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How effective is/was "Stop Sylvia Browne"?

In desperate times, I looked at SBs site. What I wanted at the time I could not afford.

By searching for SB, I found SSB. About 1/4 of the way through all the stories on that page, I was glad I couldn't be cheated by her. I have since passed the link onto numerous friends and family. Some of them were shocked that she actually claimed she was psychic, some didn't know about her and were glad to pass the info along to others, a couple were sure SSB was a fake site, and most were just interested in reading SSB. The Shawn Hornbeck debacle sealed the deal for most everyone, regardless.

I think SSB has done a lot to open some eyes and make some brains think. That's the best anyone can do.
 
In desperate times, I looked at SBs site. What I wanted at the time I could not afford.

By searching for SB, I found SSB. About 1/4 of the way through all the stories on that page, I was glad I couldn't be cheated by her. I have since passed the link onto numerous friends and family. Some of them were shocked that she actually claimed she was psychic, some didn't know about her and were glad to pass the info along to others, a couple were sure SSB was a fake site, and most were just interested in reading SSB. The Shawn Hornbeck debacle sealed the deal for most everyone, regardless.

I think SSB has done a lot to open some eyes and make some brains think. That's the best anyone can do.

[PEE-WEE HERMAN]

I love that story!

[/PEE-WEE HERMAN]

Thanks, KatieG!
 
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So long story short. SSB had no impact other than irritation to Sylvia Browne.


Huh? You are making this statement without any evidence whatsoever, aside from your own opinion.
 
If memory serves, she had created a counter site (I want to say Go Browne Go). She most certainly saw not only you but the website as a threat to her income. And then there was the issue with the domain where someone essentially stole it and turned it into a pro-site. If the site was a non-issue, she wouldn't have directed the resources she did at you, as feeble as the results were.

Your impact is not something that we really could quantify. SSB certainly played a role at the end. I think things like her debacle on Coast to Coast and the coverage by Anderson Cooper would have been far more survivable without your site to chronicle not only those blunders, but others in the past.

And that is something that really hadn't been there before. While she could claim a prediction rate of 95%, you could show the math.
 
Of course SSB had an effect; it raised awareness and eyebrows as to Browne's claims and serves as an excellent paradigm for lay-skeptics as to how to operate an effective rational response to those who might exploit the credulous.

Robert's efforts are to be admired and even envied as an example to those of us who hope to inspire critical thinking and rationalism.

Good job Robert.
 
The internet is now such a common tool that almost every day I hear people say, "Really? I'll look that up!" And they do. I do. At one time people would see someone like Sylvia on TV and take what they saw at face value (maybe) but now, not so much, imo.

People do more research now. Of course what is on the internet is not infallible, but not many celebrities or so-called psychics can just coast along without scrutiny anymore. That's a good thing.

And when a site such as SSB is out there and presented so professionally and balanced, it impresses people. Many wrote in about it and many more likely will.

I firmly think it definitely had a negative impact on Sylvia's career. If the site was nothing more than an irritation she would not have even acknowledged it. I don't the had a choice BUT to acknowledge it. She was practically forced to. That, to me, is not a sign that it did nothing to her career and reputation.
 
You came in at the end of her well established career, at the point she could have been expected to tail off anyway. Sylvia Browne is very rich and had a good life.

So did your site have much of an effect on Sylvia Browne? Probably not. She's happy, and made a great career from defrauding people.

Did your website have a good effect on anyone? Well, you know it did. You have emails from people who stopped wasting money on her because of you. That is how you should measure your success, not by the effect it has on her, but by the effect it has had on other people. If you saved 100 people, or even 10 people, or even 1 person from being scammed, then you didn't waste your time.

And by the drip effect it's going to hit the next Sylvia Browne as well. Little by little, piece by piece. You haven't stopped belief in psychics. You've only helped to. And you've made the job of the next guy to step into your shoes that little bit easier.
 
In answer to the question in the OP:

At the time SSB was started, Browne was already elderly and in failing health. That said, of course the site made a difference and contributed to her downfall! :) As tough as it was to work on at times, if even one person was dissuaded, it was all worth it. Even if you simply poured fuel on the fire, you did a very good thing.

The only regret I have is that some site like SSB wasn't created years earlier, before Browne became big.

Full disclosure: I researched Browne for years and so had a huge emotional investment in the site at the time. I did think of it as "my baby" (I hope Robert won't mind). So this is a highly biased opinion.

Grieving people are at best a very small percentage of Sylvia Brownes business they are only the ones most talked about. The vast majority are people who are too lazy and too stupid to do the leg work to solve their own life problems.

They are willing to pay anything for someone else to make decisions for them.

I attended a taping of a Sylvia Browne episode and, though I did not survey audience members and get hard data, I think nearly everyone there had recently lost a close family member, significant other or friend. Based on what I heard, I'd say 90 to 95 percent asked about a dead relative. What a glum, depressing atmosphere. Everyone was sad and unsatisfied, filing out of the studio when the taping was over.

It was a shock to realize, part of the way through the taping, that the only person there who hadn't just experienced a death was me. And possibly Williams and Browne.

On another note, this is obviously anecdotal but I believe that a significant percentage of the audience for a Sylvia Browne show has depression, bipolar disorder or some other mental heath issue. The questions that they asked betrayed this. A lot of people would say things like "I feel like I'm stuck in a rut, job-wise and personal life-wise. I've felt this way for years and see no way out." or "Everything seems to be going wrong for me, so much so I wonder if I'm cursed".

With the caveat that I am not a psychologist, I think a lot of these people have undiagnosed depression, unbeknownst to themselves, and need to stop seeing psychics and start seeing mental health counselors. The things they listed (extreme loneliness, oversleeping or undersleeping, constant fatigue, failed personal relationships, lack of workplace success, extreme lack of self-esteem, boredom, hopelessness, lack of joy in life) sounded like classic symptoms.

A lot of them had diagnosed bipolar disorder, schizophrenia or some other mental disorder and would outright say so and ask Sylvia questions about their illness. I felt awful when one audience member asked Browne when she would be cured of a disorder she had been struggling with for decades and had been taking heavy medication for and Browne said "Next year", which prompted the woman to burst into tears of relief and joy.

So I don't fault this segment of her fans. They are desperate to find a cure for their problems and will turn to everyone and anyone who seems to offer answers. They have not considered the possibility of depression, perhaps through a lack of education about it. The very nature of their illness predisposes them to a belief in the supernatural; plenty of psychologists will tell you that the clinically depressed are prone to "magical thinking". How can you blame a desperate, tormented schizophrenic for a poor grasp of reality and having cloudy judgment? Of course they cannot think straight. That's what being schizophrenic means!

By the way, that's another example of the harm that psychics cause. People look for a supernatural answer instead of a medical, psychological, environmental or practical one. They take their problems to the wrong person, who will lead them in the wrong direction or none at all. Browne would make predictions like "You feel you are stuck and want to know what will happen next? I see you going into something creative in the future, maybe art" instead of telling them "You need help, preferably in the form of someone who can prescribe anti-depressants in the state you live in."
 
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I'll go along with The Great God Pan's take.
The success of SSB can't be measured in terms of damage to that particular woman.
Its success prolly can't be measured in a satisfying graph at all, because it can only measured by the number of clicks that didn't get made to purchase tickets, books, and all the rest of the products sold by that woman's commercial set-up.

All the best to you and your lovely wife, Robert!
 
Robert, you likely already know my view on this but here are my thoughts based on the various events since 2007, all just speculation of course.

To start, Sylvia was enjoying high success before you came along, based largely on her having landed the weekly spot on the Montel show. She was churning out bestsellers during this time, up to around 20 IIRC. She was at her peak and doing well. She was doing so well that in fact i heard her say more than once, untruthfully, that she charged such high fees because she had churches and ministers to support. In other words, it seemed to me that she was doing so well she didn't even have to bother to tell the truth in front of her own office staff and ministers. I would guess at this time your site was a minor to moderate irritation, enough that she would go to the trouble of trying to stop you, but still she probably saw herself as fairly invincible thanks to Montel.

As I recall, after your site had been up for a time the Shawn Hornbeck story broke. Without your article there, would her reading have caught the attention of Anderson Cooper? That was huge. Other reporters picked it up, and i think that was a game changer.

Phone calls to the office dropped, to the point there was question of whether they would remain open. That was hearsay but seemed reliable. Also hearsay that she blamed you and people were now careful not to mention your name in front of her. Do you remember whether this had started before Shawn Hornbeck? I can't remember, but then someone in the Sylvia camp started Go Sylvia Browne, which made it even more obvious that you had become a thorn in her side.

It seemed to me that you continued to be this.

Then Montel went off the air. Impossible to say whether she'd have rallied just by continuing on with his show. But on top of everything else, this had to be a big blow. I think this is where it's hard to sort out the impact of your site/the Shawn Hornbeck story, and the impact of losing that weekly spot. What might have happened had Montel gone off the air without Stop Sylvia? Who knows, maybe another show would have picked her up, maybe she'd have been the "San Jose Medium." Maybe the articles and the negative publicity would have made the television powers-that-be wary of taking a chance on her.

My take is that the quality of her lectures had dropped along the way too, and, if true, that would have been bad for business also. Was that advancing age, declining health, burnout, something else? But I could see a difference between Sylvia now and Sylvia even 10 years ago. Regardless, it's still possible she might have gone on to Sylvia Reality TV. But she didn't. Why not?

So there were several factors. But,as someone said above, what you did so brilliantly was "show the math."

As a side note, had your site included wrong headed speculation or stories I could have recognized as untrue, I would have contacted you for a different reason. But your articles linked to video of her exact words, things were never quoted out of context, there were no major errors. This makes your site all the more effective. I have researched other psychics over the years and found skeptical articles replete with errors. As a believer, this would only convince me that the skeptical author was unreliable. I stood at the ready to tell you if I recognized any of those types of errors but in fact you never made them. Insults about Sylvia unrelated to her claims to be psychic or honest, commentary that was derisive or revealing of a blatant negative and likely incorrect understanding of her followers/fans also would have driven me away. And many others, I'm sure. You did this brilliantly too.

All of that played a part in what made, and continues to make Stop Sylvia a success. It's hard to unravel it exactly.

How would Van Praagh have done? John Edward? Dubois? If a major error had come to the attention of someone like Anderson Cooper and a Stop Site existed? Just having a string of articles equivalent in quality to yours? Showing the math. I personally think it's like slowly letting the air out of a balloon with each article that goes up and every believer / possible client who happens to find it while searching, trying to decide whether the person is for real.

Now, that is just in terms of stopping Sylvia. In terms of how effective it is on fans or fence sitters, it can be priceless. When I was still a minister and first figured out Sylvia had faked the trances, I went online. I was confused. I wondered, is it just me? If not, why wouldn't other ministers have come forward? Until I found your site, I could find nothing. And if there's nothing, it's very easy to reach the wrong conclusion that there's nothing online because nothing has happened. The psychics like to say, "Take what you want and leave the rest." But only the most unspiritual of people would come right out and criticize something spiritual that might be helping someone else. It goes without saying, call it negative, call it unspiritual, call it negative karma, but you just accept that no one is perfect and walk away.

I had no idea how to share what I knew. Were there laws about this? And who would listen? And then I found your site and gathered up my courage and contacted you.

I can only imagine how many people are out there with similar experiences with other psychics and mediums.

And then there are people like KatieG. I love that story too! Online because they wish they could schedule a reading, and then they find your site. And then not only has your site contributed to stopping Sylvia, it has helped them too.

So you see? Priceless.
 
You did good Robert.
Your web site was the start to the downfall of this particular scam artist.
 
Thanks everybody for the wonderful things you posted! (And thank you too, Brattus! :D

Sorry for creating a thread based on a question that is probably impossible to answer definitively, but the answers given did make me think - thanks!
 
I do have something to add regarding the fact that Sylvia was already getting old and had had decades of success. No, your site did not take that away or come into being in time to stop her career from soaring when she came onto the scene way back when.

However, elderly or not, she was grooming and pushing her family members to take on her "mantle" and I think the site may have damaged that beyond repair. I don't watch much television, but is Chris talked about and "ranked" up there with Edward and Van Praagh? I doubt it, but I cannot be sure.

When I do occasionally hear people speak of psychics I NEVER hear anyone even mention her son's name. Her, yes, and the others, but never Sylvia's son.

So your site may have stopped or at least slowed THAT particular hope of hers to a crawl.
 
I was a faithful follower and I can say with 100 percent certainty that SSB completely changed my mind about her AND forced me to look into the other frauds that I thought were genuine psychics. This is not a pat on the back ( although Mr. Lancaster deserves one ) This is my truth. I don't think my story is unique either. SSB is very compelling.
 
Robert does not deserve a pat on the back. He deserves a great big group hug.... and a kiss on the cheek... by all the ladies... and then by the lads!!
 
Do you have the traffic figures for your site? Because it's unlikely the site will have affected the opinion of more people than the total views. Then all we need to do is compare that to the number of Browne followers (if such figures exist) in order to see the maximum possible total effect.
 
You know, 570lesa'a post brings up an interesting point.

It seems the site was not so much a shotgun as a scalpel. More the targetted treatement than the widespread vaccination.

I suspect the overall percentage of SB's business lost due to SSB was probably small enough to be lost in the noise, but it had a very large effect on the individuals who did consider the SSB site.

I suspect this makes an interesting strategy point. We have a tendency to try and go "in your face" in the sleptical movement, but often that just puts up defenses and closes off discussion. We end up doing nothing but entrenching the pre-concieved positions of those involved, and to outsiders it reinforces the skeptic-cynic stereotype and the "close-minded" accusations of a lot of the woo side. The tone of the SSB site is, I think, one that we should emulate more. And while the site was of more use to those who were already having some doubts or looking for clarity, I think the same type of tone could go well in a broad campaign. Less confrontational, more factual reporting.

Just my thoughts.
 
Or, put another way: How much of a part (if any) did the site play in Browne's apparent decline in popularity in the past few years?-RSL

Since there's no scientific way to draw a conclusion, I'll just give my biased opinion. I think your site played a strong role in polluting the well of belief in Sylvia. I think media people, both in front of and behind the cameras, got hip to your stuff, which helped to change the public conversation concerning Browne, her claims and her disgusting con game.

Just my opinion.
 

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