HUGELYL exaggerated.
 
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TragicMonkey said:
It's been pointed out that if he's tried in a criminal court Trump will be in deep trouble as he doesn't seem to be able to secure good lawyers. Only crazy people and idiots. For some reason.

He'd be lucky if he got that hyperchicken from Futurama for a lawyer.
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I'll be his paralegal if he pays me $19,999.00 per diem all expense paid.







Upfront.
 
Roofgardener said:
Yup - very true. The protesters EXACTLY used the DA3 aircraft with twin 130lb bombs to devastate the Capital building entrance, allowing the Nakajima B5N to use torpedo's to penetrate the interior.

Oh wait.. no.. that didn't happen did it ? It was just a few hundred people who broke a couple of glass doors, and wandered around the interior doing no damage (other than stealing a few keepsakes), before peacefully leaving.


And how - precisely - do you envisage the few hundred aforementioned people overthrowing the American democracy ? I mean.. really ? How ? By the time the crowd entered the capital building, the politicians had been evacuated. What did you anticipate ? Insurrection by Selfie ? Because that's all that most of the crowd DID. Take photographs of each other.

This significance of this entire event has been HUGELYL exaggerated.
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No damage? You mean apart from killing a Capitol Police officer and injuring hundreds more, as well as causing so much trauma that two officers have since committed suicide? Yeah, apart from that, no damage was done... I know Trump followers are devoid of facts, I didn't honestly realise they were so devoid of morals.
 
DevilsAdvocate said:
I don't understand many things about what law enforcement did that day. Not restricting flag poles and backpacks and body armor like other demonstrations. The acting Secretary of State, who came into that position after Trump fired the last acting Secretary after the election, sending a memo to the Secretary of the Army only allowing, without his permission, the use of the National Guard with no weapons or protection or even helmets and no intelligence gathering and not even being able to interact with the demonstrators. No FBI presence other than briefly escorting in the ambulance for the woman who was shot. No other Federal agencies like the Park Service of ATF. Taking 90 minutes just to get approval for the National Guard. The Pentagon holding up Virginia rapid response team waiting at the border for permission to come in. Lack of use of stronger force to protect the Capitol even as rioters stormed the building with member of Congress still scrambling inside for cover.

Those are a lot of things that have not been explained.
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The horrifying thing is, any jihadist terrorist with a grudge against the USA could have taken the opportunity to mingle with that crowd. Backpacks, face coverings, weapons, you name it. Where was the common sense intelligence that day?
 
Roofgardener said:
Yup - very true. The protesters EXACTLY used the DA3 aircraft with twin 130lb bombs to devastate the Capital building entrance, allowing the Nakajima B5N to use torpedo's to penetrate the interior.

Oh wait.. no.. that didn't happen did it ? It was just a few hundred people who broke a couple of glass doors, and wandered around the interior doing no damage (other than stealing a few keepsakes), before peacefully leaving.


And how - precisely - do you envisage the few hundred aforementioned people overthrowing the American democracy ? I mean.. really ? How ? By the time the crowd entered the capital building, the politicians had been evacuated. What did you anticipate ? Insurrection by Selfie ? Because that's all that most of the crowd DID. Take photographs of each other.

This significance of this entire event has been HUGELYL exaggerated.
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Yeah. They really only killed 5 people. No biggie. And no one takes the threats to the lives of elected representatives seriously. Just a few morons on a lark. They will be proud to show those keepsakes to their grandchildren as a symbol of how Nana and Grandad showed their respect for American democracy. Just another day in the great USA.
 
Aridas said:
Cold hearted? No need.

It's as simple as having different values. For example, significant portions of the GOP have long been putting out strong signals that they would be very happy to get rid of democracy under the assumption that they would be in power and be able to enforce their will on everyone else. Sure, that'll likely cause problems when it changes and after, but why would they care, so long as they ended up on top?
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Do they not learn from history? The first ones in the tumbrils after the nominated enemies are deposed will be the revolutionaries who were not quite as enthusiastic as the swivel-eyed fanatics would have liked. Anyone not 150% for them was against them. Off with their heads!
 
DevilsAdvocate said:
How cold does your heart have to be to watch the video presented and listen to Rep. Raskin's speech and still believe that there should be no consequences and that we should risk allowing all of this to happen again in four years, perhaps with more planning and perhaps with the success of ending democracy in the United States of America?
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Yes, Raskin's tearing up as he described how his daughter now did not want to come to the Capitol was entirely genuine, unlike the pyrotechnics of oily Castor and bitter Schoen.
 

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Vixen said:
I'll be his paralegal if he pays me $19,999.00 per diem all expense paid.







Upfront.
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Asking for your money upfront is very wise when dealing with Trump, since Trump has a very long and very well established history of not paying/under paying the people who work for him.
 
Roofgardener said:
Yup - very true. The protesters EXACTLY used the DA3 aircraft with twin 130lb bombs to devastate the Capital building entrance, allowing the Nakajima B5N to use torpedo's to penetrate the interior.

Oh wait.. no.. that didn't happen did it ? It was just a few hundred people who broke a couple of glass doors, and wandered around the interior doing no damage (other than stealing a few keepsakes), before peacefully leaving.


And how - precisely - do you envisage the few hundred aforementioned people overthrowing the American democracy ? I mean.. really ? How ? By the time the crowd entered the capital building, the politicians had been evacuated. What did you anticipate ? Insurrection by Selfie ? Because that's all that most of the crowd DID. Take photographs of each other.

This significance of this entire event has been HUGELYL exaggerated.
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Is this some type of ****-stir?

Because even if it isn't, this bunch of patriots on their merry lark decided that it was. When they weren't beating people to death and threatening more people with lynching, including Trump's own VP, they smeared their feces on the walls of the rooms and halls, broke into offices, and then stole a whole bunch of stuff which they tried later to sell on eBay. While filming themselves doing so.

The significance, if you have already missed it (and I think you may have done so deliberately) is they threatened the place and people that are the seat of US government. Do you think that is NOT important? Do you think that such a threat should be opposed by all true US patriots? Or is it only if the Chinese army does this that it is a threat?
 
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