Merged Global Warming Discussion II: Heated Conversation

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Who would those many be predicting ...runaway?? Got the science articles to back that claim.

I suggest you are the wrong person to be claiming a factual basis for your understanding.....or lack thereof
 
Or...these Scientists could predict with accuracy the magnitude of warming they expect to see, and exactly when they expect to see it. If it occurred, then I would be convinced.
It's sort of like what I say to Christians: if there is a Bible-God like you say, then demonstrate the power of prayer. I ask no more, or no less from the AGW Scientists: show me accurate Predictions!

Nevertheless, the AGW Scientists could be right....or they could be wrong. However, until they can show me some Predictions, I think them fools if they take the position that AGW is a fact - for they can't prove it.

All I know now is that CO2 levels are rising and Global Temps are rising - but Correlation is not Causation unless you can adequately prove you identified the mechanism - which can be done via accurate and timely predictions (which haven't been done yet). Ya' know - like what was done with the theories of Relativity, Quantum Mechanics and Evolution.

Just my 2 cents.

like they actually did?

http://iopscience.iop.org/1748-9326/7/4/044035/article
 
I only have a minute to drop by ..... I have not read all the posts here yet .... but I spotted the global warming scam when it first started .... and when Al Gore showed that solitary bear sitting on a tiny melting ice flow I knew it was propaganda.

I fly helicopters in the arctic , just finished the Polar Bear tourist season in Churchill .... and guess what .... the ice has frozen over earlier than ever and the bears are out on the solid ice hunting seals

By the way the Polar bear count is higher than it has ever been since they were counted (by air)

1945 Polar Bear count 5000
1998 Polar Bear count 16,800
2008 Polar Bear count 25,000


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I don't believe it..

who cares - the science is clear and established.

What cannot be "predicted" is how much C02 will be emmitted so predictions are geared around a range of outcomes.

And yes predictions have been made and the outcomes in good agreement.

Now This Is Interesting: A Climate Prediction From 1981
JAMES FALLOWSAPR 10 2012, 7:33 AM ET

It is very much worth checking out an item on Real Climate, from two Dutch scientists. They have found a paper by James Hansen and others from 1981, before climate change was even an occasion for political disagreement.

Hansen is now famous in the world of climate studies, and infamous to the world of the right wing, but back then he was a 40-year-old researcher who came up with a projection of how rising CO2 levels might affect global temperatures. Science lives for the "falsifiable hypothesis" -- a claim that can be tested against the evidence -- and that is what the paper by Hansen and his colleagues offered up. Three decades later, his worst-case projections were matched against what has happened since then. You should read their full findings, but this gives you the idea:

http://cdn.theatlantic.com/static/m...2/04/HansenProjection-thumb-615x368-84232.jpg

As the Dutch scientists say at the end of their Real Climate post:

To conclude, a projection from 1981 for rising temperatures in a major science journal, at a time that the temperature rise was not yet obvious in the observations, has been found to agree well with the observations since then, underestimating the observed trend by about 30%... It is also a nice example of a statement based on theory that could be falsified and up to now has withstood the test. The "global warming hypothesis" has been developed according to the principles of sound science.

http://www.theatlantic.com/technolo...esting-a-climate-prediction-from-1981/255658/

So now that's put to bed do you have anything relevant to add to the climate SCIENCE discussion that is a requirement of this thread.
 
I will not deny that I believe that a rise in CO2 levels will cause a slight increase in Temps in a relatively closed system - like a Lab or a Greenhouse (and probably on a Planet-wide Scale, too). In fact, it will and has been proven to do so: you increase CO2 and the temps rise in a relatively-closed system. However...on a Planet-wide level the runaway Greenhouse effect that many predict is irresponsible speculation given the facts.

There is no need to make predictions and then wait decades for the data to find out if CO2 is responsible for the current rapid warming. There has been enough data to settle this question for quite a while now. The question where that CO2 comes from has also been answered, it is the fossil fuels we burn.

You can read all about this in the links macdoc provided just a few posts back.
 
I only have a minute to drop by ..... I have not read all the posts here yet .... but I spotted the global warming scam when it first started .... and when Al Gore showed that solitary bear sitting on a tiny melting ice flow I knew it was propaganda.

I fly helicopters in the arctic , just finished the Polar Bear tourist season in Churchill .... and guess what .... the ice has frozen over earlier than ever and the bears are out on the solid ice hunting seals

By the way the Polar bear count is higher than it has ever been since they were counted (by air)

1945 Polar Bear count 5000
1998 Polar Bear count 16,800
2008 Polar Bear count 25,000


.

when was that?

who needs people that spend their lives researching the climate system and over 100 year of knowledge about the greenhosue effect, super computers simulating the climate system, when we could just ask some random pilot from the arctic......

what do you know about the climate system that the experts around the world, the universities around the world and scientific institutions around the world missed?
and why are you talking to us? when they missed something, go convince them. publish your reasearch into this and let the world know what they got wrong.
 
Forum wont let me post the link so google ... "tundra buggy cam" .... and you can find archived film .... the bears have moved out on the ice ..... try to find the video of bears playing and boxing .... real characters.

Best wishes
 
Remember Children...believe what the Global-Warming Preacher Man say about bad 'ole Carbon Dioxide: worship the Carbon and the Great God Mother Earth will make it plenty hot and burn you forever! :D

Carbon is da' Devil's fuel!
 
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Meanwhile, Australia has had its hottest year on record:

http://www.smh.com.au/environment/c...as-hottest-year-on-record-20131220-2zqpf.html

But for David Jones, head of climate analysis at the bureau, 2013's stand-out event was a month largely overlooked by a media diverted by football finals and federal elections: "From a climate point of view, what happened in September was probably the most remarkable." September's mean temperature soared to be 2.75 degrees above the 1961-90 average, eclipsing the previous record monthly deviation set in April 2005 by 0.09 degrees.

Maximums were 3.41 degrees over the norm, with South Australia's out by 5.39 degrees and NSW's by 4.68. Victoria's mean and minimum temperatures exceeded previous anomalies

Nationally, the warmth broke the previous September mean record by 1.1 degrees.

My first grandson was born this year. I despair for his future if drastic action doesn't happen.

Oh, for what it's worth, those who have been around this forum might remember that I was once a climate change "skeptic" (what a pathetic misuse of this word) but, largely due to threads like this and linked articles (which I'm certain deniers don't read) I've realised the science is irrefutable.
 
Remember Children...believe what the Global-Warming Preacher Man say about bad 'ole Carbon Dioxide: worship the Carbon and the Great God Mother Earth will make it plenty hot and burn you forever! :D

Carbon is da' Devil's fuel!

Well you clearly haven't read any of the links that macdoc so kindly provided that prove beyond any reasonable doubt that AGW is reality.

The thing about reality is, it doesn't go away if you mock it.
 
Well you clearly haven't read any of the links that macdoc so kindly provided that prove beyond any reasonable doubt that AGW is reality.

How do you know what I have done? What...are you "Mr. Spock" with the additional ability to perform Vulcan mind-melds through the internet? :D
 
when was that?

who needs people that spend their lives researching the climate system and over 100 year of knowledge about the greenhosue effect, super computers simulating the climate system, when we could just ask some random pilot from the arctic......

what do you know about the climate system that the experts around the world, the universities around the world and scientific institutions around the world missed?and why are you talking to us? when they missed something, go convince them. publish your reasearch into this and let the world know what they got wrong.

Normally I do not waste my time with folks like you , it is never fruitful ... you have believed the lie and you cling to it unto death because your world may fall apart when you realize you may have been fooled on other things as well. Best wishes.

I like to keep things utterly simple , and one step at a time , one point at a time ... and for you Mr DC I have one solitary question
Why was the term changed from "Global Warming" to "Climate change" ??
Sensible and intelligent people all know the answer ... and so do you
 
Normally I do not waste my time with folks like you , it is never fruitful ... you have believed the lie and you cling to it unto death because your world may fall apart when you realize you may have been fooled on other things as well. Best wishes.

I like to keep things utterly simple , and one step at a time , one point at a time ... and for you Mr DC I have one solitary question
Why was the term changed from "Global Warming" to "Climate change" ??
Sensible and intelligent people all know the answer ... and so do you

Just a bit of advice. This thread has been strongly moderated in the past. Continuing to make uncivil posts like this will end in tears, I'm pretty certain.
 
Normally I do not waste my time with folks like you , it is never fruitful ... you have believed the lie and you cling to it unto death because your world may fall apart when you realize you may have been fooled on other things as well. Best wishes.

I like to keep things utterly simple , and one step at a time , one point at a time ... and for you Mr DC I have one solitary question
Why was the term changed from "Global Warming" to "Climate change" ??
Sensible and intelligent people all know the answer ... and so do you

Well...the term "Climate Change" better explains why the ice at the South Pole is Increasing even though the earth is heating up like an inferno. You see: More Snow and Ice = More Global Warming.

Only really smart people can understand this correlation. :)
 
How do you know what I have done? What...are you "Mr. Spock" with the additional ability to perform Vulcan mind-melds through the internet? :D

You have not made any posts indicating you understand that the increase of CO2 levels (caused mainly by burning fossil fuels) is responsible for the increase in temperature (ETA: on a planetary scale.. you already posted that you accept small scale lab experiments with CO2). I was being charitable and assumed you still were unaware of the content of the links in post #735.

In case you did read them and do not understand why lay people like me that also read them come to the conclusion that AGW is real, feel free to ask why I came to that conclusion.
 
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