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Continuation Part Seven: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

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LBR said:
Thank you. However, many times I have asked myself, in trying to understand this case, who am I really serving, and to whom is my understanding even beneficial for? I wonder at times if it is just . . . I don't know how to say this politely – just an exercise in intellectual masturbation. And if I am to be completely honest, this is how I see this thread on JREF.

<snip>
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I havent seen much, if any, evidence of intellectualism in the groupie arguments but otherwise you may be onto something.;)
 
bri1 said:
Who is this girl Kelsey Kay, and what is her agenda?
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So, it appears female groupies of convicted killers are not the most reliable.

Who'd a thunk it Bri1 :eye-poppi

Are the male Knox groupies any better ?


Still this raises the Q - how dumb is RS for thinking it would work.
Likewise how dumb is AK. If she was asked to marry RS for a green card why not accept in the knowledge that later she could break the bad news.

Kaosium said:
'Hell hath no fury....'

:boxedin:
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Slightly misogynistic Kaosium - the real world stats would suggest very strongly that males scorned tend to assault / kill their partners much more so than the reverse.

However - in the event that RS is doing time in Italy while Knox is at large the converse of this maxim may be put to the test.
 
platonov said:
I havent seen much, if any, evidence of intellectualism in the groupie arguments but otherwise you may be onto something.;)
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Could you be more specific please? Who do you consider to belong to the 'groupie' contingent, and which arguments do you find to be the weakest?
 
acbytesla said:
Seems something like this Dave, although Rudy didn't stay around town, he did flee to Germany. Remember?
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davefoc said:
Didn't he stick around to go dancing before he left for Germany?
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I've seen conflicting reports on when Rudy left town. Some say he left just a few days after the murder (about November 4). One news report (beyond paywall at www.timesonline.co.uk) says November 10th.
 
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bolint said:
By telling a lie she gains time and may get out of the trouble when the lie is finally debunked, explaining that she was confused. That's what she did. Telling the truth gives no such option.
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That makes absolutely no sense. Signing a statement that placed her at the scene of the crime with Lumumba - whom she would have known was not there, had she been there herself - could only make her situation worse, had she really been involved in any way.

The obvious best choice, if evidence had really placed her at the crime scene, which it does not, was to say, "ok, I was there, but I didn't kill Meredith, Rudy Guede did."

That is what people in that situation do when they are caught. They blame each other and try to minimize their own role.

In Amanda's case, it never would have come to that. Not even close. I know her now. If she had been there, and Guede attacked Meredith with a knife, Amanda would have freaked out and she would called for help immediately, like any normal college girl who has never been around violence or crime in her entire life. She would have done so without hesitation even if she was somehow responsible for the circumstances that led to this dire event. She would not have slipped away to plot some ruse where she pretended to find the crime scene later.

The only rational way to explain Amanda's statements is that she was terrified, and the cops managed to pressure her into naming someone they suspected. Then, after holding a triumphant press conference, they found out their suspect had an unbreakable alibi. So, they blamed her for their screw-up, and the credulous public lapped it up.
 
platonov said:
So, it appears female groupies of convicted killers are not the most reliable.

Who'd a thunk it Bri1 :eye-poppi
Are the male Knox groupies any better ?

Still this raises the Q - how dumb is RS for thinking it would work.
Likewise how dumb is AK. If she was asked to marry RS for a green card why not accept in the knowledge that later she could break the bad news.

Slightly misogynistic Kaosium - the real world stats would suggest very strongly that males scorned tend to assault / kill their partners much more so than the reverse.

However - in the event that RS is doing time in Italy while Knox is at large the converse of this maxim may be put to the test.
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What the hell are you talking about? I'm not a groupie of Amanda Knox. I am however a fan of justice. Like justice for Ryan Ferguson, David Camm, the West Memphis 3 and the Central Park 5 to name just a few.

The great think about JREF, is the quality of the arguments for the most part. Occasionally a troll lobs a bomb into the mix without actually offering anything to the discussion.

You know, someone like you Platonov. Instead of discussing the evidence or more correctly, the lack of evidence, you call those that support Amanda Knox's fight against a wrongful prosecution "groupies".

Frankly, I think the weakness of your argument and your ad hominem attacks say more about you than it does about us.

What say you? Care to hang around and actually post an intelligent theory based on the evidence?

Or do you know that it won't hold up to the scrutiny?

My guess, is that you will run. Prove me wrong.
 
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bolint said:
That she spent almost two hours there just to have a shower and drying her hair.
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This factoid is wrong.
bolint said:
That she did not look into Filomena's room.
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On what basiswould she have looked in? If she had, guilters would have accused her of being nosey... or of taking one last look at the "staging" she had done.
bolint said:
The bathmat boogie,
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Why on earth is is either absurd or suspicious? I know you do not owe anyone an explanation for why you justify your feelings here, but to me this is completely absurd to include in such a list.
bolint said:
That she called her mother shortly after noon, of which there is no trace in the phone records.
etc ...
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This was the 12:47 pm call to Seattle (IIRC) and I am always boggled how accusing someone of not having a video-taped memory of events somehow proves their guilt.

Is this it? I thought you were going to say you had DNA proof of her in Meredith's room.
 
I would be interested in the biggest "mistakes" made on McCall's fake wiki.

If people here wanted to perhaps have a small impact on the media coverage, giving three to five of the most egregious fabrications and the truth would be the best way to undercut the crazed PR campaign the PGP are attempting to run.

Apparently a French TV channel has produced another Amanda shows and they were controlled by Marriott. Can you believe it?

As far as Bolint is concerned, until Bolint can see that the interrogation was controlled by the police no discussion will move Bolint from the involvementer status. Where is Cuki?
 
Grinder said:
I would be interested in the biggest "mistakes" made on McCall's fake wiki.

If people here wanted to perhaps have a small impact on the media coverage, giving three to five of the most egregious fabrications and the truth would be the best way to undercut the crazed PR campaign the PGP are attempting to run.

Apparently a French TV channel has produced another Amanda shows and they were controlled by Marriott. Can you believe it?
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Sure. Marriott sounds like a French name.

Where did you hear this?
 
RoseMontague said:
The bra clasp was not planted, it was still there on the floor.
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Since it wasn't in the same place, and the cottage wasn't sealed, there's no telling where it had been in the meantime.
All the other tests had been run already and they did not think they needed anything else against Raffaele because of the shoe print. When that was shown to be not his print after all they had to have something else to place him at the scene of the crime. That is when they decided to make another trip to the cottage.

The DNA showing up in Stefanoni's test, the whole theater collection of the bra clasp, and the other profiles that are almost certainly there from contamination, leads me to believe rubbing some of his DNA on the clasp is a very good possibility.
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Others have pointed out what we are all thinking: the collection and testing of the bra clasp was obviously stage-managed, and there is no way they were not going to get the result they wanted. Who's to say the bra clasp wasn't tampered with, and then put back in the room so as to become the focus of the drama?
 
Charlie Wilkes said:
Sure. Marriott sounds like a French name.

Where did you hear this?
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The show link

The passengers over at the love boat seem distraught about the content. Spezi being in it is a sure fire tip that it is controlled by their version of the dark side.

Oh and they are publishing a picture of Rolfe, being the enlightened ones they are, they make fun of her looks. Sweethearts I tell you, sweethearts.
 
Grinder said:
The show link

The passengers over at the love boat seem distraught about the content. Spezi being in it is a sure fire tip that it is controlled by their version of the dark side.

Oh and they are publishing a picture of Rolfe, being the enlightened ones they are, they make fun of her looks. Sweethearts I tell you, sweethearts.
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Yes they're lovely people aren't they? This is why I admire them from an ever-increasing distance as the years roll by.

L'Affaire Amanda Knox... evocative and appropriate.
 
platonov said:
Slightly misogynistic Kaosium - the real world stats would suggest very strongly that males scorned tend to assault / kill their partners much more so than the reverse.
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Sigh.

I was funning around. There are worse things I could say about someone who professes to believe Raffaele is innocent and chooses to go to some cut-rate tabloid page with embarrassing news right before his future is to be decided.

However - in the event that RS is doing time in Italy while Knox is at large the converse of this maxim may be put to the test.
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Are you hoping for a confession/accusation from Raffaele, is that what you mean?

At any rate, nice to see you posting again, Platonov. :)
 
acbytesla said:
You would go snooping in your roommate's bedroom? Why??



What are you talking about? Amanda called her mother at 12:47, 1:24. 1.:27. 1:58 and 1:59.

Out of curiosity, how is a single point you have mentioned evidence of ANYTHING? While you may find it curious, how is any of it remotely worthy of being considered as incriminating? Would you honestly convict someone of murder based on this?
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Photographers who click many photographs or videotape an individual for 20 or 200 seconds of course can look through their photos or frames and select the single still to show the person in an attractive or unattractive manner. Want to present someone appearing attractive, poised, and confident -I can select a good image for you. Want someone looking distant with beady-eyes - just a moment while I grab one from my many photos or video frames. What I am getting at of course is that viewers are often prejudiced by images selected to emphases real or imagined trait. The same goes for written descriptions.

Do any of you readers think Amanda has beady-eyes? Untrustworthy looks? What values do you associate with that.
 
Strozzi said:
Photographers who click many photographs or videotape an individual for 20 or 200 seconds of course can look through their photos or frames and select the single still to show the person in an attractive or unattractive manner. Want to present someone appearing attractive, poised, and confident -I can select a good image for you. Want someone looking distant with beady-eyes - just a moment while I grab one from my many photos or video frames. What I am getting at of course is that viewers are often prejudiced by images selected to emphases real or imagined trait. The same goes for written descriptions.

Do any of you readers think Amanda has beady-eyes? Untrustworthy looks? What values do you associate with that.
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OK, I just looked at the post 3 posts up and see that Grinder thinks someone "looks like" a psych, based on her looks.
 
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