LDS

[tsig]

Yes, at "a place to discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly and lively way" [emphasis added].



You ask a throw-away question.



Indeed it is, with the proviso that such discussion should be conducted in a "friendly and lively way."



Or perhaps those presumably dedicated to participating in discussion in a "friendly and lively way" should honor the forum's mission statement.

It's fine to challenge Janadele's position and insist that she defend it; but it isn't fine to attack her personally, as some on this forum have done.

Did you report the personal attacks?

 

[tsig]

A five-minute visit to Rapture Ready will disabuse you of that notion.

Or a visit to virtually any ex-Mormon website, most of which are full of Christians (and which may hurt your head less than RR ).

Could the LDS change it's stance on homosexuality sooner than we might think?

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...urchs-new-MormonsandGaysorg-website.html?pg=1

 

[tsig]

It's a waste of time anyway. You can never get that last nail in.

That's what friends are for.

 

[Shalamar]

Could the LDS change it's stance on homosexuality sooner than we might think?

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...urchs-new-MormonsandGaysorg-website.html?pg=1

I doubt it. Interesting article, but the LDS church has been open towards homosexuals... As long as they never become intimate. Or they can 'properly' marry someone of the opposite gender.

 

[Jon.]

Could the LDS change it's stance on homosexuality sooner than we might think?

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...urchs-new-MormonsandGaysorg-website.html?pg=1

That seems to be more along the lines of other Christian organizations that seek to "cure" homosexuals.

 

[Foster Zygote]

I doubt it. Interesting article, but the LDS church has been open towards homosexuals... As long as they never become intimate. Or they can 'properly' marry someone of the opposite gender.

That sounds a bit like, "We are fine with women wanting to vote, as long as they never actually vote".

 

[dudalb]

So is it okay in your view for a Mormon to try and convert me?

Yes, and it is equally Okay for you to try to convince the Mormon that LDS beliefs are total nonsense. It's called free speech.

 

[Shalamar]

That sounds a bit like, "We are fine with women wanting to vote, as long as they never actually vote".

That is pretty much it.

You can be a welcome homosexual member of the church... As long as you never become intimate with the one you love, never marry the one you love, or you can lie to yourself and marry someone of the opposite gender.

Either way, it sounds like an unhappy, and unfulfilled life.

 

[skyrider44]

. . . What is your take on the anachronisms in question?

This matter has been in the anti-Mormon playbook almost since the Book of Mormon first came off the press. Let's see, the following did not exist in the pre-Columbian Americas according to the critics: certain animals/insects (cows, elephants, horses, silkworms, bees, swine); chariots, coins, compasses, gunpowder, windows, masonry/cement, swords, olive culture, legal codes and concepts, barley, metals, pre-Christian Christianity--and oh, so much more.

Discoveries since Joseph Smith's day have narrowed that list considerably. (BTW, he couldn't have known about some of the items mentioned in the BoM--nor could have anyone else.) To get up to date on LDS scholarship, I suggest you enter "Book of Mormon/Anachronisms" into your search engine. Click on the FAIR Wiki link.

I'm fully cognizant that I make this suggestion in vain, inasmuch as LDS scholarship can't possibly be objective. Still, there may be an open mind or two "out there." You never know.

 

[dafydd]

I suspect that the only open-minded Mormons that you will find are those who have left the cult. Ex-Mormons.

 

[Cleon]

This matter has been in the anti-Mormon playbook

Oh, the "anti-Mormon" crap again.

I suggest you enter "Book of Mormon/Anachronisms" into your search engine. Click on the FAIR Wiki link.

Yeah, FAIR was brought up earlier. Their "explanations" for these anachronisms are rather amusing - for example, they think that when the BoM was talking about "horses" it probably "really" meant deer and tapir.

"FAIR" makes crap up to support their belief in a made-up book.

 

[jsfisher]

This matter has been in the anti-Mormon playbook almost since the Book of Mormon first came off the press. Let's see, the following did not exist in the pre-Columbian Americas according to the critics: certain animals/insects (cows, elephants, horses, silkworms, bees, swine); chariots, coins, compasses, gunpowder, windows, masonry/cement, swords, olive culture, legal codes and concepts, barley, metals, pre-Christian Christianity--and oh, so much more.

Discoveries since Joseph Smith's day have narrowed that list considerably. (BTW, he couldn't have known about some of the items mentioned in the BoM--nor could have anyone else.) To get up to date on LDS scholarship, I suggest you enter "Book of Mormon/Anachronisms" into your search engine. Click on the FAIR Wiki link.

I'm fully cognizant that I make this suggestion in vain, inasmuch as LDS scholarship can't possibly be objective. Still, there may be an open mind or two "out there." You never know.

You assume far too much. I've explored the FAIR wiki site. While its objectivity is certainly suspect, the explanations it offers are poor and not credible.

Notice, by the way, that I don't rant on about it being full of lies and just anti-anti-Mormon propaganda and then refuse to even look at the site. Perhaps you could return the kindness with some of the non-Mormon links others have provided in this very thread. Turn about and all that?

 

[Slowvehicle]

This matter has been in the anti-Mormon playbook almost since the Book of Mormon first came off the press. Let's see, the following did not exist in the pre-Columbian Americas according to the critics: certain animals/insects (cows, elephants, horses, silkworms, bees, swine); chariots, coins, compasses, gunpowder, windows, masonry/cement, swords, olive culture, legal codes and concepts, barley, metals, pre-Christian Christianity--and oh, so much more.

Discoveries since Joseph Smith's day have narrowed that list considerably. (BTW, he couldn't have known about some of the items mentioned in the BoM--nor could have anyone else.) To get up to date on LDS scholarship, I suggest you enter "Book of Mormon/Anachronisms" into your search engine. Click on the FAIR Wiki link.

I'm fully cognizant that I make this suggestion in vain, inasmuch as LDS scholarship can't possibly be objective. Still, there may be an open mind or two "out there." You never know.

Why do you claim that it is "anti-mormon" to ask for evidence?

 

[carlitos]

This matter has been in the anti-Mormon playbook almost since the Book of Mormon first came off the press. Let's see, the following did not exist in the pre-Columbian Americas according to the critics: certain animals/insects (cows, elephants, horses, silkworms, bees, swine); chariots, coins, compasses, gunpowder, windows, masonry/cement, swords, olive culture, legal codes and concepts, barley, metals, pre-Christian Christianity--and oh, so much more.

Discoveries since Joseph Smith's day have narrowed that list considerably. (BTW, he couldn't have known about some of the items mentioned in the BoM--nor could have anyone else.) To get up to date on LDS scholarship, I suggest you enter "Book of Mormon/Anachronisms" into your search engine. Click on the FAIR Wiki link.

I'm fully cognizant that I make this suggestion in vain, inasmuch as LDS scholarship can't possibly be objective. Still, there may be an open mind or two "out there." You never know.

I went and took a look and, with regard to the few subjects that I know personally, the apolgetics at that page were pretty lame. Just one example, the language page cherry-picks 3 nahuatl words that kinda sorta sound like Hebrew words, except that they don't.

 

[DragonLady]

Just one example, the language page cherry-picks 3 nahuatl words that kinda sorta sound like Hebrew words, except that they don't.

Ughm...a question? How long has Hebrew been a written language? And did any of the Native American have any coherent writings when Columbus arrived?

I'm just asking...but it seems if Hebrews came to America, they would have brought that skill with them; and I think it follows they would have written quite a bit. I doubt they would have only written on one set of "golden tablets" considering the time and work involved; and written contracts and such would have been needed everyday? Has any such thing ever been found?

 

[RandFan]

I should add that there was a time, in a more civil age, when it was considered boorish and coarse to denigrate a person's faith, and--by extrapolation--the person himself/herself.

What civil age are we talking about here? The civil age in which Mormons were massacred in their journey across the US by devout Christians? The civil age in which Mormons did not exist at all, but other devout Christians burned each other for heresy? There has never been an age in which one faith has not persecuted others.

This ^^^^

When I attended the University of Utah (and was still very much Mormon) I wrote a paper on the persecution of Mormons and how that deviated from the constitution's guarantee of freedom of religion.

I've no idea what skyrider is talking about.

 

[RandFan]

This matter has been in the anti-Mormon playbook almost since the Book of Mormon first came off the press. Let's see, the following did not exist in the pre-Columbian Americas according to the critics: certain animals/insects (cows, elephants, horses, silkworms, bees, swine); chariots, coins, compasses, gunpowder, windows, masonry/cement, swords, olive culture, legal codes and concepts, barley, metals, pre-Christian Christianity--and oh, so much more.

Discoveries since Joseph Smith's day have narrowed that list considerably. (BTW, he couldn't have known about some of the items mentioned in the BoM--nor could have anyone else.) To get up to date on LDS scholarship, I suggest you enter "Book of Mormon/Anachronisms" into your search engine. Click on the FAIR Wiki link.

I'm fully cognizant that I make this suggestion in vain, inasmuch as LDS scholarship can't possibly be objective. Still, there may be an open mind or two "out there." You never know.

Give us an example? Arguing via link is considered poor form. No one is telling you to simply go look at anti-Mormon sites. We are engaging you with examples. So address those or give us your own and don't simply tell us to google.

 

[dafydd]

I've no idea what skyrider is talking about.

Me neither. You should have heard the Crusaders going on about the Muslims and the Jews. Shocking stuff. I spent the first ten years of my life in Catholic/Protestant segregated Glasgow. The two factions never denigrated each other, no, not never.

 

[dafydd]

Give us an example? Arguing via link is considered poor form. No one is telling you to simply go look at anti-Mormon sites. We are engaging you with examples. So address those or give us your own and don't simply tell us to google.

Surely an infallible god wouldn't have put any mistakes in the BOM? The thing is full of them.

 

[Jon.]

Surely an infallible god wouldn't have put any mistakes in the BOM? The thing is full of them.

"The Guide is definitive. Reality is frequently inaccurate."