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2nd Amendment for the U.K. -- long overdue

Dave Rogers said:
Personally, I'm fine with them. I don't particularly want to shoot anyone, so I find it quite convenient that nobody else is allowed to shoot me. With fewer legal guns in the country, we have fewer illegal guns, so in general criminals don't have easy access to firearms, and in general tend not to use them casually. Our rate of firearms-related deaths is typically around thirty times lower than that in the USA, and I'm OK with that too. In general the political trend in the UK has been towards tighter rather than looser gun control, mainly because the evidence suggests that's what the majority of the population actually wants.

Of course, our oppressive tyrannical government is forcing me to say all this so you'll have to take it with a pinch of salt.

Dave
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Being an island nation helps. The U.S. borders a third world country where 2,700 people cross illegally everyday, often with illegal possessions. Obviously, it's going to have higher firearm-related death.

See, threads like this disheartens me. In the U.K., is the prevailing attitude "never fight back?" If so, not all is well in Brittania. Home-invasion robberies seems like a piece of cake. I expect to see more gun-related deaths in U.K.
 
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UNLoVedRebel said:
Much like oral hygiene, the Brits haven't got a clue about gun rights. After that crazy taxi cab mother ****er shot a bunch of unarmed civilians, it's about time the U.K. thought about adopting its own 2nd Amendment-type gun rights legislation. How many more people have to die before the Brits start carrying guns?
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That sounds like a really good idea, let everyone carry a gun, unless you're an ordinary cop.

Perhaps the Poms should consider arming all of their police officers instead.
 
lionking said:
When it gets within a bulls roar of the US gun death rate, come back and make an argument.
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As I said, it never will. The U.K. and Australia are Island nations. The U.S. borders two countries. One is a third world country, and the other is Mexico.
 
Fiona said:
I think that you just have to understand that this is a profound cultural difference, hard as you may find it to believe

There is NO substantial dissent about the gun laws in this country. We like them the way they are. Episodes like this just reinforce that view. I have never heard anyone suggest it is a reason for liberalising gun laws. That argument seems to make sense to americans: even those who disagree with it. For people in the UK it is a clear sign of insanity.
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Cultural differences indeed sweetheart. In the U.S., you are allowed to fight back against an attacker. I've never been to the U.K, but I'm starting to think that's illegal. In 2005, Scotland was named the most violent country in the developed world by a United Nations report. Wales and England were tied for second. Australia and New Zealand weren't far behind. Must be pretty easy for the criminals when everyone's a sitting duck.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/4257966.stm
 
Yes, I read that article. It has absolutley nothing to do with firearms. It also has nothing to do with real life, but that is another question. But let us suppose it is true: then what do we conclude? For you there is a deterrent effect if the population is armed. For me then those who are committing assaults would do so with guns if they had them. So our murder rate might equal yours: one concomitant effect would be a reduction in the number of assaults: because they would be reclassified. As murder. I do not think that is much of a gain :)
 
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UNLoVedRebel said:
Much like oral hygiene, the Brits haven't got a clue about gun rights. After that crazy taxi cab mother ****er shot a bunch of unarmed civilians, it's about time the U.K. thought about adopting its own 2nd Amendment-type gun rights legislation. How many more people have to die before the Brits start carrying guns?
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Much like irony, Americans haven't got a clue about gun rights. After repeated school shootings by $%@#heads who picked up guns like most citizens get their dry cleaning, it's about time the U.S. thought about dropping outdated and frankly stupid gun laws. How many more people have to die before the Yanks stop carrying guns?

Oooh, this is fun!
 
UNLoVedRebel said:
Cultural differences indeed sweetheart. In the U.S., you are allowed to fight back against an attacker. I've never been to the U.K, but I'm starting to think that's illegal. In 2005, Scotland was named the most violent country in the developed world by a United Nations report. Wales and England were tied for second. Australia and New Zealand weren't far behind. Must be pretty easy for the criminals when everyone's a sitting duck.
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You're just trolling now. Melbourne has 4 million people and there is not a street I wouldn't happily and safely walk down unarmed. Can you name a city of the same size in the USA where you would do this?
 
Mojo said:
I see no reason we need a militia.
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So if China lobs a nuke at us we can shoot at it with our guns.

Nah, I'm being facetious.

We might get to plink tanks with rifle fire before we get blown up by artillery.


The whole American militia to defend the land thing is like the anti-rattlesnake bracelet.

"Well, has the U.S. ever been invaded in the last 200 years? The militia threat must be working"
 
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UNLoVedRebel said:
Being an island nation helps. The U.S. borders a third world country where 2,700 people cross illegally everyday, often with illegal possessions. Obviously, it's going to have higher firearm-related death.
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I'm sorry, I'm clearly being obtuse, but could you fill in the steps that lead from your second sentence to that 'Obviously'?

Are you saying that all gun deaths are due to Mexicans? Or Canadians?
 
UNLoVedRebel said:
Much like oral hygiene, the Brits haven't got a clue about gun rights. After that crazy taxi cab mother ****er shot a bunch of unarmed civilians, it's about time the U.K. thought about adopting its own 2nd Amendment-type gun rights legislation. How many more people have to die before the Brits start carrying guns?
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I don't follow your logic on this or the point zooterkin mentioned. Widespread availability of guns in the US hasn't prevented mass shootings there, has it?
 
Hahahahahahaha.

Bahahahahahaha.

Haha. Ha. Haha.

Wait, you were being serious?

Hahaha. No.

We don't WANT guns here. We're happy without them. We don't want people who legally purchased firearms, like Derrick Bird did to go mental, and that's far more likely to happen if you allow more people to buy guns. Whenever something like this happens in the US the British media is all over it decrying a society that freely allows ownership of devices that are solely and entirely made for killing. We don't want that. We are, in general, absolutely horrified by the idea of every person having a gun, because the gun crime rate would skyrocket.


According to the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime in the year 2000 England and Wales had the second lowest recorded number of firearm homicides in all the countries covered behind Singapore at 0.12 per 100 000 people. It also had a reasonably low overall homicide rate of 1.45 per 100 000.

The United States on the other hand had an overall homicide rate of 4.55 per 100 000. Of these, a quite frankly disturbing 65% were committed with a firearm of some kind. The US percentage of all homicides committed using a gun was third overall behind Guatemala (75%) and Colombia (85%). The fourth placed nation was Costa Rica (51%).

I'm sorry, but the thought of letting guns into the country scares the living bejesus out of me. I don't want them. We don't need them. Don't try and get us to accept them.
 
Sword_Of_Truth said:
If the only thing you can think of to do with a gun is kill things, then you shouldn't have one.
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I didn't say that's all you could do with them. Are you intentionally misrepresenting me, or are you simple?

I said that it is designed to kill things. It doesn't even have to be people either, because you kill animals with them (and you know what? When it's for food, I am completely behind it. Hunting for food gets no negative comments from me).

You buy a gun to....do what with?

You can go hunting. That's killing things.

You can shoot targets. That isn't killing things, but unless you're a sports person it seems pretty pointless, unless it's to improve your aim for....killing things.

I suppose you could threaten someone with it. It isn't killing anything, but it's threatening to.

So tell me, oh mystical gun owning guru, aside from target shooting which I already mentioned and threatening to kill someone, what can you do with a gun that makes them so much like a thneed, for a thneed is something everyone needs.

Guns? Not so much.
 
UNLoVedRebel said:
As I said, it never will. The U.K. and Australia are Island nations. The U.S. borders two countries. One is a third world country, and the other is Mexico.
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And Germany has borders with nine countries. So what's your point?
 
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