Merged 2019-nCoV / Corona virus

Status
Not open for further replies.
There was a public health conference here today. Wow! They picked this guy up from his home and transported him in a "pod" to an isolation unit at a nearby hospital where robots are providing much of the care!

The patient is doing fine BTW and they aren't doing any contact tracing before his symptoms developed, like on the plane or in the airport.

I'd hope as a matter of routine epidemiology they might want to know who he sat next to on the plane from China. It would be a good indicator of infectiousness or not before symptom onset.
 
Last edited:
I'd hope as a matter of routine epidemiology they might want to know who he sat next to on the plane from China. It would be a good indicator of infectiousness or not before symptom onset.

Well, they'll find out if there's an explosion of cases in the next week.

I'd have to say, three weeks after the announcement, the number of cases isn't increasing as fast as it looked a week ago, but it's still probably a week away from knowing one way or the other with certainty.

It's also possibly a bit reminiscent of Mexican 'flu - where lots of people had it so mildly they never got counted. With the range of symptoms so far, there could be a lot of people thinking they just have a cold. Being winter, they wouldn't be too surprised, and it is a first cousin to one of the cold viruses.
 
The company I work for makes cleaning products, including hard surface disinfectants. Our sales reps in the US and Canada are already getting asked about products effective against this. I've been asked to put together a letter for them detailing which of our products are effective against coronaviruses. Fortunately, the answer is "nearly all of them."
The CDC website just says "Use a diluted bleach solution or a household disinfectant with a label that says “EPA-approved.”" to treat surfaces. That obviously won't help with direct person-to-person transmission, of course.
 
The company I work for makes cleaning products, including hard surface disinfectants.

I'd say shares in companies manufacutirng face masks are a good bet right now.

Some highly disturbing news out of Scotland, of all places - bloody long way from China - where they have four suspected cases: https://www.theguardian.com/science...-coronavirus-uk-health-secretary-matt-hancock

If that turns out correct, and that likelihood seems fairly high, it must be fairly easily communicated, because they will have caught it just in everyday life in Wuhan, which means that there must be tens of thousands of cases.

Hmmm.
 
Aaand we've gone from "thousands of times less dangerous than influenza" to "armed lockdown of three Chinese cities and 18 million people..."

https://www.greenwichtime.com/news/article/Wuhan-quarantine-expands-as-Chinese-fear-14997682.php

Despite China's reaction:
Vox: The coronavirus outbreak is not yet a global health emergency, WHO says
It’s also possible that as officials find more patients with the virus, we’ll learn it is milder than it appears to be right now, Frieden said. “There is still an enormous amount we don’t know about how and how readily it spreads and how often it causes severe illness.” He added, “The fact that hundreds of millions of people will be traveling right now in China, let’s just say, is not great timing.”
 
And it's not tracking that far off SARS.

SARS was 8000 cases & 776 deaths, the 2019-nCoV is sitting at 800 cases & 26 deaths, so a rate 1/3 of SARS.

Plus christ knows how many infected and not picked up.

Chinese lockdown now sitting at 10 cities and 60,000,000 people: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-51230011
 
Last edited:
It's nothing like SARS.

It's more like a really nasty cold no one has immunity to spreading around the world.
 
I've been to Chinese Night Markets were you can usually find multiple places that have live snake that they will kill and drain the blood before your eyes - drinking warm snake blood is, ironically, considered great for your health.
 
It's nothing like SARS.

It's more like a really nasty cold no one has immunity to spreading around the world.

I think this is not an appropriate description. This virus appears to cause a severe occasionally fatal pneumonia in a proportion of people infected. The common cold does not cause fatal pneumonia.

The actual fatality rate does not need to be high to cause problems for modern health care systems. If you just have a surge in people with pneumonia requiring hospital care e.g. oxygen this can be crippling for the care system. If the infection is transmissible then this leads to a huge need for isolation facilities which may be limited.

Some actual facts.
https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/clinical-management-of-novel-cov.pdf
https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...s-epidemiology-virology-and-clinical-features
 
33 million people now under lockdown. Scary stuff whatever the severity of the illness itself because of the strain it will put on people’s lives and medical infrastructure.
 
Oh no! Two Chinese tourists in Finland from Wuhan are suspected of being suspected of being infected with the Death Virus.
 
This one is new to science, though, and appears to have come from bats, which are eaten in the area where it first occurred.
Bruce Wayne remains unavailable for comment.

Bats... chicken of the cave! I will never watch Anchorman 2 the same way again!
 
An interesting entry about bats:

Molecular studies have demonstrated that bats are natural host reservoirs for several recently emerged high-profile zoonotic viruses, including sudden acute respiratory syndrome–like coronaviruses (4); Ebola and Marburg hemorrhagic fever filoviruses (5,6); rabies and rabies-related lyssaviruses; and many paramyxoviruses, including rubulaviruses and Nipah and Hendra viruses (7–9).

....

In a recent comparative analysis, Luis et al. (3) showed bats to be more likely to be infected with more zoonotic viruses per host species than were rodents, thus adding weight to the suggestion that bats might in some way be unique as sources of emerging zoonoses. In areas where these viruses have been studied, some viral groups (e.g., coronaviruses, astroviruses, paramyxoviruses) have much higher viral diversity and prevalence in bats than in sympatric species of rodents (9,11).


Also it made me wonder whether the preliminary study that traced the virus to snakes means maybe snakes got it from bats by eating them.
 
Last edited:
I think this is not an appropriate description. This virus appears to cause a severe occasionally fatal pneumonia in a proportion of people infected. The common cold does not cause fatal pneumonia.

The actual fatality rate does not need to be high to cause problems for modern health care systems. If you just have a surge in people with pneumonia requiring hospital care e.g. oxygen this can be crippling for the care system. If the infection is transmissible then this leads to a huge need for isolation facilities which may be limited.

Some actual facts.
https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/clinical-management-of-novel-cov.pdf
https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...s-epidemiology-virology-and-clinical-features
I said, "a really nasty cold no one has immunity to spreading around the world."

If you hear that as "the common cold" then you don't understand what I mean. And if you believe, "The common cold does not cause fatal pneumonia," you are mistaken.

RSV causes common cold symptoms. https://www.cdc.gov/rsv/research/us-surveillance.html
Each year in the United States, RSV leads, on average, to—

2.1 million outpatient visits among children younger than 5 years old-1
57,527 hospitalizations among children younger than 5 years old-1
177,000 hospitalizations among adults older than 65 years-2
14,000 deaths among adults older than 65 years-2
Why aren't people panicked about that?

Pertussis reemerged in epidemic proportions more than a decade ago.
https://www.cdc.gov/pertussis/countries/index.html
In 2018, the World Health Organization external icon (WHO) reported 151,074 pertussis cases globally. Based on 2008 data WHO estimated that there were 89,000 deaths. However, a publication modeling pertussis cases and deaths with data from 2014 estimates that there were 24.1 million pertussis cases and 160,700 deaths in children younger than 5 years worldwide.
Why aren't people panicked about that?

Current influenza status:
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/?deliveryName=USCDC_7_3-DM17996
CDC estimates that so far this season, there have been at least 15 million flu illnesses, 140,000 hospitalizations and 8,200 deaths from flu.
Why aren't people panicked about that?



This new virus strain is going to spread around the world. There's a certain point where it is too late to put the genie back in the bottle and this has passed that point. It will be severe in some populations, especially the elderly and people with pre-existing conditions.

We've not heard yet about cases in India, and countries in Africa.
https://africatimes.com/2020/01/22/theres-mounting-concern-for-africas-exposure-to-new-coronavirus/
Most of the top destinations from Wuhan Tianhe airport are in Asia, with the exception of two Australian airports and one in Dubai, United Arab Emirates, according to a rapid report for the Journal of Travel Medicine. Dubai has long served as a travel hub for passengers to and from the African continent, surpassed only by Addis Ababa in 2018. Among others, Air China operates flights between Shenzhen and Johannesburg, while China Southern flies between Nairobi and Shenzhen, according to Forward Keys industry analysts.
China has had a growing financial interest in Africa for a couple decades. It is unlikely there are no cases in African countries yet. One thing we learned in extensive planning when H5N1 flu threatened to explode into a pandemic was the lack of public health infrastructure in many African countries and major cities. India had similar problems.

It was suggested that if a novel fu outbreak wasn't stopped in the first few weeks, we would not be able to stop it. The reason and why that differed from SARS was, with flu one has millions of mild cases that go under the radar.

Assessment of US hospital capacity including ICU capacity was done during flu pandemic planning. With a novel coronavirus there could be a problem but it won't likely be a total disaster.



From WHO
On [22 Jan 2020], the members of the Emergency Committee expressed divergent views on whether this event constitutes a PHEIC or not. At that time, the advice was that the event did not constitute a PHEIC, but the Committee members agreed on the urgency of the situation and suggested that the Committee should be reconvened in a matter of days to examine the situation further.

ProMed Moderator comment:
[The suggestion of the committee of the need for a more graded system of alerts to replace the current black-or-white "it's a PHEIC" vs "it's not a PHEIC" is an excellent suggestion. The current system permits politics to enter into the equation, leading to direct economic impacts on the countries are confronting the binary choice of "bad" versus "good" rather than "not so bad", "cautionary bad".... - Mod.MPP]


Given all that, what is it you expect me to post? I look at the media hype and my past experience with these threats and want to point out the media is very much hyping this story. Yes, they should be reporting about the attempts of China to isolate whole cities. That's a huge story. The cases showing up in different countries is an important story.

But they continue to call it "the deadly coronavirus" Do they call influenza, "the deadly influenza"? The deadly pertussis outbreak? The media might commonly add those adjectives from time to time, generally about clusters of deaths that occur intermittently.

This is a bad pathogen. No one has immunity. It is going to spread around the world like a wildfire. The fatality rate will not be in the millions, maybe 10s of thousands worldwide, but not millions. It will be high among older people and people with preexisting conditions. I fit that category because I'm on a high dose of prednisone.

I already checked, waterless hand cleaners with high enough alcohol content will destroy the virus on your hands. I already wash my hands all the time. I will be making sure I have waterless hand cleaner in my car and purse. I'll be more conscientious about all that for a while.

There is nothing to panic about. And it is going to spread.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom