• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

2012 Debates

Meadmaker said:
What the debate, and the post debate polling, demonstrated was that if you let Romney yammer vaguely, he'll win. He can promise less work for more pay just as well as the next guy. It's time to force some real talk.
Click to expand...

Romney's had a year of campaigning by flip-flopping. No one, neither Democrat nor Republican, has been able to pin him to any specific stances and attack him.

I hope that's a good thing. What I mean by that is that I hope the American people would actually listen to real talk instead of 9 second sound bites. Obama has to do it. We'll see if he does.
Click to expand...

I think that there's less than a 50-50 chance of this happening.
 
UNLoVedRebel said:
I wonder how Mitt Romney will peform as he squares off with his number one opponent, Mitt Romney.

As Mitt Romney criticizes the social policies of Mitt Romney, Mitt Romney will attack Mitt Romney for his view on Health Care.
Click to expand...

It was a good debate, but I think Mitt Romney lost this one. He just couldn't hold off the attacks of Mitt Romney. Maybe Mitt Romney will learn how to counter the points of Mitt Romney.

 
UNLoVedRebel said:
It was a good debate, but I think Mitt Romney lost this one. He just couldn't hold off the attacks of Mitt Romney. Maybe Mitt Romney will learn how to counter the points of Mitt Romney.

Click to expand...

I would argue he won. He's neck and neck right now with Obama, when he should be 10 pts behind. He won.
 
Caper said:
I would argue he won. He's neck and neck right now with Obama, when he should be 10 pts behind. He won.
Click to expand...
I'm not certain you got the point. Did you watch the video? If you did and you get it then I'm sorry for questioning you. You should have added a smiley. :)
 
Meadmaker said:
The real substance of their tax plans is that Obama wants to raise taxes on the wealthy. Romney wants to cut taxes for everyone.
Click to expand...

Except that during the debate Romney said that he won't lower taxes for the wealthiest Americans. Flip-flop. That Etch-a-Sketch is getting a workout.

Steve S
 
RandFan said:
I'm not certain you got the point. Did you watch the video? If you did and you get it then I'm sorry for questioning you. You should have added a smiley. :)
Click to expand...

My point is, that despite being the most rampant flip flopper I have ever seen... he is actually doing quite well, better then he should. If he wins this thing... I might have to call him one of the most skilled politicians I've ever seen.... if not one of the slimiest.
 
Brown said:
Romney's positions shift like the sand in a strong wind, and Obama could not predict what Romney's "position du jour" would be, especially since there seems to be no concerns on Romney's part about consistency or hypocrisy. How can one prepare for a debate against a man who changes his views as often as he changes his socks?

The impression I got was that Obama was irritated. Here, a month before the election, he has to face a man who disregards much of what he'd said over the past year, and there was no way to guess what was going to come out of Romney's pie-hole. ...
Click to expand...
Brown said:
I wager that the President was counseled NOT to be snarky, NOT to try to crack wise, NOT to do any name-calling. Not only are such tactics arguably un-presidential (an argument with which I do not necessarily agree; Truman's character was such that he could do all three with ease and to good effect), they aren't Obama. Also, they are risky things to do in a debate.
...
The President was too gracious not to call Romney a lying son of a bitch.
Click to expand...
Someone else concurs with this analysis.
President Obama said:
Well, two things. I mean, you know, the debate, I think it’s fair to say I was just too polite, because, you know, it’s hard to sometimes just keep on saying and what you’re saying isn't true. It gets repetitive. But, you know, the good news is, is that’s just the first one. Governor Romney put forward a whole bunch of stuff that either involved him running away from positions that he had taken, or doubling down on things like Medicare vouchers that are going to hurt him long term.
Click to expand...
As many have pointed out, Romney's two-faced-ness is reaching extraordinary proportions. He takes public positions on important issues--with full knowledge and awareness that the cameras are recording--and then he or his campaign RECANTS those very same positions HOURS later.

This is beyond flip-flopping. It is beyond mere lying. It is beyond hypocrisy. It is an utter surrender of integrity and trustworthiness. It is unashamedly saying what is expedient rather than what is authentic. It is a repeated pattern of loudly deflecting questions about unpopular stances by purporting to change them, then quietly reaffirming those very same stances later.

This isn't what men with the courage of their convictions do. This isn't even what good politicians do. This what poltroons do.
 
Caper said:
My point is, that despite being the most rampant flip flopper I have ever seen... he is actually doing quite well, better then he should. If he wins this thing... I might have to call him one of the most skilled politicians I've ever seen.... if not one of the slimiest.
Click to expand...
If this chicken-hearted tactic of being expedient rather than authentic gets Romney the White House, then you can expect to see more politicians adopt it. And you may as well just acknowledge that the majority of voters in the States are uninformed, have ultra-short memories, or are just drop-dead stupid, because this tactic only "works" if these things are true.
 
Caper said:
My point is, that despite being the most rampant flip flopper I have ever seen... he is actually doing quite well, better then he should. If he wins this thing... I might have to call him one of the most skilled politicians I've ever seen.... if not one of the slimiest.
Click to expand...
After week after week after week of **** ups, goofs, gaffes and idiotic moves I don't know how one could call that skilled. Romney has won only a small fraction of the news cycles since he became the presumptive nominee. I could not honestly call that skilled. Not sure how anyone else could either. But hey, if a single good debate performance makes him skilled in your eyes then that's your opinion. I think you are entitled to at least that. Right?
 
Brown said:
Someone else concurs with this analysis.As many have pointed out, Romney's two-faced-ness is reaching extraordinary proportions. He takes public positions on important issues--with full knowledge and awareness that the cameras are recording--and then he or his campaign RECANTS those very same positions HOURS later.

This is beyond flip-flopping. It is beyond mere lying. It is beyond hypocrisy. It is an utter surrender of integrity and trustworthiness. It is unashamedly saying what is expedient rather than what is authentic. It is a repeated pattern of loudly deflecting questions about unpopular stances by purporting to change them, then quietly reaffirming those very same stances later.

This isn't what men with the courage of their convictions do. This isn't even what good politicians do. This what poltroons do.
Click to expand...

We'll have to hope that he has the ability to turn in off when he needs to. If he tries to deal with other countries the way he has been dealing with American voters, our foreign relations will be a disaster.
 
Does anybody think tonight's VP debate can have any impact on the current trends? I think Biden can help the cause by changing the media dialogue before the next Romney-Obama debate but I doubt many voters will be swayed (if they choose to tune in.) I think Ryan can be held accountable for the illogic of the new Romney budget "plan" but expect he will have some surprising come-back when Biden says that the number's don't make sense that will rock Biden back on his heels a bit. I'm also curious to see how Ryan handles foreign policy issues.
 
steve s said:
Except that during the debate Romney said that he won't lower taxes for the wealthiest Americans. Flip-flop. That Etch-a-Sketch is getting a workout.

Steve S
Click to expand...

Not really. He said he wouldn't lower the "share" paid by the wealthiest Americans. If you cut everyone's taxes at a consistent rate, then the wealthiest still pay the same share at they did before.

That's his plan. Or at least that's what he says he will do. Cut taxes for everyone. Raise the military budget. In the debates he added firing Big Bird, which he says he'll do right on his web page.

If it could work, I'd be all for it. Yay, tax cuts for everyone. How could anyone possibly oppose it?
 
Brown said:
If this chicken-hearted tactic of being expedient rather than authentic gets Romney the White House, then you can expect to see more politicians adopt it.
Click to expand...
LOL, as if this hasn't been done throughout history, including by BO.

And you may as well just acknowledge that the majority of voters in the States are uninformed, have ultra-short memories, or are just drop-dead stupid, because this tactic only "works" if these things are true.
Click to expand...
We got BO didn't we?
 
TellyKNeasuss said:
We'll have to hope that he has the ability to turn in off when he needs to. If he tries to deal with other countries the way he has been dealing with American voters, our foreign relations will be a disaster.
Click to expand...
We all know that foreigners don't vote for US President. But foreigners do pay attention to who the US President is, how he behaves, what he says, and whether he is trustworthy. In this part of Canada, Canadians have been doing just that. They see Romney's credibility as virtually non-existent.

As a matter of basic political theory, an elected official has a hard time getting a mandate by running a strictly negative campaign. If all the candidate does is say what he's against, electing the candidate doesn't mean that the public agrees with what he's FOR. Romney has taken this screw-the-mandate-crap attitude to new levels by flat-out REFUSING to give details of what's he's for, and by taking MULTIPLE positions on issues (many of which are quietly "walked back" later).

No mandate for you!!

But imagine Romney as president, in a position like that of John F. Kennedy fifty years ago. The Soviets were installing nuclear missiles in Cuba, and the Soviets didn't think that Kennedy had the resolve to do anything about it. Would Romney have the resolve? Remember, Romney was too scared to support going into Pakistan after bin Laden, but Obama had the resolve to do it, and now bin Laden is fish food. Might some foreign baddies, seeing that Romney has run a campaign in which he was afraid to take stands, and noticing that he won't even stand up to others in his party, and being aware that he has changed his positions as often as he changes his socks, think that Romney lacks backbone?
 
I think this debate could have more of an impact then previous VP debates because of the previous debate. Romney has clear momentum and if Biden doesn't at least hold his own, that momentum will pick up a bit more. If he doesn't, the meme in the (damn liberal) mainstream media until the next debate will be the Republican tickets is well above the Democratic one.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom