The crucifixion of Jesus Christ

[Craig B]

The Holy Bible was written by the children of the apostles who pieced together the notes of their parents and made the stories. The writers were not eyewitnesses of the accounts.

You have not lost your astounding ability to spring surprises on us! The Bible was written by the Apostles' children? That's a new one!

 

[Blue Mountain]

In the list of gods you presented, is there anyone who says like what Jesus said in John 14:6, to wit: “Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.”

Is there anyone who says that he/she is the way to where the Father is (Heaven is where God the Father is), the truth, and the one who can give eternal life?

While I haven't studied any of the other gods in the list, I suspect a good number of them could promise me a long life (if not an everlasting one.)

The point that you missed is that humans have believed in thousands of gods ever since their brains developed enough to come up with the concept. Why should you think the one you believe in is the One True God? Did he kill all the others off?

 

[LaurelHS]

Did you know that there are some members who were allowed by Ama to touch the wounds of the crucified Christ, fresh and a bit wet. I asked to but was declined until today.

Please expand on this, because I don't understand. How did the wounds of Christ appear for people to touch? Are you talking about stigmata or something else?

 

[Astreja]

In the list of gods you presented, is there anyone who says like what Jesus said in John 14:6, to wit: “Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.”

Why would they bother say such a ridiculous thing? There are as many ways to express one's spirituality as there are people on Earth. "Jesus" is merely a fictional mouthpiece for priests who wanted people to abandon other gods.

Is there anyone who says that he/she is the way to where the Father is (Heaven is where God the Father is), the truth, and the one who can give eternal life?

I assert that no one -- God or mortal -- can give eternal life. Eternal life is a sad myth created to comfort people who didn't live the lives they wanted to live, or who suffered injustice, or who are just plain scared of dying.

When you die, your personality ceases immediately and never returns. The atoms of your body are longer-lived, but they will not carry your ideas into eternity. "You" are gone.

Therefore, I assert that Jesus -- Or whoever actually wrote those lines in the Bible -- simply lied about there being such things as heaven and eternal life.

 

[Astreja]

That is why I am asking you to check it out yourself by going to the Philippines or asking any member of their experiences with Angelina Imden.

Aristeo, you are the person making the claim on this forum about Angelina Imden. You have the responsibility to defend your own claim. We aren't going to waste money travelling to the Philippines to talk to people who might be even less believable than you are.

I ask, why do you ignore the results of my checking the revelations? I myself have found that the August 17 crucifixion and May 23 birth of Jesus are true and correct.

We reject your calculations and your reasoning. It's rubbish. It's fetid, deluded nonsense based on shoddy unsupported premises, based on a made-up calendar and the bleatings of a false prophet and a book that contains silly things like people coming back from the dead.

It's trash. Your foundational premises are simply too flimsy to support your conclusion, so all you've done is trapped yourself in a loop of unsupported assertions, execrable logic, gullibility and wishful thinking.

I say again: We (definitely plural) reject your assertion about the CruciFiction. We don't care how "correct" you think your calculations are, because you seem to be wrong about virtually everything you've posted since you came here. You believe things that no rational adult human being would take seriously.

You still do not understand that Ka Apaz and the spirit of Ama are two distinct and separate entities. Ka Apaz is not faking Ama.

I disagree. Not only do I think that "the spirit of Ama" is completely fictional; I also think that "Ama" will vanish the moment Ka Apaz is no longer physically capable of being its voice. In fact, from your own descriptions of her I have reason to suspect that she is already in a state of accelerating physical decline, with small-vessel ischemic brain damage (not uncommon among the aging population).

Did you know that there are some members who were allowed by Ama to touch the wounds of the crucified Christ, fresh and a bit wet. I asked to but was declined until today.

Stage makeup and a bit of meat that's had holes punched in it.

 

[Craig B]

... Did you know that there are some members who were allowed by Ama to touch the wounds of the crucified Christ, fresh and a bit wet. I asked to but was declined until today.

No, I do not "know" such a thing, or even believe it. Are you asserting that the body of Christ is now manifesting itself, as well as the alleged "channelled" words? But this is ludicrous! Anyway Jesus recommended (according to gJohn, Chapter 20) that people should believe in his resurrection without seeing or touching his wounds, and he reprimands "doubting" Thomas for requiring such proof.

26 A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you!” 27 Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.” 28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!” 29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.".

So the touching of wounds you have "experienced" is not a blessing from any Jesus, but a delusion and a fraud perpetrated by a vile swindler and deceiver.

 

[Astreja]

The true God is giving us this time while we are alive. His time is when we are in the afterlife. He will settle account with us.

I prefer an immediate settlement of accounts. I would much rather deal with deeds and misdeeds in a timely manner, receiving rewards and making restitution to real people in the real world.

I do not deal with imaginary Accounts Receivable departments in fictitious celestial accounting firms.

To any True Gods reading this thread: Please tender an invoice or credit note, as appropriate, and debit or credit My account accordingly.

 

[pakeha]

Well, to be fair, Jesus didn't say that either. That bit is introduced over half a century after the death of Jesus and there are no parallels in earlier accounts. In fact, the earlier Christologies disagree with this idea.

Hi, Piggy! We've read some interesting claims here and I'd be glad to have your considered opinion on them.

The OP claims that at the time of Tiberius Caesar, the Jews celebrated Passover in August, and that Jesus was crucified 17 August 1BC, IIRC.

This apparently based on the idea the jews used a strictly lunar calendar to calculate the dates for festivals.

Does this idea have legs?

 

[SezMe]

... The Holy Bible was written by the children of the apostles who pieced together the notes of their parents and made the stories.

The apostles were all illiterate. How could they write notes?

Beyond that, where did you acquire this fiction?

 

[SezMe]

Did you know that there are some members who were allowed by Ama to touch the wounds of the crucified Christ, fresh and a bit wet. I asked to but was declined until today.

Members of what? Are you asserting that your Christ was physically in the Philippines recently? Who saw him? Was his presence reported in the paper? On TV?

Is this his first reappearance? Why didn't he visit the pope? Or Pat Robertson. An appearance on the 700 Club would have been cool.

Christ was killed 2000 years ago yet his wounds are fresh? How does that work?

And lastly, you being declined means that you are in correspondence with one or more of your cult members. How do you correspond? If you had not been declined, would you have gone back to the Philippines? Was Christ going to wait around for you to show up? Why were you declined? How did you know Christ had reappeared?

 

[Craig B]

Well, to be fair, Jesus didn't say that either. That bit (that nobody comes to the Father except through Jesus) is introduced over half a century after the death of Jesus and there are no parallels in earlier accounts. In fact, the earlier Christologies disagree with this idea.

Very true. gMatthew, indeed, seems to be saying the opposite in Chapter 25

37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? 38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? 39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? 40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

So one attains salvation not by believing in the divinity of Jesus (or believing in anything whatsoever, for that matter) but by performing acts of righteousness toward even the "least". A much more wholesome doctrine!

 

[AdMan]

PeaceCrusader, will you please address this:

Just remember, Jack by the hedge, abaddon, and others, to always say the truth.

Says the poster who LIED to the members of this forum when he said he would denounce Ama/Ka Apaz as a false prophet if the Olympic Games prediction failed to come true and that he would stop discussing her prophecies on the Internet.

How can you honestly admonish people not to lie when you have so obviously lied to us?

 

[pakeha]

Based on what you and others said about Angelina Imden, I understand why you doubt that she is telling the truth. I say that maybe she does not want to reveal her whereabouts – even when I asked her if we could just correspond (via snail mail), or her reply to Manuel de la Cruz that the nearest city is about eight hours away. FYI, I have a road map of Great Britain and I don’t think that her whereabouts in GB would be eight hours away from a city.

That is why I am asking you to check it out yourself by going to the Philippines or asking any member of their experiences with Angelina Imden.

I am asking you to check the Internet when the foaling season of an ass is because you are very good at the Internet.

I ask, why do you ignore the results of my checking the revelations? I myself have found that the August 17 crucifixion and May 23 birth of Jesus are true and correct. Check it up yourself.

You still do not understand that Ka Apaz and the spirit of Ama are two distinct and separate entities. Ka Apaz is not faking Ama. You check it out yourself if you wish. But based on my experience and the others experiences, they are two separate entities.

Did you know that there are some members who were allowed by Ama to touch the wounds of the crucified Christ, fresh and a bit wet. I asked to but was declined until today.

Hi, PC.
Thanks for your thoughtful answer.
It must have been an incredibly moving experience for your friends to have actually touched the wounds of Jesus.

However, this sort of phenomenon is not difficult to fake.
Has your medium ever done psychic surgery?

Since you have a roadmap of England, could you look to see where there are mountains in England?

To tell the truth, I'd love to visit the Philippines, but the thing is, the elusive Angelina Imden is in England.
All I could do in the Philippines is talk to people who think they heard her voice in a seance.
That really proves nothing, does it?

Remember- there WAS no Helene Curtis fortune.
The idea anyone has 60 + corpses in the home is simply absurd.
It evokes the Kabayan mummies found in the Philippines.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fire_Mummies

As for donkeys, you can find out a lot just by going to Wikipedia, as I did.
Shiner has posted information here in this thread as well.
Did you read their posts?

As for the crucifixion date, I've yet to see anything to show the Jews have celebrated the Passover at anytime other than Spring.
The discussion of temperatures, fig trees and donkeys has only confirmed that, you know.

PC, I have a fair amount of experience with mediums. Enough to recognise the marks of a professional. Your medium is simply one more.
Because of the shown inacurracy of her utterances alone, you should be warned off.
Remember the ludicrous falseness of her tale of Reniliniyindi?

 

[Mojo]

Based on what you and others said about Angelina Imden, I understand why you doubt that she is telling the truth. I say that maybe she does not want to reveal her whereabouts – even when I asked her if we could just correspond (via snail mail), or her reply to Manuel de la Cruz that the nearest city is about eight hours away. FYI, I have a road map of Great Britain and I don’t think that her whereabouts in GB would be eight hours away from a city.

That is why I am asking you to check it out yourself by going to the Philippines or asking any member of their experiences with Angelina Imden.

Going to the Phillipines will not change the geography of Britain.

 

[fromdownunder]

Based on what you and others said about Angelina Imden, I understand why you doubt that she is telling the truth. I say that maybe she does not want to reveal her whereabouts – even when I asked her if we could just correspond (via snail mail), or her reply to Manuel de la Cruz that the nearest city is about eight hours away. FYI, I have a road map of Great Britain and I don’t think that her whereabouts in GB would be eight hours away from a city.

So you admit that Angelina Imden lied to you about her location being 8 hours from a city in mountains that don't even exist in England.

There seems to be a lot of that going around when you post.

Norm

 

[pakeha]

...I ask, why do you ignore the results of my checking the revelations? I myself have found that the August 17 crucifixion and May 23 birth of Jesus are true and correct. Check it up yourself.

You still do not understand that Ka Apaz and the spirit of Ama are two distinct and separate entities. Ka Apaz is not faking Ama. You check it out yourself if you wish. But based on my experience and the others experiences, they are two separate entities. ...

Your calculations depend on two premises-
1) Your medium gave you accurate information
2) The Jews used a purely lunar calendar to determine the dating of festivals.

As for the first premise, your medium has been shown repeatedly over several threads in this very forum, to be inaccurate.
Instances of this would include the 2012 Olympic prediction, the silly mix-up with the nails, the stories about Reniliniyindi and her nonexistent marriage to Philip the Fair, the tale of the Pharisees and the storm, the account of the golem//ubashti Pontius Pilate and the news the cross used in the crucifixion was carved in one piece from a tree planted by the BVM in a previous incarnation.
Who could possibly take anything revealed in a seance with this woman seriously?
Mediums and psychics can be very convincing-there are at least two current threads dealing with the subject.
However, they are frauds.
Remeber that medium in Spain I wrote about? She would also exhibit stigmata to her followers.
And out of curiosity- did the people in those seances put their hand under the sheet that covered the medium to touch what were presented as Jesus' wounds?

As for the second, you've yet to show the Jews have ever celebrated the Passover outside of the times set for it in the Torah.
PC, you've even claimed the parable of the fig tree substantiates your idea.

 

[HansMustermann]

In the list of gods you presented, is there anyone who says like what Jesus said in John 14:6, to wit: “Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.”

Is there anyone who says that he/she is the way to where the Father is (Heaven is where God the Father is), the truth, and the one who can give eternal life?

Sure, I can. I can promise you eternal life, all right. I can promise you lots of oral sex in my heaven too, while I'm at making empty promises. (For the women too. I'm not sexist about my afterlife.) And free one-gazillion-bazillion-bits per second internet. In fact, it'll be so fast that whatever you want will finish downloading BEFORE you click the link. And a free spaceship. And forget angels with harps, in MY heaven they have some frikken sweet electric guitars. Enough promises for you to convert?

And let me tell you, I'm not just the son of the Father, but they call me the son of a thousand Fathers

And yeah, I'm not just the way, I'm the subway and the overpass too. And the airline while I'm at it.

Promising bullcrap is easy. Saying bullcrap is easy.

Now if you had some evidence that your imaginary friend actually delivers, now that would be something useful. But just that some schizophrenic dude in Palestine thought he's God and spouted nonsense promises, whop-de-do, now that's unimpressive.

 

[Agatha]

PC, once again I remind you that I live in England. The only mountains in England (and they are not high, as mountains go) are in the Lake District. Most people call them hills as they are readily climbable by amateur walkers. None of them even attains a height of 1000 metres.

Assuming 'Angelina Imden' lives there, she is not eight hours from a city - indeed there is no place in England which is eight hours from a city. If she lives in the Lake District, her nearest cities would be Carlisle or Lancaster, with a huge selection of large towns even closer. The Lake District is relatively densely populated (it's the most densely populated National Park in the UK).

However, and this is important, there is no such person as Angelina Imden recorded as living anywhere in England. Not in the phone book or on any district electoral register, and not on any birth or marriage (or death) record. You claim that she goes on corpse-exhumation missions, but have yet to explain how she is managing to smuggle dozens of corpses past the UK Border Agency, or what passport she travels on given that she does not appear to exist.

You have reported her as being taller than the tallest known woman in Britain by quite some margin, and yet nobody appears to have alerted the newspapers or the Guinness World Records organisation; a surprising omission if this story was true.

We've already dealt with the nonsense of the Helene Curtis fortune; the company is American, set up by a Mr Gidwitz and a Mr Stein, went public in the 1950s, controlled by Mr Gidwitz's son Ronald since 1979 and sold to Unilever in 1996. The names of all the descendants of Messrs Gidwitz and Stein are known, and none is called Angelina Imden. There is no possible way that this fictional character could have been the heir to the Helene Curtis cosmetics company.

The only explanation to all this is that Ka Apaz (or Ama, if you insist) lied to you about Angelina Imden. Just like the lie about the Olympic Games, just like the lie about the non-existent Reneliniyindi. These things are false.

What will it take, PeaceCrusader, for you to see through these dangerous, unChristian lies? You say you believe in Jesus and in God, so why do you accept the lies - the false witness - of Ama? Don't Ama's lies directly contravene a commandment?

 

[pakeha]

^
A great recap of your efforts to expose the fictitious nature of Angelina Imden.
I'd forgotten the Lake District could be considered mountainous terrain.
But as you say the total lack of any records for this woman should raise red flags in PC.
Just as does the total lack of ways to trace Rosalina Miraflor, another product of these seances.

PC, have you ever submitted your calculations and ideas about the dating of Passover to Hebrew scholars?
You've completely ignored the contributions of posters here on the subject of Jewish custom.
Perhaps talking to a rabbi was be interesting?

 

[Mojo]

Based on what you and others said about Angelina Imden, I understand why you doubt that she is telling the truth.

Based on what you have said about Angelina Imden, pretty much everyone here doubts that she even exists. You have provided no evidence whatsoever that she exists, and many claims about her that are highly implausible, patently false, or both.