2012 Debates

After watching a few sound bites I've arrived at this points:

  • Obama, true to form, is not an attack dog, or at least not a good one.
  • Romney did well with sound bite attacks which Obama didn't deflect as he could have
  • The debt is high as is unemployment. The answers, as good as they may be, are difficult to explain in this format.
  • Romney called out Obama on his (Obama's) economic "promises". The reality is some didn't come true. Regardless of any sound reasons, it wins points for Romney
  • Clearly, the economy is Obama's weakest link. I think the macro view, looking back tells a very good story. What I didn't see (I've only seen sound bites) is Obama pointing to the successes while articulating the flaws of Romney's plan. This message needs to be pounded in.
  • Romney played fast and loose with his own record and previous comments (health care and cutting teachers are but 2 examples). They played well tonight. It will be key if he's called on it over the next week and if Obama is prepared to call him on them next time.
  • I expected Romney to do well and knew the (damn liberal) media would give him bonus points for holding his own, much less landing some good points. I expect a significant change in the polls over the next few days. How long it lasts depends on if the (damn liberal) media continue to fawn over it.
 
not_so_new said:
I think the Obama team is okay with what their candidate did tonight, he didn't fall into any major traps. As someone just said on the TV, Obama was playing "a prevent defense" so they did what they did to just get by.
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I was thinking rope-a-dope as a better metaphor. It could work well if Obama is able to exploit the punches he took with little or no counters, e.g., the $716 billion meme.
 
Snide said:
I was thinking rope-a-dope as a better metaphor. It could work well if Obama is able to exploit the punches he took with little or no counters, e.g., the $716 billion meme.
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Right, I meant to include this in my last post. I'm hoping this is a strategy on Obama's part. Also, he comes across as an underdog which is good with so much time left until the election. It will get dems off their couches and out to vote.;)
 
I thought one of the more telling moments, that accurately showed either how delusional or full of crap Romney is- was when he said that on his very first day as President, he would sit down with Democrat leaders, and magically inspire cooperation.

Obama then pointed out right after, that(paraphrasing) "he's going to have a very long day, because he plans on repealing Obamacare also on his first day". He then suggested quite sarcasitcally that Romney would have "great success inspiring cooperation with the Dem's, right after repealing Obamacare."


The problem as I see it, is that many of the people who see a Romney "victory" tonight, are either too delusional, or too stupid, to admit/recognize that he's completely full of ********.

I'm hoping the folks in the undecided category are able to read between the lines more successfully.

Edited by Myriad: 
Edited for Rule 10.



We do not permit evading the auto-censor, which turns certain naughty words into asterisks, by using variant spellings of the naughty words or similar means. Using images equivalent to the words is not allowed either.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Myriad
 
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IMO

If the polls move in Romney's favor over the next day or two then he won the debate. Right now RCP has Obama +3.1.
 
:D OK, so now I've seen what the talking heads had to say, and they're all declaring it a unanimous Romney epic win.

I'm really not seeing it. Taken in isolation, I see a marginal Romney win, and taken as an event in the campaign I don't see he won anything for reasons already expressed.

What explains this? Romney Derangement Syndrome?? Already?
 
I didn't watch a minute of the debate, but I've read most of this thread, and quite a few headlines. Verdict: Romney won.

I'm still surprised how people are surprised to learn Obama stammers and ums. This plagues some otherwise hyper-articulate people, such as screenwriter Aaron Sorkin. From his pen pours marvelous monologues but in interviews he's all uhs. And he has an annoying voice. Anyway, I'd almost welcome a Romney victory just to see the reaction on these boards.
 
R.Mackey said:
:D OK, so now I've seen what the talking heads had to say, and they're all declaring it a unanimous Romney epic win.

I'm really not seeing it. Taken in isolation, I see a marginal Romney win, and taken as an event in the campaign I don't see he won anything for reasons already expressed.

What explains this? Romney Derangement Syndrome?? Already?
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Well all Romney had to do is not piss himself to look good. As mentioned, Obama isn't a go for the kill type guy in debates & he stumbled several times throughout.

I would call this as an epic win for Romney if it weren't for the fact that he had Obama on the proverbial ropes & then managed to hit himself in the nuts by mentioning that he didn't have any plans.

Also, IMO, the fact checking won't do Jack.
 
Cain said:
I didn't watch a minute of the debate, but I've read most of this thread, and quite a few headlines. Verdict: Romney won.

I'm still surprised how people are surprised to learn Obama stammers and ums. This plagues some otherwise hyper-articulate people, such as screenwriter Aaron Sorkin. From his pen pours marvelous monologues but in interviews he's all uhs. And he has an annoying voice. Anyway, I'd almost welcome a Romney victory just to see the reaction on these boards.
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I haven't seen it either, but the headlines seem to indicate a Romney victory.

Here's one:
Romney Soars, Obama Fumbles

There was no question -- Romney won the debate. He ran away with it. He did all the things the stern-faced pundits and nervous Republicans had spent the past week saying he had to do -- look presidential, articulate a vision, talk specifics. And he was handed the unexpected gift of an opponent who was decidedly off his game -- a stumbling, rambling, dull-edged Barack Obama who spent most of the debate on the defensive.

In CNN's insta-poll of 430 registered voters who watched the debate, 67 percent said they thought Romney had done a better job, versus just 25 percent who gave it to Obama -- the highest-rated performance in any post-debate snap poll going back to 1984. Solid majorities of those polled said they believed Romney would do a better job than Obama on the economy, health care, taxes, and the deficit. Thirty-five percent said the debate made them more likely to vote for Romney; 18 percent were more likely to vote for Obama, while 47 percent said it would have no effect on their vote. If those numbers hold and enough voters watched, the debate could have a real impact in Romney's favor.
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Some fact-checking:

Taking Stock of Some of the Claims and Counterclaims

But among other misleading statements, Mr. Romney falsely stated that Mr. Obama had doubled the deficit. “The president said he’d cut the deficit in half,” Mr. Romney charged. “Unfortunately, he doubled it.”

Mr. Obama made a number of misleading statements of his own — mainly by filling in the blanks of some of Mr. Romney’s vague plans, usually in the least politically palatable way. He described Mr. Romney’s tax plan as a $5 trillion tax “cut” and said the average middle-class family would pay more, contrary to Mr. Romney’s pledges.
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They're giving Romney the benefit of the doubt here because of his vagueness.

So now the upshot is that low-information voters think that Romney would do a better job on the deficit. Despite the fact that his plan to do that lacks any specifics that allow his claims to be evaluated. The things he has been specific about would increase the deficit, such as lowering tax rates and raising military spending, but the things he would do to offset those are extremely vague.

Doubling the Deficit

Mr. Romney said Mr. Obama had doubled the deficit. That is not true. When Mr. Obama took office in January 2009, the Congressional Budget Office had already projected that the deficit for fiscal year 2009, which ended Sept. 30 of that year, would be $1.2 trillion. (It ended up as $1.4 trillion.) For fiscal year 2012, which ended last week, the deficit is expected to be $1.1 trillion — just under the level in the year he was inaugurated. Measured as a share of the economy, as economists prefer, the deficit has declined more significantly — from 10.1 percent of the economy’s total output in 2009 to 7.3 percent for 2012.
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Somehow stumbled onto Michelle Malkin's Facebook page to read the comments about the debate. So far I've seen Obama referred to as Purple Lips, Camp Kenya, Sharia Muslim, and several other things I can't post here. Now I must go weep for humanity...
 
jerrywayne said:
Where was Obama to counter this? A real Nowhere Man! I will not vote this time around. No one to represent the liberal.
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I'll agree Obama did a poor job of countering Romney's falsehoods, but that doesn't mean it's over. It's not. We've two more of these to go.

It's funny how the mantra regarding Romney's poor polling numbers has been "There's still plenty of time", but now that he's possibly gained a slight advantage, it's suddenly game over.
 
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