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The crucifixion of Jesus Christ

Shiner said:
I'm concerned about this fascination with donkeys, PC.

I imagine you are trying to prove a point by saying that donkey foals (plural) are only around at a given time of year, but you are clutching at straws. Nobody can ride a new born animal.:confused:

A donkey (singular) matures at ~4y.o. So, a 1y.o, 2y.o, or a 3y.o, is still considered a young animal, and may be referred to as a foal.

Can you google PC?

LMGTFY

http://www1.agric.gov.ab.ca/$department/deptdocs.nsf/all/agdex598

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donkey
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Why am I fascinated with donkeys? It is what Jesus used in His triumphant entry to Jerusalem on July 27, 1 BC or Av 9, 3760. It was five days before Passover. Christians celebrate this entry as Palm Sunday (Matthew 21:1-11; Mark 11:1-11; Luke 19:28-40; John 12:12-19). Zechariah 9:9 is fulfilled, which states: “Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass.”

From the website of Carl and Sybil Sewell (have bred and raised donkeys for almost thirty years) of Windy Ridge Farm, Leslieville, Alberta, Canada, at http://www.albertadonkeyandmule.com/pdfs/foaling-out-the-jennet.pdf , it says: “Spring is almost here and with the change of seasons comes foaling time for equine breeders ... Considering both the jennet’s welfare and the donkey life span of 30-50 years, breeding every second year is a viable alternative that allows for foals to always be born early in the spring – May-June – when they can best benefit from the excellent spring grass.”

It means that Passover when Jesus was crucified was not during spring or in the month of Nisan because the foal was just born. Can a newly born foal carry a 6’8” man? FYI, Jesus was 6’8” tall.

If the foal was born in spring, three months later, in the month of Av or in August, the foal could be big enough to carry Jesus.
 
Craig B said:
You have not lost your astounding ability to spring surprises on us! The Bible was written by the Apostles' children? That's a new one!
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Yes, Craig B, the spirit of Ama revealed to us that the New Testament was not written by the disciples of Jesus themselves but by their children who were not eyewitnesses of the accounts mentioned therein. That is why you may say that there are discrepancies. I believe that if it is the word of Jesus, it is true and correct. The disciples must not have written down exactly what Jesus said word for word like in John chapters 14, 15, 16 and 17. How about when Jesus was praying and no one is around?

Like in the crucifixion of Jesus. Ama recommended that we use “Pasiong Mahal” for details in addition to the Holy Bible. He recommends the King James Version because He said that it is “nearer the truth.”
 
Blue Mountain said:
While I haven't studied any of the other gods in the list, I suspect a good number of them could promise me a long life (if not an everlasting one.)

The point that you missed is that humans have believed in thousands of gods ever since their brains developed enough to come up with the concept. Why should you think the one you believe in is the One True God? Did he kill all the others off?
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In Isaiah 45:23, it states: “I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.”

To whom shall “every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear”? To the only true God, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, who is called in the Old Testament as the Father or God the Father. The epistle of Saint Paul to the Philippians states in 2:10-11, “That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.”

Yes, it is only through Jesus Christ, the crucified Jesus Christ, that we can go to Heaven and live for eternity with Him. Not only life here on earth but also in the afterlife. That is why I say that if we were to worship a god, we have to be sure that He is the only true God.
 
LaurelHS said:
Please expand on this, because I don't understand. How did the wounds of Christ appear for people to touch? Are you talking about stigmata or something else?
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There are some people present in the sessions who the spirit of Ama asked to poke through the wounds. And then He asked them if it was hard and plastic. They said that it was a bit wet and soft and fresh. It was not hard and plastic. It was not stigmata. I will look for that session and post the translation to you. So far, there are just a few who had the privilege of touching and poking through the wounds.

I remember He said that if He says that we may poke through the wounds on such and such date, after we have poked through it on such and such date, we will not be interested to come anymore. However, if He does not give any particular date, we will continue attending the sessions in the hope that one day, He may ask anyone to poke through it.
 
pakeha said:
^
A great recap of your efforts to expose the fictitious nature of Angelina Imden.
I'd forgotten the Lake District could be considered mountainous terrain
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Whittow's Dictionary of Physical Geography "Some authorities regard eminences above 600 m (2,000 ft) as mountains, those below being referred to as hills." See http://www.walkingenglishman.com/mountains.html By that modest standard there are 231 mountain peaks in England, very many in the Lake District. A mere 67 of these are above 2,500 feet, the great majority in the Lake District. And only 7 of these are above 3,000 feet.
 
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PeaceCrusader said:
From the website of Carl and Sybil Sewell (have bred and raised donkeys for almost thirty years) of Windy Ridge Farm, Leslieville, Alberta, Canada, at http://www.albertadonkeyandmule.com/pdfs/foaling-out-the-jennet.pdf , it says: “Spring is almost here and with the change of seasons comes foaling time for equine breeders ... Considering both the jennet’s welfare and the donkey life span of 30-50 years, breeding every second year is a viable alternative that allows for foals to always be born early in the spring – May-June – when they can best benefit from the excellent spring grass.”

It means that Passover when Jesus was crucified was not during spring or in the month of Nisan because the foal was just born. Can a newly born foal carry a 6’8” man? FYI, Jesus was 6’8” tall.

If the foal was born in spring, three months later, in the month of Av or in August, the foal could be big enough to carry Jesus.
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PC, you do realise that on modern farms, animals are bred when the owners want them to be bred, don't you? You see, you need a "boy" donkey and a "girl" donkey to get together, so if the farmer wants them to breed and give birth at a certain time of the year, he will only let them sleep together when HE wants them to.

At other times of the year, "boy" Donkeys are kept in separate fields and "girl" Donkeys wear chastity belts.

I imagine in Palestine 2000 years ago, Donkeys got it together whenever they felt up to it.

You are also making the assumption that Jesus actually existed, for which there is no evidence.

Norm
 
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This means I live on a mountain, then?
Fantastic, I feel as though I've been upgraded.

PeaceCrusader said:
...

From the website of Carl and Sybil Sewell (have bred and raised donkeys for almost thirty years) of Windy Ridge Farm, Leslieville, Alberta, Canada, at http://www.albertadonkeyandmule.com/pdfs/foaling-out-the-jennet.pdf , it says: “Spring is almost here and with the change of seasons comes foaling time for equine breeders ... Considering both the jennet’s welfare and the donkey life span of 30-50 years, breeding every second year is a viable alternative that allows for foals to always be born early in the spring – May-June – when they can best benefit from the excellent spring grass.”

It means that Passover when Jesus was crucified was not during spring or in the month of Nisan because the foal was just born. Can a newly born foal carry a 6’8” man? FYI, Jesus was 6’8” tall.

If the foal was born in spring, three months later, in the month of Av or in August, the foal could be big enough to carry Jesus.
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That's a lovely site you've quoted, PC.
Did you understand the farm is in Canada?
Did you understand the breeders control when the births occur?

Do you really imagine a three month old foal can carry a 6'8'' man?
Seriously?

PeaceCrusader said:
...I remember He said that if He says that we may poke through the wounds on such and such date, after we have poked through it on such and such date, we will not be interested to come anymore. However, if He does not give any particular date, we will continue attending the sessions in the hope that one day, He may ask anyone to poke through it.
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Brilliant.
 
PeaceCrusader said:
There are some people present in the sessions who the spirit of Ama asked to poke through the wounds. And then He asked them if it was hard and plastic. They said that it was a bit wet and soft and fresh. It was not hard and plastic. It was not stigmata. I will look for that session and post the translation to you. So far, there are just a few who had the privilege of touching and poking through the wounds.

I remember He said that if He says that we may poke through the wounds on such and such date, after we have poked through it on such and such date, we will not be interested to come anymore. However, if He does not give any particular date, we will continue attending the sessions in the hope that one day, He may ask anyone to poke through it.
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Where exactly were the wounds that people "poked through"?
 
Welcome to the Forum, Laurel.
Like you, I'm interested in knowing more about this claim of PC's.
 
Craig B said:
gMatthew, indeed, seems to be saying the opposite in Chapter 25 So one attains salvation not by believing in the divinity of Jesus (or believing in anything whatsoever, for that matter) but by performing acts of righteousness toward even the "least". A much more wholesome doctrine!
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Matthew 25:35-40 is the only part of the Bible that I actually agree with, and practice in real life. If Aristeo's god existed (but I very much doubt it!) I think I'd stand a vastly better chance than Aristeo of getting into its exclusive club.

Not that I want to, mind you... I'd rather camp out on a nice, quiet planet somewhere far away from this mythical "heaven." Hosanna-ing and hallelujah-ing and all that silly subservient rot would just give Me a headache and interfere with My clarinet practice.

Oh, and I think you'd need a rather tall horse to carry a 6'8" man. Not a donkey foal: Instead of waving palm fronds and cheering, the crowd would have been snickering at the goofy tall guy with his feet and robes dragging on the ground, or yelling at him to get the {Rule 10} off that poor baby donkey before he killed it.

By the way, I think we should indict Jesus and his followers for Grand Theft Donkey, as the poor little thing and its ma were "lifted" on the orders of JC. Read the Gospel passage.
 
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PeaceCrusader said:
Zechariah 9:9 is fulfilled, which states: “Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass.”
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You need to remember two things:

Zechariah 9:9 is a prophecy, not a description of something that happened, and the New Testament was deliberately written so as to fit the prophecies.

You are attaching way too much significance to the word "foal".
 
Mojo said:
You need to remember two things:

Zechariah 9:9 is a prophecy, not a description of something that happened, and the New Testament was deliberately written so as to fit the prophecies.

You are attaching way too much significance to the word "foal".
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And even if Jesus did do that, it was a prophecy widely known at the time. So Jesus just becomes a poser trying to fulfill a prophecy he knew about. It's like having a prophecy that the next King will roll into Vegas in a pink Cadillac and wear blue swede shoes. You can bet your... err... donkey, that every poser that tries to establish himself as fulfilling that prophecy will get a pink Cadillac and blue swede shoes. It is meaningless, if it's that trivial to fulfill for someone who knows about it.

But more importantly, we can get a hint that Jesus DIDN'T actually fulfill that even in the made up NT, since the original text actually was about only one donkey. In fact, since the confusion only exists in the Greek translation, but wouldn't be taken that way by a native speaker of either Hebrew or Aramaic, much less by a rabbi like Jesus is supposed to be, we can be sure that it was just made up by someone working from the Septuagint and trying to make up stuff Jesus fulfilled.

1. It doesn't actually say "foal". That's an artefact of the English translation. The original Hebrew word is "ben", which just means "son". Really it's the same words you'd use to speak of, say, Jesus ben Joseph. (Although by Jesus's time you'd use the Aramaic "bar".) It doesn't indicate anywhere that it would be very young too. You could be something like Cain ben Adam even if you were 500 years old.

2. But it gets worse. The "son of an X" construct was in both Hebrew and Aramaic just a way to say X. E.g., "son of man" just meant "man" (so much for that grand title of Jesus) and "son of a donkey" meant just "donkey".

3. But let's look at how it actually read in the original. It says "mounted on a donkey, on a colt, the son of a donkey." Bearing in mind that, again, "son of donkey" is just a repetition of "donkey".

Such repetition was in Hebrew just a way to emphasize something. It doesn't mean two (or even three) donkeys. It's emphasizing the one donkey.

4. The thing is, unlike English, most languages have genders for most words. Although for animals even English maintains separate words for the two genders. E.g., you can talk about a pig if it's male or unknown/generic, or about a sow if it's female. E.g., you'd talk about a cow if female or unknown/generic, but about a bull or an ox if it's male. You talk about a horse generically, or about a stallion if specifically male, or about a mare if it's female. E.g., you'd talk about a dog if male or unknown/generic, but for a female... eh, it would probably get censored :p

So is it for Hebrew too. The words in the original actually have the genders of the donkeys involved. Adding that information it becomes, "mounted on a [male] donkey, on a [male] colt, the son of a [female] donkey". Teh oops. There is no way to fulfill that mis-translation to the letter. You need a donkey A who is male, and a donkey B who is male, and if you want to also fulfill the "son of" relationship with only two donkeys, now you need A to also be female. Futanari donkeys ftw, I guess ;)
 
PeaceCrusader said:
If the foal was born in spring, three months later, in the month of Av or in August, the foal could be big enough to carry Jesus.
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That would most certainly be cruel to the donkey. At three months, the foal has not even been weaned yet, and it would not be used to carry anything at that age, certainly not a giant man.
 
This thread has been surreal for quite some time, but I have to say that transgendered donkeys is a new high point for me.
 
HansMustermann said:
And even if Jesus did do that, it was a prophecy widely known at the time. So Jesus just becomes a poser trying to fulfill a prophecy he knew about. It's like having a prophecy that the next King will roll into Vegas in a pink Cadillac and wear blue swede shoes. You can bet your... err... donkey, that every poser that tries to establish himself as fulfilling that prophecy will get a pink Cadillac and blue swede shoes. It is meaningless, if it's that trivial to fulfill for someone who knows about it.
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My thoughts exactly. The Gospel story about Jesus riding into Jerusalem is not the fulfilment of a prophesy. I think it was just inserted into the story by someone who wanted to flesh out the character of Jesus by making him appear to fulfil a messianic prophesy.

But even if it did happen as written, it still isn't a prophesy. Essentially it's just a narcissistic brat playing dressup and acting out something he heard in shul 20+ years earlier when he was prepping for his bar mitzvah.
 
The size of the donkey determines the load weight it can carry without causing it harm and the load weight is the combined weight of the rider and tack (saddle, pad, etc). At no time, for any reason should weight be placed on the back of an immature donkey. Mature means the donkey has all of its adult teeth. For a miniature donkey maturity can be 4 ½ to 5 years old, for standards 5 to 5 ½ years old, and for large standards and mammoths it can be at late as 7 to 7 ½ years old. You can not gauge the maturity of a donkey by its size. You must lift the lip and look at its teeth. I am including a table that has the recommended loadweight capacity for donkeys based on their average height and weight.
http://www.shadowridgedonkeys.com/articles/saddle_for_standard_donkeylw.htm

It's fun to learn.
 
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