Continuation Part 5: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[Chris_Halkides]

conspicuous

Odd use of conspicuous -

I beg to differ. There is the light sentence, the lack of testing of the putative semen stain, the letter that he did not write himself, Follain's reporting that Mignini felt sorry for him, the Borsini report, etc. When you look at the totality of the evidence (after checking that each piece is serious...), you begin to stop seeing it as "suspicious," and you start seeing it as "conspicuous."

 

[RWVBWL]

Did your biological father die of an heroin overdose?

Mine did.
Back in Dec. 2004. My Mother also shot up back in the end of the '50's, ealy 60's...
My earliest recollection of my Mom is seeing her, at age 5, in 1967, in a rehabillation halfway house...

I was shooting surfpix today at Bay Street in Santa Monica, where the old Z-Boyz used to practice sk8boardin' after the surf sucked.
Saw Stacy Peralta out in the water, a legendary Z-Boy. A bro mentioned that his kid, a musician, at age 24, had OD'd on H recently...

My biological father,
the guy who impregnated my Mom, was a liar, thief and scammer. Heroin was his she-iit. Was it yours too?
My biological dad died from it...


WHY DON'T you normal folks believe what a junkie,
who also sold drugs+who had an arrest hangin' over his head, he who had already testified in 2 previous criminal trials,
who, IIRC, told the cops that he saw nothing out of the ordinary the night before of a brutal, bloody murder,
believe what he said back then?

Yet 4 months later,
the drug selling+using junkie comes forward at the behest of a newspaper journalist and said with spot on memory that he saw THE MAIN SUSPECT+her new boyfriend hangin' around the railin' near the basketball court for hours during the night Miss Meredith Kercher was murdered.

This being the same area where Rudy Guede writes that after he left Miss Kercher to die a horrible death,
he saw dudes playing basketball. But the junkie bum sees no one playing that night, even though it's around the same time...


Did anyone playing basketball that night also see Miss Knox or Mr. Sollecito?
Or only the bum, high on heroin, who says so 4 months after that horrible murder?


Why do you pro-gulit folks believe what the heroin using bum spews forth many months later,
but not what he told the cops in the days after that horrible murder?

 

[Mary_H]

Did your biological father die of an heroin overdose?

Mine did.
Back in Dec. 2004. My Mother also shot up back in the end of the '50's, ealy 60's...
My earliest recollection of my Mom is seeing her, at age 5, in 1967, in a rehabillation halfway house...

I was shooting surfpix today at Bay Street in Santa Monica, where the old Z-Boyz used to practice sk8boardin' after the surf sucked.
Saw Stacy Peralta out in the water, a legendary Z-Boy. A bro mentioned that his kid, a musician, at age 24, had OD'd on H recently...

My biological father,
the guy who impregnated my Mom, was a liar, thief and scammer. Heroin was his she-iit. Was it yours too?
My biological dad died from it...


WHY DON'T you normal folks believe what a junkie,
who also sold drugs+who had an arrest hangin' over his head, he who had already testified in 2 previous criminal trials,
who, IIRC, told the cops that he saw nothing out of the ordinary the night before of a brutal, bloody murder,
believe what he said back then?

Yet 4 months later,
the drug selling+using junkie comes forward at the behest of a newspaper journalist and said with spot on memory that he saw THE MAIN SUSPECT+her new boyfriend hangin' around the railin' near the basketball court for hours during the night Miss Meredith Kercher was murdered.

This being the same area where Rudy Guede writes that after he left Miss Kercher to die a horrible death,
he saw dudes playing basketball. But the junkie bum sees no one playing that night, even though it's around the same time...


Did anyone playing basketball that night also see Miss Knox or Mr. Sollecito?
Or only the bum, high on heroin, who says so 4 months after that horrible murder?


Why do you pro-gulit folks believe what the heroin using bum spews forth many months later,
but not what he told the cops in the days after that horrible murder?

I wish the judges in Florence would read this.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

They don't claim amnesia. I thought we had been through this before.

Halides1, not you too, really, why not show me where I said they had amnesia.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

memory loss versus amnesia

Halides1, not you too, really, why not show me where I said they had amnesia.

You said "memory loss." Please clarify what you did and did not mean.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

You said "memory loss." Please clarify what you did and did not mean.

I mean exactly what I have stated, Amanda herself claims memory loss multiple times, during her trial, in the 'gift' letter to the police and don't forget the nun she saw that revived her memory all of a sudden.

 

[Kevin_Lowe]

I mean exactly what I have stated, Amanda herself claims memory loss multiple times, during her trial, in the 'gift' letter to the police and don't forget the nun she saw that revived her memory all of a sudden.

Does it count as "memory loss" when I can't remember where I put my wallet? Because it's an unusual way to refer to the ordinary process of forgetting things to say that someone is suffering "memory loss". That term is much more associated with dramatic incidents like blackouts or concussion.

 

[Grinder]

pages 76 and 78 on PMF posted by catnip, part 1 and part 2, the entire Volturno's testimony..........


Q: You carried out other investigations in the surrounding zones or just in Corso Garibaldi?
A: Corso Garibaldi and surrounding zones but I did not…

Q: But still all business concerns?
A: Yes, business concerns that had that product on sale, the famous bleach that then had been seized, it was done due to that.

Q: Therefore only business concerns that were selling this product, not in general?
A: Exactly, no.

It would appear from the above that Volturno only went to businesses that might sell bleach. This apparently all because he thought he smelled bleach at Raf's flat. (It still seems very odd that there would be any bleach odor on the 6th and no source where the odor came from detected.)

I'm not clear what the point is. Is it that he would have asked only if Q had seen her buying bleach (he later said she was in that aisle)?

Are you saying that the police didn't ask around the area if the kids had been seen that night or early morning?

It is interesting the fact that the bleach was purchased before the price went up was discounted because the store could have had "old inventory", yet Vultorno didn't check the stock in the stores to see if they had the matching product including the price tag.

So if you could clarify what you were getting at it would be appreciated.

 

[Mary_H]

Does it count as "memory loss" when I can't remember where I put my wallet? Because it's an unusual way to refer to the ordinary process of forgetting things to say that someone is suffering "memory loss". That term is much more associated with dramatic incidents like blackouts or concussion.

Today is Monday. Does everybody remember what they did Wednesday evening? I could not even begin to tell you what I had for dinner -- or anything else, for that matter.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

It would appear from the above that Volturno only went to businesses that might sell bleach. This apparently all because he thought he smelled bleach at Raf's flat. (It still seems very odd that there would be any bleach odor on the 6th and no source where the odor came from detected.)

I'm not clear what the point is. Is it that he would have asked only if Q had seen her buying bleach (he later said she was in that aisle)?

Are you saying that the police didn't ask around the area if the kids had been seen that night or early morning?

It is interesting the fact that the bleach was purchased before the price went up was discounted because the store could have had "old inventory", yet Vultorno didn't check the stock in the stores to see if they had the matching product including the price tag.

So if you could clarify what you were getting at it would be appreciated.[/QUOTE]

You have got to be joking here, Are you doing this on purpose?

as quoted by Dan..........
Why do you have to wonder when testimony was given that the police went around with photos of Amanda and Raffaele asking if they had been seen.

 

[Dan O.]

Why do you pro-gulit folks believe what the heroin using bum spews forth many months later,
but not what he told the cops in the days after that horrible murder?

Because quite frankly that is who they are. If they were not who they are they would be interested in how false memories are created which we have discussed here many times. If they were not who they are they would read some of the many studies on false memories and at least acknowledge the similarities between what happened in Perugia and the test conditions that have been shown to create false memories. Being who they are, they will not read those studies except perhaps to find a contradicting statement to cherry pick. Being who they are, they will steadfastly escalate lies, change subjects or simply dissapear for long periods of time to avoid having to face the possibility that their beliefs were wrong. they are who they are and there is nothing we can do about that.

All we can do is provide a counter poise to help guide lurkers to the truth and away from the delusions that the pro guilt cult offers.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

Because quite frankly that is who they are. If they were not who they are they would be interested in how false memories are created which we have discussed here many times. If they were not who they are they would read some of the many studies on false memories and at least acknowledge the similarities between what happened in Perugia and the test conditions that have been shown to create false memories. Being who they are, they will not read those studies except perhaps to find a contradicting statement to cherry pick. Being who they are, they will steadfastly escalate lies, change subjects or simply dissapear for long periods of time to avoid having to face the possibility that their beliefs were wrong. they are who they are and there is nothing we can do about that.

All we can do is provide a counter poise to help guide lurkers to the truth and away from the delusions that the pro guilt cult offers.

I kid you not, you made me laugh here.......

 

[Grinder]

Today is Monday. Does everybody remember what they did Wednesday evening? I could not even begin to tell you what I had for dinner -- or anything else, for that matter.

Nice trick Mary! Wednesday isn't for another three days!

 

[Grinder]

You have got to be joking here, Are you doing this on purpose?

as quoted by Dan..........
Why do you have to wonder when testimony was given that the police went around with photos of Amanda and Raffaele asking if they had been seen.

I'm more lost than ever on the basic point that is at issue.

Volturno testified about Q and that was always known. I didn't remember that he had only interviewed store people that sold bleach. The fact that he asked about Raf and Amanda specifically about bleach should have made Q answer yes as he had seen her at 7:45 and noted she went to the cleaning section. The information about Volturno certainly doesn't make Q look credible. If anything, it makes it look like he couldn't possibly have seen her as he later reported.

 

[Dan O.]

I'm more lost than ever on the basic point that is at issue.

Volturno testified about Q and that was always known. I didn't remember that he had only interviewed store people that sold bleach. The fact that he asked about Raf and Amanda specifically about bleach should have made Q answer yes as he had seen her at 7:45 and noted she went to the cleaning section. The information about Volturno certainly doesn't make Q look credible. If anything, it makes it look like he couldn't possibly have seen her as he later reported.

As I said at the beginning of this series: "This is standard police work".

Does anyone believe Volturno is the only detective in Perugia that did any canvassing of the neighborhood around the scene of this murder? Of course, my perspective is the standard of work for the US. Perhaps the Italians do things differently. Perhaps they really do believe they can solve crimes without all that hard police work.

The questions that Sherlock doesn't even know to ask and certainly cannot answer is: where would the canvassing activities of the police be documented and why is this information not available to us the public?

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

As I said at the beginning of this series: "This is standard police work".

Does anyone believe Volturno is the only detective in Perugia that did any canvassing of the neighborhood around the scene of this murder? Of course, my perspective is the standard of work for the US. Perhaps the Italians do things differently. Perhaps they really do believe they can solve crimes without all that hard police work.

The questions that Sherlock doesn't even know to ask and certainly cannot answer is: where would the canvassing activities of the police be documented and why is this information not available to us the public?

as quoted by Dan..........
Why do you have to wonder when testimony was given that the police went around with photos of Amanda and Raffaele asking if they had been seen.

And I said, other than V, show me this testimony. Why is it, I have to repeat to you what you said?

 

[RandyN]

Volturno spoke with Quintinvale in the days following the murder. The news was full of the sensational trashy details released by the police and prosecutor with full photos of AK and RS. Either Quintinvale or Volturno is lying! There is absolutely no other way to reconcile this diametrically opposed conclusion about that meeting and statements.

The fact that Quintinvale comes into court a year later with a changed story meanwhile Volturno remains firm about the interview with Quintinvale and his employees is strange not just because of the changed story but because both cant be true and yet that fact...that irrefutable truth that one or the other is lying is not investigated ...in fact it is ignored as the prosecutor steams full forward in court as if the testimony of both is no problem.

I suppose it is no problem if the defense refuses to complain or question why the prosecutor ignores this impossibility....he shamelessly presents both as if they now confirm some sort of truth. The Italian "logic" presentation.

Skum bag Maresca today takes Knox to the cleaners because she wont return to Italy. He thinks she should return to present her side to the court... especially if she is innocent. Maresca must have missed that whole part were she already did that twice over 4 years. And BTW the last time the judge and jury were unanimous that both she and RS were innocent.

No legitimate court has presented facts that would nullify that appeal decision. RS may be subject to retrial since he lives in the dip stick country but here in the USA we have Constitutional protections against double jeopardy...

It will be interesting to watch a panel of judges here review the Italian SC decision overturning the appeal decision if Italy happens to seek Knoxs return. That will be the first time a real court gets a look at this case.

I wish I was a prejudiced anti-Italy zealot who is making all this up because of my hatred for the corrupt country...rather than it being an actual situation of corruption by courts of a country that already holds records for abusive human rights violations according to the independent European Court Of Human Rights.

By the way...I am one generation away from Italy...my grandfather was born there. Thank God he was smart enough to leave.

 

[Dan O.]

You don't have to repeat anything. But you will because you have no other answer. Your narrow view prevents you from seeing the whole picture. Thus the question I said you cannot answer.

 

[codyjuneau]

Skum bag Maresca today takes Knox to the cleaners because she wont return to Italy. He thinks she should return to present her side to the court... especially if she is innocent. Maresca must have missed that whole part were she already did that twice over 4 years. And BTW the last time the judge and jury were unanimous that both she and RS were innocent.

.
Kind of hypocritical considering that when Amanda rose to address the court, it was Maresca that stood up and walked out of the court room.
.

 

[Mary_H]

Nice trick Mary! Wednesday isn't for another three days!

That is why we need people like Gabriella Carlizzi and the Man From Atlan guiding us in this case.