Continuation Part Seven: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[RoseMontague]

I was responding to Bill's 5 star rating of Moore's blog post. He seems to be saying that the PGP say the Supertanker paid him, which I don't believe to be the case. He also seems to imply that because he wasn't paid that the PR effort didn't exist and is just a fabrication of the PGP, which isn't the case. There was/is a PR effort and the linked articles go into it.

I have seen plenty in the way of accusations from the PGP claiming Steve was paid by for his advocacy of the innocence of AK and RS. As well as just about anyone that advocated on a regular basis. I am not sure you are separating the fact that there was a PR effort into the fact that just about everyone on the side of innocence was at some point accused of being somehow on the payroll of that effort. Those on the side of guilt would simply rather believe that we support innocence because we are somehow compensated for it or we think Raffaelle is cute, or Amanda is pretty or some such nonsense. They are innocent because the evidense shows they are innocent.

 

[Strozzi]

..... or resorting to strawman arguments.

Both The Machine and Jackie are making strawman arguments about groupies and the necessity of motive.... as well as a comprehensive timeline for the crime.

For the record - they are correct, motive and timeline are not necessary to procure conviction.

Why then do prosecutors go through them by the sack full, never once making the argument TM and Jackie make?

Why is it that the ISC in part quashed the acquittals, saying that sex-game-gone-wrong went unexamined? Note - ISC did not make the argument those two are making.

Why did Crini, instead of taking legal advice from Jackie, venture into a completely unheard of motive? Crini turned his back on the ISC on this one, and offered up pooh in the toilet!!!!

Can guiters/haters do something other than erect strawmen? I thought not.

Crini has so far not gone into the "sex game gone wrong" motive. I wonder if his strategy is to deliberately omit it and seek conviction using nothing more than the claim that there was a fight over something mundane (Rudy's failure to flush). If Crini gets the conviction, he wins - the ISC may let the conviction stand. If the verdict is innocent, the case can potentially return to the ISC where the ISC can overturn it due to the judge's failure to adequately consisder the stipulated "sex game gone wrong" motive. This will enable the ISC to send it back for yet another trial.

 

[Strozzi]

I have seen plenty in the way of accusations from the PGP claiming Steve was paid by for his advocacy of the innocence of AK and RS. As well as just about anyone that advocated on a regular basis. I am not sure you are separating the fact that there was a PR effort into the fact that just about everyone on the side of innocence was at some point accused of being somehow on the payroll of that effort. Those on the side of guilt would simply rather believe that we support innocence because we are somehow compensated for it or we think Raffaelle is cute, or Amanda is pretty or some such nonsense. They are innocent because the evidense shows they are innocent.

I haven't received payment yet! The Bitcoins that were being sent to me were to be forwarded to me by a Nigerian prince, but I couldn't come up with the small fee to clear customs in Lagos - so I got nothing. Maybe HarryRag can help me out. I bet he knows who to contact in Nigeria.

 

[Belz...]

Thank you.




Not as such, no. I don't see any reasonable doubt that Knox and Sollecito had nothing at all to do with it. Meredith was killed around 9.20 pm, and they have an alibi for that time. There is no reason at all to drag them into it in the first place. None of the talking points of the "guilters" stands up to any serious scrutiny.

Rolfe.

I meant that there is reasonable doubt in the case against them, and therefore that, assuming what I've been told here is correct, they should have been found innocent.

 

[Welshman]

I have seen plenty in the way of accusations from the PGP claiming Steve was paid by for his advocacy of the innocence of AK and RS. As well as just about anyone that advocated on a regular basis. I am not sure you are separating the fact that there was a PR effort into the fact that just about everyone on the side of innocence was at some point accused of being somehow on the payroll of that effort. Those on the side of guilt would simply rather believe that we support innocence because we are somehow compensated for it or we think Raffaelle is cute, or Amanda is pretty or some such nonsense. They are innocent because the evidense shows they are innocent.

An argument the guilters repeatedly used was that people only suported Amanda because she is pretty. I recently challanged a guilter to provide an example where Amanda's supporters have said they only support her because she is pretty. I received no response.

 

[codyjuneau]

I haven't received payment yet! The Bitcoins that were being sent to me were to be forwarded to me by a Nigerian prince, but I couldn't come up with the small fee to clear customs in Lagos - so I got nothing. Maybe HarryRag can help me out. I bet he knows who to contact in Nigeria.

.
Oh crap!! That's what those emails from Nigeria were for. I just deleted them without realizing they were a stealthy way for Marriot to pay me. Good thing I haven't throw out my binary trash can yet! I will get right on it. Oh yeah, here is one for millions of dollars, all I have to do is wire him some money ....... there, done. I can hardly wait.
.

 

[Grinder]

I have seen plenty in the way of accusations from the PGP claiming Steve was paid by for his advocacy of the innocence of AK and RS. As well as just about anyone that advocated on a regular basis. I am not sure you are separating the fact that there was a PR effort into the fact that just about everyone on the side of innocence was at some point accused of being somehow on the payroll of that effort. Those on the side of guilt would simply rather believe that we support innocence because we are somehow compensated for it or we think Raffaelle is cute, or Amanda is pretty or some such nonsense. They are innocent because the evidense shows they are innocent.

We will disagree. I've followed PMF and not TJMK (too creepy) so if it was on the latter I wouldn't know. Certainly a few of the extreme wackos might have said anything but the main argument has never been that he was paid (Moore). I went back and looked but couldn't find anything, which I'm claiming as definitive.

If you recall Moore was working at Pepperdine and the PGP cheered wildly when he was terminated. I don't remember them saying that it wouldn't hurt him because of the pay check from Marriott.

The heart of the PR myth was the control of the media, particularly in the US

An argument the guilters repeatedly used was that people only suported Amanda because she is pretty. I recently challanged a guilter to provide an example where Amanda's supporters have said they only support her because she is pretty. I received no response.

There were lots of commenters that expressed how hot she was. I doubt anyone would say that was the only reason, even if it was an influence.

 

[Bill Williams]

We will disagree. I've followed PMF and not TJMK (too creepy) so if it was on the latter I wouldn't know. Certainly a few of the extreme wackos might have said anything but the main argument has never been that he was paid (Moore). I went back and looked but couldn't find anything, which I'm claiming as definitive.

If you recall Moore was working at Pepperdine and the PGP cheered wildly when he was terminated. I don't remember them saying that it wouldn't hurt him because of the pay check from Marriott.

The heart of the PR myth was the control of the media, particularly in the US


There were lots of commenters that expressed how hot she was. I doubt anyone would say that was the only reason, even if it was an influence.

Yet part of your argument, remember I said "part", is that this PR project was no myth.

From my reading on this, the growth of the PR Muth was inversely proportional to the influence both Barbie Nadeau and Andrea Vogt had in the US. They were the ones complaining that after a while they had "no access to the family", indeed that will be a subtheme of Winterbottom's film about the media circus which Nadeau sold to him.

Nadeau and Vogt continue to blame the family for losing their influence over the Seattle PI (Vogt) and Newsweek/CNN (Nadeau). Nadeau eventually figured out that if she was to properly monetize this for herself, she had to "behave herself" when on air.

When writing for The Beast, or writing her awful book "Student Killer" she showed no such good behaviour. Threesomes and the student drug culture of Perugia took centre stage. The more student threesomes the better.

But the "PR Supertanker" for them was a way to excuse that they were no longer listened to. Look what's happened in the UK press in the last 2 years, especially since the Leveson Inquiry, hearings and evidence presented as to how the tabloids and media players in the UK were sometimes actually determining the shape of police investigations, based on which would play better in the press!

True, the Kercher murder was a minor subset of all that, but the Daily Mail's brief internet-flash in Oct 2011 of how "Knox reacts to Hellmann's guilty verdict by slumping in her seat," did make the Leveson inquiry. The Editor of the Daily Mail had to cover for his staff on that one.

You will disagree, I know that. In my opinion you are locked into a very early Seattle-based view of things, and have not moved much since.

 

[RoseMontague]

We will disagree. I've followed PMF and not TJMK (too creepy) so if it was on the latter I wouldn't know. Certainly a few of the extreme wackos might have said anything but the main argument has never been that he was paid (Moore). I went back and looked but couldn't find anything, which I'm claiming as definitive.

If you recall Moore was working at Pepperdine and the PGP cheered wildly when he was terminated. I don't remember them saying that it wouldn't hurt him because of the pay check from Marriott.

The heart of the PR myth was the control of the media, particularly in the US

There were lots of commenters that expressed how hot she was. I doubt anyone would say that was the only reason, even if it was an influence.

Same team so I am not going to bother with it Grinder. I was a member at both pmfs for quite a while. Most all of us regulars were accused at one time or another from what I remember. Guess we are just going to not agree on this one. I wonder if you think Steve is not being honest about it, however. Or maybe you think his memory is faulty. What he has said fits with what I recall.

 

[Rolfe]

I meant that there is reasonable doubt in the case against them, and therefore that, assuming what I've been told here is correct, they should have been found innocent.

Yes, I know you meant that. I was just pointing out that it goes a lot further than that. There is no reasonable doubt that they are innocent.

Rolfe.

 

[Strozzi]

.
Oh crap!! That's what those emails from Nigeria were for. I just deleted them without realizing they were a stealthy way for Marriot to pay me. Good thing I haven't throw out my binary trash can yet! I will get right on it. Oh yeah, here is one for millions of dollars, all I have to do is wire him some money ....... there, done. I can hardly wait.
.

Codyjuneau, Yesterday I received an email from the daughter of deceased Philippine dictator Marcos asking me to help move $19 million. I had to decline because I'm right now in the middle of helping a former Iranian general stash $27 million and a niece of the Burmese dictator move $64 million. There are just so many hours in a day. IM me and I'll forward dictator Marcos's daughter's email address to you. All I ask is a modest advance payment to settle my poker debt and the rest is yours.

 

[Belz...]

Yes, I know you meant that. I was just pointing out that it goes a lot further than that. There is no reasonable doubt that they are innocent.

Rolfe.

Don't you just hate it when you argue in agreement with someone ?

Now that that's cleared up, what was that cartwheel business that started this whole discussion ?

 

[RandyN]

An argument the guilters repeatedly used was that people only suported Amanda because she is pretty. I recently challanged a guilter to provide an example where Amanda's supporters have said they only support her because she is pretty. I received no response.

I'll respond. I don't think this case would have attracted near the attention if both Kercher and Knox were less attractive. The downside of being hot I am afraid...its a burden I know all too well...sigh.

For a while it was only middle age men they picked on over at the Pluto Muggle Files...while Perverts site kept a low profile when the subject ventured into that area seeing as his little ballerina attraction melded so well with his murder victim attraction...I bet the Russian ballerina was hot too....they all are.

I have to say that when People Magazine came out with the Most Beautiful Woman issue last year and the winner was Gwyneth Paltrow....up in the right hand corner of the front cover was a smaller photogenic shot of old stinky deMilo (Ka nox) and she outbeautified poor Gwyneth. Not even close and not even trying. I bet poor Gwyneth smelled better at least...maybe.

So Rose and Mary and Rolfe must be dirty old men pretending to belong to the fairer sex then? I am quite confused now.

Knox is cute. I am cuter... I don't see anyone falling all over my case...yet. Well I actually don't have a case right now since I won that whole wrongful failure to stop at a weight station thing quite some time ago. Won without a PR supertanker I might add.

Bitcoins??? I got paid in bitcoin stock. 6 shares and I'm a freaking bizzilionaire now. Gonna retire in Hongcouver cuz I hear they have the best Chinese there...dont tell Bill I don't want him hanging around me and my money with his tired old bottle of Screech yapping away about how Massei said one thing but then did another.

Massei has to have the dumbest legal mind in the whole world. Law schools will study that 400 plus page document for hundreds of years...as a "look how far you can get off course" conclusion, all while remaining free of the looney bin.

 

[PhantomWolf]

There were lots of commenters that expressed how hot she was. I doubt anyone would say that was the only reason, even if it was an influence.

I actually got into an argument over it with two guilters. I actually think she is pretty average and they were trying to tell me I was wrong and that she was smoking. I guess on that basis, the ones who think she is hot are those that think she is guilty.

 

[Strozzi]

An argument the guilters repeatedly used was that people only suported Amanda because she is pretty. I recently challanged a guilter to provide an example where Amanda's supporters have said they only support her because she is pretty. I received no response.

The guilter who accused people of supporting Amanda because of her looks got it right. That is how it worked for me! I was quite taken with Amanda and her cause when I saw a photo of her. Check out the photo below. Look at her pretty blue eyes and nice smile. Here she is with two girlfriends after an all-night party.

http://www.repubblica.it/2006/05/gallerie/cronaca/arresti-meredith/esterne071523370711152420_big.jpg

 

[RandyN]

Don't you just hate it when you argue in agreement with someone ?

Now that that's cleared up, what was that cartwheel business that started this whole discussion ?

The cartwheel was actually a split! (much harder to do IMHO) I think Knox should sue everyone who accused her of doing the common and easy cartwheel...IT WAS A SPLIT DARN IT! Much much harder to do.

Be careful with that type of slander...I hear shes thinking of hiring some Yummi new attorney to go after all the little slanderers...she needs the funds to pay for the next appeal trial due sometime in late 2015 early 2016.

 

[RandyN]

The guilter who accused people of supporting Amanda because of her looks got it right. That is how it worked for me. I was quite taken with Amanda when I saw a photo of her. Check out the photo below. Look at her pretty blue eyes and nice smile. Here she is with two friends of her's after an all-night party.

http://www.repubblica.it/2006/05/gallerie/cronaca/arresti-meredith/esterne071523370711152420_big.jpg

Why do you suppose they have her hands blurred out? Was she giving a secret mason hand sign...maybe the one that uses just the one finger? She is still smoking even in that watch cap...those icy eyes burn right thru that grey wool...

OK I will stop now. The best pic of Knox was as a small girl in pigtails and holding a soccer ball...too cute! Like a little fox or something!

 

[Strozzi]

Why do you suppose they have her hands blurred out? . . .

The reason her hands are blurred in the photo is that she is wearing Mignini's bracelets. He was running the show at that point. They didn't want the public to see the jewelry they gave her.

 

[Bill Williams]

The reason her hands are blurred in the photo is that she is wearing Mignini's bracelets. He was running the show at that point. They didn't want the public to see her jewelry.

According to Machiavelli (remember him!) Knox was still running the show at that point. At 11 pm the night before this pic, she arrived at the Questura choosing not to sleep, and suffered no ill effects for that choice. How does Machiavelli know this? He'd examined her writings in the Nov 2 to 5th period, and noted no need for sleep in them.

It was actually Knox who had manipulated those seasoned detectives to arrest her. Ask Machiavelli.

 

[Strozzi]

According to Machiavelli (remember him!) Knox was still running the show at that point. At 11 pm the night before this pic, she arrived at the Questura choosing not to sleep, and suffered no ill effects for that choice. How does Machiavelli know this? He'd examined her writings in the Nov 2 to 5th period, and noted no need for sleep in them.

It was actually Knox who had manipulated those seasoned detectives to arrest her. Ask Machiavelli.

I will dispute any suggestion that Machiavelli is a hired shill for Mignini! I don't think that's right. I don't think he is getting paid.