Continuation Part Seven: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[Kaosium]

Murder.

Did you really not know that? It was in all the papers.

Why do you need three murderers when you only have evidence of one? How many murders have more than one perpetrator anyway? What do you suppose the odds are that two kids arrested on (undisputed) bogus or mistaken evidence were still involved once they caught the burglar who'd recently been caught breaking into other places and caught with stolen goods from other burglaries in the area?

What do you suppose the odds are of that?

 

[RWVBWL]

They won't flinch in front of logic.

Heya Machiavelli,
Logically speaking here from the beaches of Los Angeles, I need to ask you, as you're an Italian male,
Do you have any idea whom the other DNA on Miss Kercher's bra clasp belongs too?

Hey Machiavelli,
Is it logical for a person who is going to test crime scene samples to also travel from Rome to Perugia to collect them too?

Is it logical to pick up and collect a critical sample for DNA testing while wearing visibly dirty rubber gloves,
instead of using new, sterile tweezers?

And then pass it around to a friendly colleague?

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/TheBraClasp.html

 

[RoseMontague]

Despite all the Devotional Drivel posted here, regardless of how many guided trips thru Meridith's bowels(ugh) and regardless of tales of Two Girls one Bra and ignoring proof that the window could be entered by any random world class climber the court found her guilty.

It's almost as if Italian courts don't take any notice of obscure internet forums.

Well you took notice. So what is your theory of the crime? Based on the last few years I have the impression your theory is whatever the Italian courts (except the one that found them innocent of course) said must be right because they are judges or something.

Would love to see you discuss your theories in this discussion forum.

 

[acbytesla]

They won't flinch in front of logic.
See:

What logic? That seems to be impossible inside an Italian court of law. Sort of an oxymoron.

The fact that the theory expressed above does not make any logical sense, they consider it an irrelevant detail.

What theory?

• The theory that the murder was a sacrificial rite base on All Saints day?
• The Masonic conspiracy?
• That Amanda and Rudy and Raffaele, three people that had never been known to have ever spent a minute in the same room together, that not a single email, text or phone call between them forcibly raped Meredith and killed her?
  
• That Amanda killed Meredith because she was jealous?
• That Amanda killed Meredith because she was caught stealing her money?
• That Amanda killed Meredith over Rudy's poop?

Sadly the court didn't even listen to the RIS analyst who insisted that at least two tests are required to be consider as actual evidence.

That's one screwed up country you live in Machiavelli.

 

[acbytesla]

Despite all the Devotional Drivel posted here, regardless of how many guided trips thru Meridith's bowels(ugh) and regardless of tales of Two Girls one Bra and ignoring proof that the window could be entered by any random world class climber the court found her guilty.

It's almost as if Italian courts don't take any notice of obscure internet forums.

Makes sense. It's clear they don't actually take notice of the evidence ..or the lack of evidence either.

 

[tsig]

Yeah, I'm sure the City of Seattle will suspend all other activities to fight this.

I understand they wanted to rename the city Knoxville but at the last moment discovered that had been taken.

 

[JREF2010]

Given how pathetic the courts over there have been I don't see why anyone expected anything different. Especially when you factor in the politics and cya going on here.

Doesn't the supreme court have to re-affirm this or something?

Around here no one takes the court seriously....its like some 3rdworld goofball court convicted off ignorance. The political powers in Italy and the inbreds like Maresca and Migs may as well put it in each other for all most care. It was a retarded trial from day one.....convicting on the Poop Motive....enough. said.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I understand they wanted to rename the city Knoxville but at the last moment discovered that had been taken.

 

[tsig]

Putting innocent people in jail has a bad effect on society. So what is your theory of the crime?

Amanda did it with the knife in the bedroom.

 

[RWVBWL]

What logic? That seems to be impossible inside an Italian court of law. Sort of an oxymoron.

What theory?

• The theory that the murder was a sacrificial rite base on All Saints day?
• The Masonic conspiracy?
• That Amanda and Rudy and Raffaele, three people that had never been known to have ever spent a minute in the same room together, that not a single email, text or phone call between them forcibly raped Meredith and killed her?
  
• That Amanda killed Meredith because she was jealous?
• That Amanda killed Meredith because she was caught stealing her money?
• That Amanda killed Meredith over Rudy's poop?

Sadly the court didn't even listen to the RIS analyst who insisted that at least two tests are required to be consider as actual evidence.

That's one screwed up country you live in Machiavelli.

I agree, ACbyTesla!
Tragic how the pro guilters elsewhere periodically mention the Amanda Knox middle age white knight club,
but it's ok in Italy for 60 year old men to **** 10 year old girlz,
because it's romantic...
Pfffft!

 

[Kaosium]

Amanda did it with the knife in the bedroom.

Without leaving any trace of herself, using a knife that tested negative repeatedly for blood and couldn't possibly have made one of the wounds, according even to the prosecution. Then they put it back in the drawer and ate with it the rest of the week so the police could seize it, find discredited (lab contamination!) DNA 'evidence' they didn't identify on the knife or the amount and lied about in court.

What did Rudy Guede, who left his evidence on Meredith, inside Meredith, on her pillow, her clothes and who left shoeprints all over her floor do in your scenario?

 

[tsig]

Around here no one takes the court seriously....its like some 3rdworld goofball court convicted off ignorance. The political powers in Italy and the inbreds like Maresca and Migs may as well put it in each other for all most care. It was a retarded trial from day one.....convicting on the Poop Motive....enough. said.

I guess everyone can just ignore the ruling then?

 

[Kaosium]

I guess everyone can just ignore the ruling then?

Raffaele can't.

 

[Rolfe]

My sister who is a lawyer and consequently uninterested in this case ("criminal law is dismal"), has said to me that there is judicial truth and external reality. The court case is it's own little universe and the only facts are those presented to and accepted by the court.

I wonder if this really does all hinge on the Guede conviction, and the ruling by that court that others were involved as well as Guede? That subsequent courts were bound by that ruling and therefore had to convict, and Hellmann erred in law on some sort of strict liability basis?

Rolfe.

 

[Bill Williams]

You mean, knife carrying, druggie Raffaele Sollecito hooking up with knife carrying drug dealer Rudy Guede?

Sounds like a perfect match.

Ad hominems aside, that's the issue isn't it.... there is no record at all of them ever having met. But apparently in Italian courts a prosecutor only needs to allege that they met, and the court convicts.

I wonder if Italians themselves feel safe living under a system where the prosecution and/or convicting courts can got through 7 different theories of the crime, and still convict?

Sounds like a country to be avoided.

 

[Ampulla of Vater]

Depends a bit on the political climate of the US at the time it comes up. A conservative administration would view Amanda as a spoiled liberal who committed murder and should be put to death. They will not even look at the scientific evidence and will dismiss out of hand allegations of police and prosecutorial misconduct. They might even make a show of it with a perp walk.

Do you have any evidence of conservative governments being more likely to extradite liberals, not looking at scientific evidence, and/or dismissing allegations of police and prosecutorial misconduct? I didn't think so. You are just spreading fear of a conservative government because it suits your political agenda.

 

[Bill Williams]

Can you venture an opinion what crime they were convicted of?

Murder.

Did you really not know that? It was in all the papers.

You are getting there, but not quite to start putting people away......

Was it premeditated? Was it the result of Mededith (completely uncharacteristically) throwing a fit because of Amanda's cleanliness? Was it Massei's "brief choice for evil"? Was it the ISC's sex game gone wrong?

I guess these things are unimportant... which begs the question as to why the prosecutors/courts themselves keep bringing it up and changing them.

I'm sure if you thought about it you'd not want to live under such a system.

 

[Dougm]

I wonder if this really does all hinge on the Guede conviction, and the ruling by that court that others were involved as well as Guede? That subsequent courts were bound by that ruling and therefore had to convict, and Hellmann erred in law on some sort of strict liability basis?

Rolfe.

If it is, that clearly violates US judicial standards. They could ignore that, and extradite her anyway, but it's a pretty blatent contradition to the rights contained in the US Constitution.

 

[Rolfe]

Well, it was one of the reasons the ISC gave for overturning Hellmann. If it features at all prominently in the motivations report of the present court, it could be a very strong legal point. I'm thinking as much for the ECHR as extradition, because Raffaele has no extradition barrier to save him. And as a man, I can't help feel that he's in for a worse time in jail anyway, if it comes to that.

Rolfe.

 

[Ampulla of Vater]

I am more convinced than ever that the break in evidence can turn this case around in a timely fashion.
1. A staged break in is needed for the prosecution, after 11 30 pm.
2. It can be demonstrated with certainty the rock was thrown from the car park near the street with the crime scene photographs.

What fools would do that with a dead body inside?

The defence need to focus on the facts that can be rendered beyond dispute in a logical fashion over the next few months.

And frankly I would be delighted if one of the pro guilt posters who have returned since the verdict can tell me what I am not understanding here, I just don't see the wiggle room.

The house in which this crime occurred is for sale at the moment. I truly do not understand why it cannot be used to prove this crime happened the way the defense is stating it happened. It seems to me this is the most opportune time to do it.