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9/11-investigator explains the Holocaust

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Revisionists are not interested in looking for ashes. According to the official story there were 850,000 corpses buried and later dug up in Treblinka. One can use ground penetration radar to decide if the soil where the massgraves supposedly were located is yes/no disturbed. This research has been carried out by Richard Krege, an Australian with the result that the soil at Treblinka has been untouched since the last ice age. Conclusion: there was no mass grave, hence there was no holocaust, at least not in Treblinka. We discussed this topic extensively earlier in this thread, please look it up.

You should read your own links. According to the wiki-page you link to, Krege has not published his results. This has also been discussed in this thread and you've not been able to come up with a link to an article of his.

The wiki article also mentions Krege hasn't even disclosed when he did his "research". Can you enlighten us?
 
I know more people who dislike that, though I have my doubts those same people would be willing to work in a snackbar 12+hours or ride on a garbage truck and all that.
... and after venting their dislike for muslim immigrants, they go get a kebab or a shoarma. :rolleyes:

But how did this equate to: the jews are evil and made up the holocaust?
Or are the 'islamic people' actually secretly the jews that never vanished from history pretending to be islamic back for vengeance for ... something that never happened... wait..
Holocaust denier logic works in even more mysterious ways than the fundie christian's God. :rolleyes:
 
... and after venting their dislike for muslim immigrants, they go get a kebab or a shoarma. :rolleyes:

I have said before that I get along surprisingly well with muslims. Far better than with lefties like you. Just like Dolfie. :D

I do not dislike muslims, I dislike immigration of large groups with radical different identities then ours. Because in the end waits ethnic/religious strife and genocide.

Our ddt, who likes to design history quizes as a trap for 'others', has entirely forgotten that our country was torn apart for 80 years and longer because of religeous differences among ethnic Dutch. Now the left threatens to organize the same desaster, only because they cannot stay away from all these left wing voters from the 3rd world. But the left will achieve a phyrrus victory; what enters the left wing voter bloc will be more than compensated with 'white flight' to right wing parties like the PVV. The end effect is that parties on the left are being infiltrated and taken over by the muslims. This has happened in cities like Helmond.

And indeed, nothing wrong with a broodje shoarma.
 
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The wiki article also mentions Krege hasn't even disclosed when he did his "research". Can you enlighten us?

Ever heard of google?

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v19/v19n3p20_radar.html
For six days in October 1999, an Australian team headed by Richard Krege, a qualified electronics engineer, carried out an examination of the soil at the site of the former Treblinka II camp in Poland, where, Holocaust historians say, more than half a million Jews were put to death in gas chambers and then buried in mass graves.
 
I have said before that I get along surprisingly well with muslims. Far better than with lefties like you. Just like Dolfie. :D
You've said a lot of things that are untrue. Besides, Arabs were also on Hitler's hitlist, only not as high as the Jews, so his friendliness towards the Jerusalem Mufti was only temporary.

Our ddt, who likes to design history quizes as a trap for 'others', has entirely forgotten that our country was torn apart for 80 years and longer because of religeous differences among ethnic Dutch.
Your failure to answer a couple of simple questions on subjects to touch on betrays your ignorance on the subject. I'm happy you bring up the Dutch Revolt, it's my favourite piece of Dutch history. Did you actually know that the great majority of the 10,000 victims of Alba's Blood Council were (moderate) Catholics who didn't like either Philip II's heavy-handed persecution of Calvinists? Your "religious differences among ethnic Dutch" are a gross misrepresentation of the reasons for the revolt.

Thanks for showing again you know next-to-nothing about whatever subject you touch.
 
What were they expecting to see with Ground penetrating radar?

it's used routinely by Archeologists. Watch 'Time Team' on UK Channel 4 tosee it in action. It's results aren't clear images, they depend on soil type, moisture content and plant growth. Sometimes they survey a site with known archeology and the radar sees nothing, other times it shows what look like walls, foundations and floor levels and when they dig they find all natural.
 


This is extremely funny. Bradley Smith, a holocaust denier, announced in Tehran that there is no Krege Report. You think there is a Krege Report but cant link us to it.

1) What exact days did Krege visit Treblinka ( Krege doesn't know)
2) Where did they sleep for the five nights they were there ( Krege doesn't know)
3) Where did the raw digital data processed into 3D grids (Krege didn't get that far)
4) What was his "grid" ( Krege didn't map a grid )
5) What was his control sample for comparing soils ( Krege didn't get a control sample)
6) Which uni tested the soil samples in the videoa ( Krege didn't get that far)
7) Why did Krege fail to find the pits that were photographed in 1945 by the Polish Investigation? (Here is a photo)
http://www.deathcamps.org/treblinka/pic/bigp51.jpg
8) Krege says in the video that no bones were ever found at Treblinka. Here are photos of bones found at Treblika by the Polish investigation
http://www.deathcamps.org/treblinka/pic/bigp41.jpg

Krege is, shall we say, a bit unbalanced in the head and holocaust deniers haven't spoken to him for some years until he gets better.
 
What were they expecting to see with Ground penetrating radar?

it's used routinely by Archeologists. Watch 'Time Team' on UK Channel 4 tosee it in action. It's results aren't clear images, they depend on soil type, moisture content and plant growth. Sometimes they survey a site with known archeology and the radar sees nothing, other times it shows what look like walls, foundations and floor levels and when they dig they find all natural.

You will also notice that Stewart Ainsworth has to wait for his data to be processed at York University and fed back to him on location. ( I assume two people have to work on Saturdays and Sundays to process data for Stewart) Time Team is a great show. I studied Anthropological Prehistory at Sydney in the late 70's and we had nothing like the equipment Time Team has. I like Stewart because he knows all the simple assessment methods as well as high tech. He gets his hands dirty.
 
I have said before that I get along surprisingly well with muslims. Far better than with lefties like you. Just like Dolfie. :D

I do not dislike muslims, I dislike immigration of large groups with radical different identities then ours. Because in the end waits ethnic/religious strife and genocide.



But, isn't your claim that there was no genocide? At least not in western europe?

Our ddt, who likes to design history quizes as a trap for 'others', has entirely forgotten that our country was torn apart for 80 years and longer because of religeous differences among ethnic Dutch. Now the left threatens to organize the same desaster, only because they cannot stay away from all these left wing voters from the 3rd world. But the left will achieve a phyrrus victory; what enters the left wing voter bloc will be more than compensated with 'white flight' to right wing parties like the PVV. The end effect is that parties on the left are being infiltrated and taken over by the muslims. This has happened in cities like Helmond.



But the 'left' is not truly responsible for the immigration is it? Its mainly the larger coorperations looking for cheap workers that started the influx, combined with the dutch (western) dislike for doing said jobs as this would hold for the US and south american immigration too.
And the netherlands got rich and powerful exactly BY taking up large groups of immigrants of different etnicity. Without the contributions of the exiled jews and hugenots we'd have had a much worse history.

As for the last bit, I hope for you the PVV will never truly win in the Netherlands, as they'd make holocaust denial a crime.
 
"Two skulls unearthed at a probable mass grave near Philadelphia this month showed signs of violence, including a possible bullet hole."

[Holocaust denial logician]""Probable"?" .... "possible bullet hole?" ... by the rules of logic, and based on the similarities between the evidence for both, it is just as likely that his alleged hole in this supposed "skull" from this "probable" "mass grave" was the result of alien skull probes as a bullet.[/Holocaust denial logician]

As stated before this kind of technology can be used to determine the truth of the H-word once and for all.

Gilead et al, about Bełżec:
"The mass graves (Fig. 8) are up to five meters deep and their fill consists mostly of charcoal and cremated remains. About a fifth of the graves also contains decomposing corpses in the state of wax-fat transformation. Grave 10 is one of the biggest (24x18m) and the deepest (5.2m). It consists mainly of decomposing corpses, and at the depth of 4.4m there is a layer of lime. Lime is found in other graves too and was probably used to accelerate decomposi- tion. Mass grave 5, 32x10x4.5m, is also one of the largest graves, but it contains only layers of burnt human remains. The burnt fill is separated by sterile sand indicating multiple fill- ing. The drilling and the analysis of sediments suggest to the archaeologists that when the centre was eliminated, there were 33 mass graves. Kola distinguishes between two groups of graves: the first and probably the earlier one, consisting of twenty-one graves clustered in the western and north-western part of Bełżec, and the others in the north-eastern section of the site (Kola, 2000: 38-40)."
Excavating Nazi Extermination Centres - Isaac Gilead, Yoram Haimi and Wojciech Mazurek (2009)

Just one paragraph from the volumes of evidence. One additional survey won't have the slightest impact on the remaining fringe loons who continue to deny the Holocaust. You're not revisionists. You're Holocaust deniers. You continue looking for excuses to dismiss what has been established through many different investigations, using a variety of commonly accepted methods and tools. Including digging in the ground at the sites of former Aktion Reinhardt extermination camps.
There will always be details that will remain unknown. You latch onto those pretending that they invalidate what we do know. When some of the previously unclear details are explained by continued investigations you either ignore the results or try to twist them.

When work is performed that you previously demanded you try to wave it away with ever more tiresome nitpicking.

Kola, from Sobibór:
"In the spring phase, 4 hectares of the former camp III area were completely examined (i.e. hectares: XVII, XVIII, XXIV, XXV). In every one of them, 400 basic drills were made, with extra drills made in the areas of cultural interference locating relicts of anthropogenic structures. In this phase, they were divided into graves (usually obvious for the interpretation) and according to its natural STRATYGRAFICZNA interference, traces of a different kind of ground change, deriving from human influence. Their interpretation can only be possible by excavating. In hectare XVII, 90 extra drills were made. In hectare XVIII – 76 drills, XXIV – 18, and in XXV – 21. Altogether, 1805 drills were made in spring phase in the area of 4 hectares. Among those, in 1107 drills, there was found natural (without any anthropogenic interference) STRATYGRAFICZNY layout, where under existing layer of humus (on average 0 – 30 cm), yellowish, natural sand was found (Archaeologically speaking - CALEC – name of that kind of sand). Traces of graves were found in 128 drills. They are located in 7 vast areas, which we can assume to be holes with the remains of the murdered. The graves were up to 4 meters deep. Only in one case, the bottom of the grave (grave no 3) was 5.80 meters below the surface. The most obvious body burning was found in the bottom layers of those graves, where layers of burnt bones were found with 40 – 60 cm of thickness."
Prof. Andrzej Kola, "I Badania archeologiczne terenu byłego obozu zagłady Żydów w Sobiborze w 2001 r" ("1st Archaeological Research of the Former Jew Extermination Camp at Sobibor in 2001"), in: Przeszłość i Pamięć. Biuletyn Rady Ochrony Pamięci Walk i Męczeństwa Nr. 4 (21) z 2001 r, pages 115 to 123. Translated into English by Katarzyna Piotrowska.(Found at Holocaust Controversies)

[Petulant Holocaust deniers] - But what about Treblinka? -surely there you would finally prove it to us - we no want no ashes - we no need no bones- At the moment we only want a GPR study. We hand waved the other graves away but this time it would be different - why won't you indulge us? - You would convince us, once and for all![/petulant Holocaust deniers]

Post your links spambot. I'm sure you have them ready for another thread bump. Not that you'd want to further address the topic implied in the links you post, of course, because "We discussed this topic extensively earlier in this thread" and you're "Not going to comment on these quotes again." Loathe as you are of repeating yourself ...

[logician]Nazis or UFOs it's anybodies guess, really.[/logician]
 
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"Two skulls unearthed at a probable mass grave near Philadelphia this month showed signs of violence, including a possible bullet hole."

[Holocaust denial logician]""Probable"?" .... "possible bullet hole?" ... by the rules of logic, and based on the similarities between the evidence for both, it is just as likely that his alleged hole in this supposed "skull" from this "probable" "mass grave" was the result of alien skull probes as a bullet.[/Holocaust denial logician]

You are completely missing the point. I brought up this excavation merely for the application of ground penetrating radar in excavations. The significance is that with this equipment the proof of the holocaust can be delivered within a few weeks.

Gilead et al, about Bełżec:
"The mass graves (Fig. 8) are up to five meters deep and their fill consists mostly of charcoal and cremated remains. About a fifth of the graves also contains decomposing corpses in the state of wax-fat transformation. Grave 10 is one of the biggest (24x18m) and the deepest (5.2m). It consists mainly of decomposing corpses, and at the depth of 4.4m there is a layer of lime. Lime is found in other graves too and was probably used to accelerate decomposi- tion. Mass grave 5, 32x10x4.5m, is also one of the largest graves, but it contains only layers of burnt human remains. The burnt fill is separated by sterile sand indicating multiple fill- ing. The drilling and the analysis of sediments suggest to the archaeologists that when the centre was eliminated, there were 33 mass graves. Kola distinguishes between two groups of graves: the first and probably the earlier one, consisting of twenty-one graves clustered in the western and north-western part of Bełżec, and the others in the north-eastern section of the site (Kola, 2000: 38-40)."
Excavating Nazi Extermination Centres - Isaac Gilead, Yoram Haimi and Wojciech Mazurek (2009)

No revisionist denies the existence of forementioned mass graves. In the above example however casualty numbers are studiously ignored. According progaganda between 600,000 and 3 million people were supposed to murdered in Belzec: http://vho.org/dl/ENG/b.pdf

Just one paragraph from the volumes of evidence. One additional survey won't have the slightest impact on the remaining fringe loons who continue to deny the Holocaust. You're not revisionists. You're Holocaust deniers. You continue looking for excuses to dismiss what has been established through many different investigations, using a variety of commonly accepted methods and tools. Including digging in the ground at the sites of former Aktion Reinhardt extermination camps.
There will always be details that will remain unknown. You latch onto those pretending that they invalidate what we do know. When some of the previously unclear details are explained by continued investigations you either ignore the results or try to twist them.

Talking about 'evidence'. Here are documents from that show trial farce of yours in Nuremberg:

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/02-19-46.asp

"Camp Belsen (Bełżec) was founded in 1940; but it was in 1942 that the special electrical appliances were built in for mass extermination of people.... the doomed were undressed and then driven to the building where the floor was electrified in a special way; there they were killed."

But wait a minute, here we have a quote from the 1946 World Jewish Congress editted "Black book against the Jewish People":

"The Belzec camp is built underground. It is an electric crematorium..... Here the floor resembled an enormous plate. When the crowd of men stood on it, the floor sank deep into a pool of water. The moment the men sank up to their necks, a powerful electric current of millions of volts was passed through, killing them at once. The floor rose again, and a second electric current was passed through the bodies, burning them until nothing was left of the victims save a few ashes."

Looks very familiar indeed!

Nowdays the holocaust museum peddles this story:

United States Holocaust Memorial Museum website:
"Gassing operations at Belzec began in mid-March 1942.... Once the chamber doors were sealed, auxiliary police guards started an engine located outside the building housing the gas chambers. Carbon monoxide was funneled into the gas chambers, killing all those inside."

Gone, are the electrocution stories from that famous trial, presided by the largest mass murderers of history, the Bolsheviks. All stories made up in the Jewish lie kitchen.

[Petulant Holocaust deniers] - But what about Treblinka? -surely there you would finally prove it to us - we no want no ashes - we no need no bones- At the moment we only want a GPR study. We hand waved the other graves away but this time it would be different - why won't you indulge us? - You would convince us, once and for all![/petulant Holocaust deniers]

So let me gets this straight: if ground penetrating radar would show (as Krege claims he did) that there has never been a mass grave the size of 850,000 bodies in Treblinka, you would still maintain that the holo-tale does not have a substantial problem, to put it mildly?

Fascinating viewpoint.

From the conclusions of the Mattagno book on Belzec, page 109:

Polish archeological research has dealt the final deathblow to the official thesis: Its findings categorically disprove the possibility of burying 600,000 (or several hundred thousand), corpses, and the
quantity of bodies, bones, and ashes that was discovered are absolutely incompatible with such an enormous massacre. Moreover, the total absence of archeological evidence of the alleged extermination installations completely refutes the conflicting testimonies that are the basis for the extermination claims, testimonies Tregenza has already qualified “as not reliable” (rendering them thus doubly unreliable). The excavations at Belzec have therefore contributed greatly to revealing the truth – but not the official truth!

Now that the hypothesis of mass extermination has been ruled out, there remains only one alternative: Belzec was a transit camp for the transfer of Jews to the east.
 
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9/11 Investigator you're forgetting eye witness testimony from survivors & perpetrators. People saw the murders happen & gave evidence after the event.

I can produce 1,5 billion witnesses who will maintain before a court of law that Allah is God and the human Mohammed his prophet.

Any basic court can confirm that forensic evidence beats eyewitnesses any time on the evidence value scale.
 
You were about to reveal the Krege report, including his qualifications?

Oh, you meant to retract what you said about Krege. Ok, then. It's a good start towards honesty.
 
Any basic court can confirm that forensic evidence beats eyewitnesses any time on the evidence value scale.

But the evidence has to be presented to be validated. He does not even have to worry about historians dismissing his claims as part of the hoax.

Many occupations routinely use the technology todau and understand how to read the data. They could easily look over the information and either validate it or dismiss it
 
But the evidence has to be presented to be validated. He does not even have to worry about historians dismissing his claims as part of the hoax.

Many occupations routinely use the technology todau and understand how to read the data. They could easily look over the information and either validate it or dismiss it

True. I agree that Krege's work cannot be the final voice, since there is no report.

But do you agree with me that a forensic investigation, monitored by both sides in the debate, should conclusively establish that a mass grave once existed yes/no in Treblinka using ground penetrating radar?
 
But do you agree with me that a forensic investigation, monitored by both sides in the debate, should conclusively establish that a mass grave once existed yes/no in Treblinka using ground penetrating radar?

Not by itself. GPR can only tell you the ground was disturbed. It would have to be dug up to know what might be in there. It could be a pit grave or a rubbish dump that was filled in
 
True. I agree that Krege's work cannot be the final voice, since there is no report.

But do you agree with me that a forensic investigation, monitored by both sides in the debate, should conclusively establish that a mass grave once existed yes/no in Treblinka using ground penetrating radar?

GPR is used to determine where to dig by observing anomalies. However we don't have to do this because the official Polish investigation has already done the digging and found the evidence in 1945 when the evidence was fresh. 9/11 Investigator is quite aware ( as was Krege) that the top soil was covered when the gardens and monuments were built at Treblinka. He knows the top has been contaminated in this renovation and thus "blind" test pits have to be dug, which the Treblika Trust will not allow as this was already done in 1945 when the evidence was fresh. Krege did not obtain any permission to use his GPR at Treblinka because the trust would have informed him that the top soil was added during the renovation and thus GPR makes no sense. Krege went ahead because he was already a bit nutty. Now he is too nutty to get day release so even the holocaust deniers avoid him.

Just out of interest, what do you think Krege plugged his GPR into for power? Krege can't answer that question either. He never once mentioned taking a generator. He didn't connect to the tourist shop at Treblinka.

Here is a photo of Treblinka in 1945 by the Polish Investigation
http://www.deathcamps.org/treblinka/pic/bigp41.jpg
http://www.deathcamps.org/treblinka/pic/bigp51.jpg


Here is the current gardens at Treblinka.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/images/Holocaust/Treblinka26.jpg
 
You and you[r] friends are the ones who don't like the results.
Stop pretending that you are introducing people to archeology or to GPR technology.
When someone like Kola (or O'Neil) retrieve physical remains through digging and map the outlines of mass graves through digging you wankers still whine.
The contents of drill samples were Lab. analyzed and confirmed that the ashes contained human tissue - and still it isn't enough.
There is absolutely no reason to think that ADDITIONAL surveys will have the slightest impact on your refusal to see what is obvious to the rest of the planet. There is no test that convinces you because you don't want to be convinced. You keep looking for excuses to continue denying.

That was my first reply after you posted the article.

You are completely missing the point. [...]
So, no, I didn't miss your point. You just confirmed that my point was accurate -including the mocking caricature of denier methods that I added at the start of my second reply about the article.

With wave of hand, misinterpretation and deceptive calculations, Mattogno made not just the graves and their contents shrink and disappear into virtual nothingness but he also managed to wave away the people who were deported to Belzec.
Just about the only things in my parody of denier methods that is missing in Mattogno's pamphlet are the UFOs at the end to take 'em all away never to be seen again - but since you presume to speak for all deniers you get those UFOs for free, courtesy of Zuendel and Matt Giwer.

You claim that no denier wants ashes but there are several loons who want the ashes dug up and weighed for them. It's the final challenge, honest.

Mattogno will continue to write his pamphlets and you will continue to spam these forums with your misrepresentations of the record and your excuses regardless of whether or not additional surveys are conducted at Treblinka -with whatever tools.

First you pretend the graves aren't there. Despite older surveys confirming their presence. Then when new surveys confirm their presence you try to make them disappear through ever less convincing excuses. And continue denying as before.

Extensive refutations of Mattogno's claims by Roberto Muehlenkamp -and others- are online. Still you persist in denying. It is not all unreasonable to accept that the graves are large enough but you prefer to keep evading that conclusion.

What could a GPR study of Treblinka possibly change about that? Except for the inevitable movement of goal posts and a new - really this one will be the last challenge - ever - we promise - demand for something else.

You want to appear reasonable. You hope that reasonable people will nod in agreement when you say that a GPR survey at Treblinka hasn't been performed in the presence of both sides in the debate. You just want equal footing. A "teach the controversy wedge".

So who would represent each "team"? You pretend to speak for all Holocaust deniers here but, seriously, who should represent Holocaust deniers at such a survey? Whose presence could convince other Holocaust deniers that this was the final survey? As has been pointed out. There are hardly any deniers left and the few who are left rarely agree with each other.
The ones who could possibly attend such a survey could not convince the others of the inevitable outcome.

Before the GPR crews will have left the Treblinka site there will be demands for follow up excavations to confirm the data. Just in case, you know. To settle it, once and for all.
 
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Not by itself. GPR can only tell you the ground was disturbed. It would have to be dug up to know what might be in there. It could be a pit grave or a rubbish dump that was filled in

But that is exactly what we want to know!
If the soil turns out to be undisturbed then it is holocaust exit stage left.
 
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