Continuation Part Six: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[Mary_H]

Thoughtful I think is her name she still posts on PMF

Thanks, Billy. She also goes by Leila. I still can't remember her real name. Guess I won't be able to buy her book.

 

[Grinder]

"Defense efforts" covers a lot of territory. Raffaele thanked a lot of people in the acknowledgements at the end of his book, including Patrick King on page 265, but I think for the most part these are just people who made their names known to Raffaele by writing to him or meeting him.

Not to be especially snarky, but I think if most innocence supporters had direct relationships with the defense attorneys, the defense efforts would have been much stronger than they have been.

King to my knowledge didn't go to Perugia and may or may not have talked with the kid from Seattle. The article doesn't attribute any quotes that would make me think he interviewed the kid.

The person that linked the article had no idea that the writer was mentioned my Raf in his book or had connections to the massive defensive effort. he didn't know that Marriott had bought him a Nash-Rambler (with the seats that fold down into a bed).

I think the defense could have been and could still be much better. As I suggested two months ago, I would put out my own video on the evidence if I were them.

FOA shouldn't be used as a general description. I understand it to be a small group that isn't really much of a group anymore. Most supporters were never in FOA. Patrick King is just a guy who writes online, like most of the rest of us.

FOA may be a small group but I still believe it describes many PIPs.

All those that have followed this case know that King was and is a partisan.

Can't wait to hit 4000 posts as DM has promised me a Volt.

 

[Grinder]

Thanks, Billy. She also goes by Leila. I still can't remember her real name. Guess I won't be able to buy her book.

You have no intention to buy her book. It's against the FOA bylaws.

Leila Schneps - Math on Trial: How Numbers Get Used and Abused in the Courtroom

 

[Mary_H]

You might find this interesting (it took me 17 seconds to search for and find it online....):

http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/simpson/jurypage.html

I certainly don't want to get bogged down on this matter. But I'm afraid that the sad fact is that a significant proportion of the Simpson jury were indeed familiar with spousal abuse (and according to this, five of them said it was sometimes appropriate to use force on a family member!).

Four in Five Americans Believe Parents Spanking Their Children is Sometimes Appropriate

I don't know what preconceptions you may or may not have on this issue, but I suspect you might need to set them aside in favour of the facts, as unpalatable as those facts might be. This is categorically NOT about any agenda (and especially not an agenda with racial undertones). It's about the available facts and evidence. You know: like we do with the Knox/Sollecito case.......

Thank you for the research. I don't dispute the statistics. Let's agree to disagree on preconceptions.

 

[Mary_H]

King to my knowledge didn't go to Perugia and may or may not have talked with the kid from Seattle. The article doesn't attribute any quotes that would make me think he interviewed the kid.

The person that linked the article had no idea that the writer was mentioned my Raf in his book or had connections to the massive defensive effort. he didn't know that Marriott had bought him a Nash-Rambler (with the seats that fold down into a bed).

Ooh la la.

I think the defense could have been and could still be much better. As I suggested two months ago, I would put out my own video on the evidence if I were them.

FOA may be a small group but I still believe it describes many PIPs.

All those that have followed this case know that King was and is a partisan.

I confess I didn't follow this very closely from the beginning. What exactly is your argument?

Can't wait to hit 4000 posts as DM has promised me a Volt.

Who is DM and what is a Volt?

 

[Bill Williams]

I think the defense could have been and could still be much better. As I suggested two months ago, I would put out my own video on the evidence if I were them.

FOA may be a small group but I still believe it describes many PIPs.

All those that have followed this case know that King was and is a partisan.
I confess I didn't follow this very closely from the beginning. What exactly is your argument?

Being a middle level operative in FOA, I've never heard of Patrick King. What does that mean?

 

[Grinder]

Who is DM and what is a Volt?

David Marriott. Chevy's newish car that runs off battery power with a gas back-up generator.

 

[Grinder]

Being a middle level operative in FOA, I've never heard of Patrick King. What does that mean?

That you are not telling the truth about knowing him or being a middle level operative.

How did you get hooked up with Frank in order to give him the ride up to his host in Canada?

Didn't you have a picture taken with Raf's book when he was in town?

 

[acbytesla]

David Marriott. Chevy's newish car that runs off battery power with a gas back-up generator.

Never thought of you as a Greenie Grinder. But my neighbor absolutely loves his.

 

[Bill Williams]

That you are not telling the truth about knowing him or being a middle level operative.

How did you get hooked up with Frank in order to give him the ride up to his host in Canada?

Didn't you have a picture taken with Raf's book when he was in town?

LOL.

 

[Matthew Best]

That you are not telling the truth about knowing him or being a middle level operative.

How did you get hooked up with Frank in order to give him the ride up to his host in Canada?

Didn't you have a picture taken with Raf's book when he was in town?

Are you speaking to the issue or the speaker here?

 

[Bill Williams]

That you are not telling the truth about knowing him or being a middle level operative.

How did you get hooked up with Frank in order to give him the ride up to his host in Canada?

Didn't you have a picture taken with Raf's book when he was in town?

Are you speaking to the issue or the speaker here?

What Grinder doesn't know is that I'm collecting his posts and taking them to Gogerty-Marriott as proof that my impact warrants a raise in pay. Grinder seems to think so, anyway, the real test is if David Marriott thinks so as well......

 

[LondonJohn]

Four in Five Americans Believe Parents Spanking Their Children is Sometimes Appropriate

Thank you for the research. I don't dispute the statistics. Let's agree to disagree on preconceptions.

My original point was that it was probable that most of the jurors in that trial had some direct or indirect experience of spousal violence, and that this violence almost-certainly hadn't then escalated to murder - and that this is why the prosecution's logically-unsound argument might not only have fallen flat but might even have had the opposite effect upon the jury.

I think the statistics tend to support my assertion. I don't like the statistics either; I abhor (of course) the notion of intra-familial physical violence (or abuse of any sort), and would suggest that it's an even sadder fact that this sort of thing appears to be even higher in African-American families than US families of other ethnic origins. I think (hope) things are getting slowly better in this regard, as the dreadful cycle of black familial discord and disunity - aided and abetted by the disproportionate imprisonment of young black males - is slowly broken in a more enlightened society. In addition, I think that police and the courts are increasing more sensitive to domestic abuse of any sort, and are ever more determined to deal with it appropriately.

To think that only a few generations ago in the UK it was considered almost-acceptable for a man to beat his spouse is disgusting and horrifying. Even worse than that, marital rape was not a criminal offence in England/Wales until as recently as 1991. Unbelievable.

Anyhow, this is obviously peripheral to the Kercher case - although it does serve to highlight how jurors' life experiences should be carefully considered, and how ethics and laws often lag behind what society would deem appropriate.

 

[LondonJohn]

What Grinder doesn't know is that I'm collecting his posts and taking them to Gogerty-Marriott as proof that my impact warrants a raise in pay. Grinder seems to think so, anyway, the real test is if David Marriott thinks so as well......

At least you GET paid. Marriott keeps mumbling something about "trans-Atlantic money transfers" as some sort of excuse as to why my monthly stipend doesn't turn up...

PS: I note with interest a very recent photo on FB of Amanda Knox holding up a "Welcome home" sign of support for Ryan Ferguson. I note that Madison Paxton is standing next to Knox. I note that both women are smiling and appear happy. I cannot understand this, since I was "reliably" informed by a number of pro-guilt commentators that Madison Paxton had totally separated herself from Knox, and had no desire to associate with her any longer. Someone help me out here - I simply don't understand!

 

[GreyFox]

Is the next court date the 16th of December and if so what's the agenda ? To review the report on the knife or are we moving on to other disputes/evidence ? I have it down as closing arguments ?

 

[acbytesla]

At least you GET paid. Marriott keeps mumbling something about "trans-Atlantic money transfers" as some sort of excuse as to why my monthly stipend doesn't turn up...

PS: I note with interest a very recent photo on FB of Amanda Knox holding up a "Welcome home" sign of support for Ryan Ferguson. I note that Madison Paxton is standing next to Knox. I note that both women are smiling and appear happy. I cannot understand this, since I was "reliably" informed by a number of pro-guilt commentators that Madison Paxton had totally separated herself from Knox, and had no desire to associate with her any longer. Someone help me out here - I simply don't understand!

That is interesting isn't it? After all, their information about Amanda and this case has proven time after time to be so accurate.

 

[CoulsdonUK]

That is interesting isn't it? After all, their information about this Amanda and this case has proven time after time to be so accurate.

Who is Maidson Paxton, don’t recall her name coming up in this case?

 

[LondonJohn]

Is the next court date the 16th of December and if so what's the agenda ? To review the report on the knife or are we moving on to other disputes/evidence ? I have it down as closing arguments ?

I think that closing* arguments for the prosecution and the civil parties are due to be heard on the 25th and 26th November, with defence arguments on the 16th and 17th December.

* Technically speaking, these are actually "opening arguments"; however, since this is confusing for many, they're usually misreferred to as "closing arguments" - although actual closing arguments are the very final arguments before deliberation and verdict.

 

[Sergei Walankov]

Who is Maidson Paxton, don’t recall her name coming up in this case?

A close and loyal friend of Amanda's of long standing, who nonetheless doesn't understand her nearly as well as the likes of Machiavelli.

 

[Grinder]

Being a middle level operative in FOA, I've never heard of Patrick King. What does that mean?

That you are not telling the truth about knowing him or being a middle level operative.

How did you get hooked up with Frank in order to give him the ride up to his host in Canada?

Didn't you have a picture taken with Raf's book when he was in town?

Are you speaking to the issue or the speaker here?

Now if you are able to follow, you will see I'm speaking to the issue. I could have gone back further but since you seem to be stalking my posts (how would know where I post otherwise) no need.

Bill claims to be a middle level operative (not something I ever said) and that he never heard of King indicating that King isn't a well known FOA type.

Then, I asked specific questions about his real connections, including giving rides to Frank.

I think his relationships to "insiders" puts a different light on his opinions. In that he has spent hundreds of posts probing Mach's connections to Vogt and Mignini, I certainly don't think it unfair to ask him about connections to the FOA in the more generic sense of the term.

So in this case the issue is directly related to the speaker's connections which I'm asking about and he refuses to answer but rather responds with hyperbole.

Mathew how do you know where I have posted? Is there a feature on JREF that lists every place someone has posted or does one need to review every post by going back page by page to my first post? Creepy.