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Cleon said:
Well, first, as the saying goes "never say never." I'm sure Brigham Young was convinced that the church would "never" ban polygamy, much less give the Priesthood to Blacks. A little revelation goes a long way in LDS.

Second, yes, I know LDS would not release a recording. The videos linked appear to be taken secretly. Are they fake?

Several "formons" who've posted here have said that if the videos are faked, they match their recollections pretty closely. Is that the case, or are these videos complete fabrications?
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Given the vids, and given that Deaman has verified those as real, it is not far away from child abuse.
 
Janadele said:
Yes of course. A Temple Recommend is required to enter the Temple. Endowments are taken out previous to a Temple Marriage, previous to being set apart as a Missionary, or in later years if worthy.
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You needn't be patronizing. I didn't know, that's why I asked.

Janadele said:
Pup, as you and others here also know, the LDS Church has not and will not ever release or facilitate the recording of Temple ordinances.
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No one claimed they did. That's still not a denial the video is authentic. abaddon is right, it's not far away from child abuse.
 
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To be honest, being baptized for the dead is voluntary. I rather enjoyed it.
 
RandFan said:
...Only later after my mission did I study psychology and sociology at the University of Utah. I learned about they psychological and cognitive basis for such spiritual experiences. These experiences are not at all unique to Mormons and we know what methods are the most conducive to them. From native American to Eastern philosophy and from meditation to medication, etc..
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Thanks for your honest and instructive posts, RandFan.
A question.
Is glossolalia practised in the LDS?
I ask because I was taught it as part of a Qi Gong workshop and was later surprised to learn it's considered among Christians to be a sign of the Holy Spirit.
The Wiki entry mentions it as part of the history of the LDS aand I wondered if, like the belief in the authenticity in the BoA, it's still part of LDS doctrine.
 
deaman said:
But, of course, no one could have taken the film, except someone who had a temple recommend and who was considered worthy to enter the temple.

In my church going/believing days, there was a story circulated about people who tried to enter the temple by force, but were stopped by the sudden appearence of Laminite warriors. (A group of fierce warriors in the BofM.)

Do you recall such a story RandFan, or Janadel?

At the time, I was willing to believe it. I no longer do.

But, if someone did believe the myth/story, how is it that the simple spirit of god couldn't detect the many people who have taken films in the temple, or why didn't the Bishop discern the intent, in the heart of the participants?
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I never heard that one, but I recall one from when I was about ten where someone had found a lost temple card and had managed to get inside with it. The chap who was running the temple service stopped in the middle of it and said, "someone is here who does not belong here". Everything stopped at that point and there was absolute silence until the man quietly stood up and walked out. I don't recall if the leader was said to have been told by god that there was a non-worthy person in the group, or that was left implied.

Everyone else in the congregation was nodding and smiling, since it reinforced the view that the temple was a place where god was ever-present. I thought the story stunk, and didn't believe a word of it, which in retrospect shows I was already disbelieving things that were told to me, even if I knew better than to voice such things to anyone else, although I didn't realize I was an atheist until I was a few years older.
 
pakeha said:
Thanks for your honest and instructive posts, RandFan.
A question.
Is glossolalia practised in the LDS?
I ask because I was taught it as part of a Qi Gong workshop and was later surprised to learn it's considered among Christians to be a sign of the Holy Spirit.
The Wiki entry mentions it as part of the history of the LDS aand I wondered if, like the belief in the authenticity in the BoA, it's still part of LDS doctrine.
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No. There's a story in Fawn Brodie's book where some of the early members were practicing that, but JS didn't like it for whatever reason and was trying to stamp it out. Then at one meeting, a revered guest got up and started in with speaking in tongues, which rather threw a spanner in the mix. JS's response was to smile and say that Brother Whoever was speaking the pure Adamic language, not speaking in tongues. That was the end of that.

Apologies if I got the story somewhat muddled, as it's been years since I read the book, but no, people do not engage in glossolalia in the Mormon church. Reverence is esteemed. You sit quietly and listen to the talks, and add "Amen" at the end. That and singing hymns is about the full force of the audience participation in Sacrament Meeting.
 
pakeha said:
Thanks for your honest and instructive posts, RandFan.
A question.
Is glossolalia practised in the LDS?
I ask because I was taught it as part of a Qi Gong workshop and was later surprised to learn it's considered among Christians to be a sign of the Holy Spirit.
The Wiki entry mentions it as part of the history of the LDS aand I wondered if, like the belief in the authenticity in the BoA, it's still part of LDS doctrine.
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I honestly have never heard of it.
 
Yeah, I never heard anybody go off speaking in tongues, but I did hear stories of various people who spoke in "The Pure Adamic Language".

Never witnessed it.
 
Empress said:
No. There's a story in Fawn Brodie's book where some of the early members were practicing that, but JS didn't like it for whatever reason and was trying to stamp it out. Then at one meeting, a revered guest got up and started in with speaking in tongues, which rather threw a spanner in the mix. JS's response was to smile and say that Brother Whoever was speaking the pure Adamic language, not speaking in tongues. That was the end of that.

Apologies if I got the story somewhat muddled, as it's been years since I read the book, but no, people do not engage in glossolalia in the Mormon church. Reverence is esteemed. You sit quietly and listen to the talks, and add "Amen" at the end. That and singing hymns is about the full force of the audience participation in Sacrament Meeting.
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deaman said:
Yeah, I never heard anybody go off speaking in tongues, but I did hear stories of various people who spoke in "The Pure Adamic Language".

Never witnessed it.
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Interesting and thanks for the responses!
In that crazy Qi Gong workshop they called it "The Language of Heaven", but at the end of the day, whether heavenly or Adamic, it's just glossolalia, IMO.
 
Neither god, or his people, are very good at keeping secrets.

Because there is no god.

The reason God doesn't act, or do something in these cases is because, he doesn't exist.
 
Skyrider44, now that the off-topic discussion of atheism has been split off to the proper thread, can we address the issue of the problems with the Book Of Abraham? I'm afraid that you've been giving the appearance of being unwilling to engage in this discussion.
 
Attending a Religious Wedding? Let’s Hope It’s Not As Bad As These

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints wants U.S. members to marry in ceremonies that exclude literally everyone who is not an active Mormon adult. As an apparent form of spite, Mormons who want to have both a civil ceremony (that all their friends and relatives can attend) and a Church-sanctioned one (for sufficiently pious Mormon folk only) will have to wait a year for a temple marriage. Slate quotes a former Mormon, Jean Bodie, who knows whereof she speaks, having spent 35 years in that faith. “Rejecting and excluding your inactive or nonmember family is a mark of being a good Mormon,” she says unreservedly.
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halleyscomet said:
Attending a Religious Wedding? Let’s Hope It’s Not As Bad As These

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints wants U.S. members to marry in ceremonies that exclude literally everyone who is not an active Mormon adult. As an apparent form of spite, Mormons who want to have both a civil ceremony (that all their friends and relatives can attend) and a Church-sanctioned one (for sufficiently pious Mormon folk only) will have to wait a year for a temple marriage. Slate quotes a former Mormon, Jean Bodie, who knows whereof she speaks, having spent 35 years in that faith. “Rejecting and excluding your inactive or nonmember family is a mark of being a good Mormon,” she says unreservedly.
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Many mothers have cried because they could not be part of one of the most important days of their child's life. The Mormon church doesn't mean to be divisive but they are. They constantly tell their congregants that age old refrain coined by other sects, "be in the world but not of the world". They see themselves as a people of humility and special, the lords people, non-Mormons (with the exception of Jews) are gentiles. At least I think that is how it works it could be that Christians are not considered gentiles.
 
When I got married in the los Angeles Temple of course, only those with a temple recommend could witness the ceremony.

We had a civil ceremony first, but had no problem inviting whomever we wished.

Is this "wait a year" something new?

Let's face it, the "We're Special" component is a feature of any serious, exclusive club. Human beings love that stuff.
 
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