Looking for Skeptics

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wardenclyffe said:
This conversation probably deserves its own thread and this one should be left for when/if flaccon returns. No need to bury the topic here where no one except those already involved in the thread will find it.

Ward
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I suppose we'll never hear from her again, as she didn't get what she wanted from us, but flaccon might benefit from the various glimpses of other people's views and ways of life given through such expansions of the discussions to be found in the latter parts of this thread, if she bothered to read through it. I get the feeling she's totally wrapped up in her own world. She could do with a wider circle of friends.

She didn't recognise what she had here, and has thrown it away. Sad.
 
dlorde said:
Having now read the whole thread (some kind of strange compulsion, although it was interesting - and entertaining in parts), and listened to all the audio that was posted, count me among all those who heard assorted vague noises, but nothing remotely like speech. I've heard EVP samples before, and can understand how people could make out words from them, but not flaccon's samples.

To put it all in some kind of perspective, I read - some while ago - that a study suggested that around 2% of the population admits to hearing disembodied voices (no recordings required). Some find them troublesome and seek help, but the majority accept them and get on with life.

As has already been said, pareidolia is different, but it does suggest to me that someone with this much confusion over pareidoliac voices probably has some more serious underlying problems.

Anyhow, much thanks to all contributors, especially asydhouse and the intrepid Alderbank.
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You must have a mind as strong as an Afghan's stomach! (All travellers to Afghanistan used to get the diarrhoea if not very careful).

Reading this whole thread in one go instead of following as it developed must take a lot of grit! It was boring enough in parts and frustrating, the tedious wrinkles and refusals to cooperate with thinking about the necessary protocols, aims of testing, definitions of testing etc, the back tracking... mind you, it had more drama and live breaking news sections than any other thread I've read, too.

Anyway, I hope you are well after your ordeal. I recommend a good walk in the woods, or the hills, or whatever you've got! ;):D

:)
 
I am Mr Roberts its taken me over 3 weeks to join this site ,Tracy has not bin able to get connection to the internet.She was asked by the board to find out what the spirits were capable off.i sent her a silent recording vie email,and as she played it through her machine it altered my machine.i now have a lap top rigged with just the one voice ,yesterday Mr Bulger purchased a lap top and Tracy reapeated the procedure for a second time,with success.tracy is changing her broadband and she will be back ,she has a doctors appointment tommorowto update him of these new findings.thank you for listenint,Mr Roberts.
 
I am Mr Roberts from Nottingham I have bin helping tracy for the last few months ,and I am only here to tell the truth.
 
scrappy said:
I am Mr Roberts its taken me over 3 weeks to join this site ,Tracy has not bin able to get connection to the internet.She was asked by the board to find out what the spirits were capable off.i sent her a silent recording vie email,and as she played it through her machine it altered my machine.i now have a lap top rigged with just the one voice ,yesterday Mr Bulger purchased a lap top and Tracy reapeated the procedure for a second time,with success.tracy is changing her broadband and she will be back ,she has a doctors appointment tommorowto update him of these new findings.thank you for listenint,Mr Roberts.
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Hi Srappy,


Great to have you. I personally have a few questions for you if you don't mind.


Have you read the thread?

Do you hear the same messages as Flaccon?

Have you researched pareidolia?

Do you know what "success" is?

Have you proposed any significant test protocols?

Why would the doctor be interested in her "new findings" (other than to assess her mental health at the moment)?

Have you given any thought to discouraging her delusions?



Thank you in advance. ☻☺☻

ETA: Who are "the board"?
 
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I have bin with this thread for 4 weeks,
I hear very clear words.
I am aware of paredolia.
I sent her a silent recording as she ran it through her laptop,
it altered the original recording on my lap top
you can clearly hear the spirits tuning them selfs in .
once they were tunend,a voice came over said" welcome to the Roberts people"
Also I clearly hear "We don't want trouble,we want to end trouble"
She continues with her GP ,because the bishop has refused to shed light.
How can I possibly call it a delusion when it is not a delusion?
I hope this helps.
How can I
 
scrappy said:
I have bin with this thread for 4 weeks,
I hear very clear words.
I am aware of paredolia.
I sent her a silent recording as she ran it through her laptop, it altered the original recording on my lap topyou can clearly hear the spirits tuning them selfs in .
once they were tunend,a voice came over said" welcome to the Roberts people"
Also I clearly hear "We don't want trouble,we want to end trouble"
She continues with her GP ,because the bishop has refused to shed light.
How can I possibly call it a delusion when it is not a delusion?
I hope this helps.
How can I
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So, is that a claim that can be replicated, do you think? It could be the basis of a very simple test.

Please understand that every claim flaccon has presented either evaporated as more assumption by flaccon than something she'd tested or it failed under test by us. We approach any new claims with guarded caution.
 
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scrappy said:
I have bin with this thread for 4 weeks,
I hear very clear words.
I am aware of paredolia.
I sent her a silent recording as she ran it through her laptop,
it altered the original recording on my lap top
you can clearly hear the spirits tuning them selfs in .
once they were tunend,a voice came over said" welcome to the Roberts people"
Also I clearly hear "We don't want trouble,we want to end trouble"
She continues with her GP ,because the bishop has refused to shed light.
How can I possibly call it a delusion when it is not a delusion?
I hope this helps.
How can I
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You are aware of pareidolia, but have you researched it? It can not be dismissed with a quick wave of the hand...

Unless you are prepared to actually make a clear claim and have it properly tested, there is absolutely no reason to believe in anything other than imaginative interpretation of mundane compression noise...

Anything else is useless nonsense.

So please, let's start hearing some clear claims.
 
scrappy said:
I have bin with this thread for 4 weeks,
I hear very clear words.
I am aware of paredolia.
I sent her a silent recording as she ran it through her laptop,
it altered the original recording on my lap top
you can clearly hear the spirits tuning them selfs in .
once they were tunend,a voice came over said" welcome to the Roberts people"
Also I clearly hear "We don't want trouble,we want to end trouble"
She continues with her GP ,because the bishop has refused to shed light.
How can I possibly call it a delusion when it is not a delusion?
I hope this helps.
How can I
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It occurs to me that someone might have hoaxed these "spirit voices" for Mr Roberts. If someone played a media file of whispery voices while playing a second person's "silent recording", that second person might be duped into believing the voices were coming from his or her own file.

Mr Roberts, has it occurred to you that someone might have duped you? Or can you affirm there was no possible way for someone to set up a hoax at your unwitting expense?
 
scrappy said:
I sent her a silent recording as she ran it through her laptop,
it altered the original recording on my lap top
you can clearly hear the spirits tuning them selfs in .
once they were tunend,a voice came over said" welcome to the Roberts people"
Also I clearly hear "We don't want trouble,we want to end trouble"
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Welcome to the forum, scrappy! :w2:

What type of recording did you send flaccon? WMV?

Did you play it through your speakers at top volume before and after flaccon played it through her laptop?
 
This may come across as a sweeping generalisation but why is it that people with these sorts of claims can never actually be clear and concise and write in legible sentences?

Scrappy; Are you saying that when you generate a completely silent audio file and send it to Flaccon, that just the act of her playing it on her computer, alters the file on yours?

Would you be willing to demonstrate this under strictly controlled conditions if Alderbank was willing to revisit flaccon and we could find someone close to Nottingham to sit with you at the same time?
 
Welcome to the JREF forum, Scrappy/Mr Roberts. Just in case you aren't aware of this, if you are able to demonstrate (under proper conditions agreed to by both parties in advance) a paranormal or supernatural event, you will be eligible to win one million dollars (and you can start by winning some other local prizes):

http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html

If what you've claimed is true, you may get the money. I hope you are willing to work to develop a protocol that's acceptable to all to test your claims.
 
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Flaccon writes about Mr Roberts on her site:

http://www.chapter23.org/Spirits-in-the-Blood.html (page currently accessible.)

Scroll down to "Page 13".

It explains how Flaccon and Mr Roberts visited a friend of Mr Roberts who is a priest.

It's not clear if this priest is the same priest Flaccon has been talking about here who also refused to investigate.
 
Stray Cat said:
This may come across as a sweeping generalisation but why is it that people with these sorts of claims can never actually be clear and concise and write in legible sentences?

Scrappy; Are you saying that when you generate a completely silent audio file and send it to Flaccon, that just the act of her playing it on her computer, alters the file on yours?

Would you be willing to demonstrate this under strictly controlled conditions if Alderbank was willing to revisit flaccon and we could find someone close to Nottingham to sit with you at the same time?
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I question the wisdom of encouraging any further contact between Alderbank and flaccon. But if Alderbank and flaccon are OK with it, then it should be OK.

Ward
 
Orphia Nay said:
Flaccon writes about Mr Roberts on her site:

http://www.chapter23.org/Spirits-in-the-Blood.html (page currently accessible.)

Scroll down to "Page 13".

It explains how Flaccon and Mr Roberts visited a friend of Mr Roberts who is a priest.

It's not clear if this priest is the same priest Flaccon has been talking about here who also refused to investigate.
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Not sure if the priest is the same guy, but I would just really love to have a chat with the Bishop.

Flaccon and Scrappy seem to want something from a Bishop and it is unclear to me what that is. Did he brush it off, or did he ask the right questions and conclude "pareidolia + imagination"?

Any news on a clear, unambiguous claim, so we we can prove that there are supernatural messages?
 
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to flaccon two weeks ago:

Alderbank said:
We are all interested in what you mean by calibrating machines. I have calibrated plenty of scientific equipment during my career but I suspect that your use of the word is different from mine. Does Mr Roberts help you to calibrate them? It is quite easy to join this forum. If Mr Roberts would like to sign up and contribute to this thread we might make good progress.

I think you and I were able to demonstrate that it is possible to copy your recordings faithfully and enable readers of this thread to hear them as you do. Please take time to read what they think and their views about playing them back. There is some wise advice about playing recordings at full volume with the speaker directly against your ear.
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Welcome to the Forum, scrappy/Mr Roberts. Now that you are here I'm sure we will indeed make good progress. It is interesting that you say you can hear voices speak clear words. Have you listened to the recordings which flaccon gave me to post here? Until now, no-one except flaccon herself can hear words on them. What can you hear?

What does flaccon mean when she talks about calibrating laptops? It means nothing to any of us.

There is nothing paranormal about hearing voices, even hearing clear voices. Thousands of people in the UK hear voices, it is a common symptom of many mental illnesses. Hearing the voices of spirits would be paranormal and earlier on this thread we discussed how to identify whether voices heard were actually those of spirits.

I notice that you say you can clearly hear 'the spirits'. Why do you claim that, and how do you think it could be confirmed? Would you be willing to share with us a recording where you can hear the spirits?
 
Stray Cat said:
Scrappy; Are you saying that when you generate a completely silent audio file and send it to Flaccon, that just the act of her playing it on her computer, alters the file on yours?

Would you be willing to demonstrate this under strictly controlled conditions if Alderbank was willing to revisit flaccon and we could find someone close to Nottingham to sit with you at the same time?
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Yes, I am willing to do this. What about you scrappy?
 
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