Continued: (Ed) Atheism Plus/Free Thought Blogs (FTB)

cornsail said:
Well, credit where credit's due. I have to applaud him for that.



What a bizarre statement. Morals claims aren't scientific. Unless you buy into Sam Harris' conception of them (in which case most meat eating is definitely immoral).



That's pleasantly surprising. I'd have thought they'd be whining about him triggering their eating disorders or something.
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Let's see what the A+ers do. They bum-rushed one of our regulars because of daring to propose they even THINK ABOUT MAYBE PURSUING a vegan lifestyle.

I'm dying to see what sort of 180 Kassiane and Ko. do on this one. If it was anyone else but St. Peezer, I'd say they go into "we close the iron door" mode, but... but... but... it's the Grand Rabbi of Rabble Rousers, Himself (hallowed be his name).

What are the bets? They just ignore this? Or some unsuspecting individual starts a thread in support of PZ and they beat him/her black-and-blue (figuratively, of course)? Or they just rally behind PZ and "erase" Kasiane?
 
Surely claiming vegetarianism as a moral stance makes far more sense than claiming it as a scientific stance would? I mean there are arguments to be made about inefficient use of arable land, deforestation, methane production, etc. I would say that those tend to be more in the way of post-hoc rationalisations than actual reasons for turning vegetarian for most people.

I'm sure there are plenty of things Myers can be criticised for, but presenting a decision he made on moral grounds as a moral decision? Seems reasonable to me.
 
cornsail said:
Well, credit where credit's due. I have to applaud him for that.



What a bizarre statement. Morals claims aren't scientific. Unless you buy into Sam Harris' conception of them (in which case most meat eating is definitely immoral).



That's pleasantly surprising. I'd have thought they'd be whining about him triggering their eating disorders or something.
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Squeegee Beckenheim said:
Surely claiming vegetarianism as a moral stance makes far more sense than claiming it as a scientific stance would? I mean there are arguments to be made about inefficient use of arable land, deforestation, methane production, etc. I would say that those tend to be more in the way of post-hoc rationalisations than actual reasons for turning vegetarian for most people.

I'm sure there are plenty of things Myers can be criticised for, but presenting a decision he made on moral grounds as a moral decision? Seems reasonable to me.
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So PZ the grey has become PZ the White?
 
Foolmewunz said:
Let's see what the A+ers do. They bum-rushed one of our regulars because of daring to propose they even THINK ABOUT MAYBE PURSUING a vegan lifestyle.

I'm dying to see what sort of 180 Kassiane and Ko. do on this one. If it was anyone else but St. Peezer, I'd say they go into "we close the iron door" mode, but... but... but... it's the Grand Rabbi of Rabble Rousers, Himself (hallowed be his name).

What are the bets? They just ignore this? Or some unsuspecting individual starts a thread in support of PZ and they beat him/her black-and-blue (figuratively, of course)? Or they just rally behind PZ and "erase" Kasiane?
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I'm betting on ignoring the whole thing like it never happened.


We have always been at war with EastAsia WestAsia.
 
cornsail said:
I don't know what this means (aside from the fact that it's a LOTR reference).
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PZ, the devil incarnate, suddenly becomes the voice of sweet reason when he says something you agree with.
 
I personally don't think it's immoral to eat meat and I wouldn't judge someones morality based on diet.

I'm with tsig on this one. And why announce it on his science blog as such? There's nothing worse than getting on your high horse and claiming to be morally superior than the rest. Especially considering some of his actions over the last year.
 
tsig said:
PZ, the devil incarnate, suddenly becomes the voice of sweet reason when he says something you agree with.
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Don't agree with this part. It's not really an argument. Seems a bit aggressive. the gray wizard was good as I recall, not the devil incarnate.
 
s_pepys said:
Don't agree with this part. It's not really an argument. Seems a bit aggressive. the gray wizard was good as I recall, not the devil incarnate.
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True, It was a bit over the top.
 
qwints said:
Have you ever read the blog? It's not exactly biology-centric.
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That's true. It used to be more bio-centric but that changed somewhere around a year and change ago and I still read it for a while, but finally dropped it and dropped PZ from my FB friends.
 
tsig said:
PZ, the devil incarnate, suddenly becomes the voice of sweet reason when he says something you agree with.
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A less silly way to look at it would be that people who base their opinions on reason, rather than demonising people, will happily say when someone who they generally don't agree with says something that seems to them to be reasonable.

Or, in my case, I'm happy to point out fallacious reasoning, regardless of who is using that reasoning or who that reasoning is being directed against. This is because I'm not a 5 year old who feels they are on a "side" they have to rabidly defend, but instead an adult who is their own person and whose opinions are their own.
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
A less silly way to look at it would be that people who base their opinions on reason, rather than demonising people, will happily say when someone who they generally don't agree with says something that seems to them to be reasonable.

Or, in my case, I'm happy to point out fallacious reasoning, regardless of who is using that reasoning or who that reasoning is being directed against. This is because I'm not a 5 year old who feels they are on a "side" they have to rabidly defend, but instead an adult who is their own person and whose opinions are their own.
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Yep, the best defense is still a good offense.

I'm glad you're an adult, for most of us it's apparent in our posts and we feel no need to proclaim it.
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
I'm not a 5 year old who feels they are on a "side" they have to rabidly defend
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tsig said:
I'm glad you're an adult, for most of us it's apparent in our posts and we feel no need to proclaim it.
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I took Squeegee Beckenheim's remark as more of a comment about others acting like 5 year olds than about himself.
 
Foolmewunz said:
Note that I say "bias". I do not agree that this is racism or reverse racism. White people erroneously calling out other white people as racists is just a good example of being dense, not an example of self-hatred or being racists, themselves, IMHO. It's yet another example of why these folk shouldn't even earn the cub scout Social Justice merit badge, much less be the self-appointed standard bearers for Atheism Plus Social Justice.
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The chemgeek was most definitely being racist by making up the race of the bullies and "calling them out"

Based on nothing but a gut feeling, she placed black people on a pedestal by refusing to even consider that the teasers might be PoC themselves. Black people were fetishized, idealized and basically stripped of their humanity by the refusal to consider that they aren't behaving in the manner that the very narrow social justice viewpoint demands of them.

Painting the bullies as white, well, that's to be expected from SJWs no ? Anybody does anything "bad" and white is the automatic default.

Here's an example from yesterday, on the whining bitching moaning complaining thread.

AlexSenachi said:
Interlocutor from previous comment has now informed me that I make them (I bet it's a heterocis white him, but I don't know for sure anything except that they're Greek Catholic) proud to be a difference feminist. I don't even.
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There we have it. Not only white but everything Alex isn't.

Why...it's almost like they hate white people over there at A+.

 
tsig said:
PZ, the devil incarnate, suddenly becomes the voice of sweet reason when he says something you agree with.
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I will criticize PZ when he does or says things that I find objectionable and I will praise him when he says or does things that I find praise-worthy... Your implication that it is a bad thing to do is frightening. I mean, naturally humans will tend to be biased toward criticizing someone they already don't like / praising someone they already like, but it's pretty rare to hear someone actually suggest that deviations from these biases should be avoided.

Also, in case it's not clear, I didn't say anything about PZ's overall character or his reasoning abilities in that post.

s_pepys said:
There's nothing worse than getting on your high horse and claiming to be morally superior than the rest. Especially considering some of his actions over the last year.
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Where is it that he claimed to be morally superior to the rest in that post?
 
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Foolmewunz said:
The thing is... they weren't remotely familiar with the facts. The first person I know of who went to the trouble to find out what the school make-up was like, was me. They just jumped in with both boots (or maybe fashionable Earth Shoes made from renewable resources) and started crying "Racism!" because it's what they do. Qwints and somethingcrumpet pointed out or at least questioned that it might simply be a typical authoritarian school policy issue, to their credit. But if you look at Qwints' new thread, the first couple of comments seemed to be at least pointing towards mea culpa, but now they're starting to justify their own bias.
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I didn't take long. Within a few posts it was once again okay to assume that the bullies were of a specific race, which IMO is racist, regardless of how fast and high they wave the demographics card.

It's yet another example of why these folk shouldn't even earn the cub scout Social Justice merit badge, much less be the self-appointed standard bearers for Atheism Plus Social Justice.
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Agreed.

BTW, your post a couple of posts below the one quoted above (#275) is excellent.
 
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