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Vaccine/autism CT discussion

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Clayton Moore said:
(at the expense of physicians)? When was the last time you arrived at a half full doctors office?
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Everyday.

Now answer the question.

In earlier threads you blamed greedy physicians, hospitals and "BigPharma" for pushing vaccines.

Now you are blaming insurance companies for pushing combination vaccines to save money (at the expense of physicians).

Which is it? You have two mutually exclusive theories here.

Who specifically is to blame?
 
Tomblvd said:
Everyday.

Now answer the question.

In earlier threads you blamed greedy physicians, hospitals and "BigPharma" for pushing vaccines.

Now you are blaming insurance companies for pushing combination vaccines to save money (at the expense of physicians).

Which is it? You have two mutually exclusive theories here.

Who specifically is to blame?
Click to expand...

Clayton has a whole grab bag of mutually contradicting theories on all sorts of subjects. He can't keep his story straight from one post to the next.
 
Clayton Moore said:
(at the expense of physicians)? When was the last time you arrived at a half full doctors office?
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This past Wednesday. As luck would have it it was a pediatrician's office. We were there to get our son's 6 month vaccinations. Also, it was less than half full. No patients were there at all when we arrived & a mother showed up with her 12 month old about halfway through. There were 6 exam rooms so... 1/3rd full would be correct.
 
Clayton Moore said:
(at the expense of physicians)? When was the last time you arrived at a half full doctors office?
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Just to add my experience to the list, the last time I went to the doctor was the end of last month. The office was much less than half full (I think one other person was there). In fact, I arrived twenty minutes early and yet did not have to wait at all. They called my name before I had even walked from the check-in desk to the waiting room.

It looks like this question is not the powerful rhetorical move you thought it would be.
 
Clayton Moore said:
Garbage.
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I assume by "Garbage" you mean that you had a hard time finding the papers because I used a shortened citation that did not include titles. Below are the citations with the titles. Even if these are not definitive (I am not an expert, so I cannot make that assessment), they at least provide good evidence that autism does not begin at 18 months. Along with the studies that have looked directly at the alleged vaccine-autism link and found no link, and studies that find links between autism and other factors, I see no reason to give any credence to the vaccine-autism hypothesis.

"Brain enlargement is associated with regression in preschool-age boys with autism spectrum disorders" PNAS December 13, 2011, vol. 108, no. 50, 20195–20200.

"Evidence of Brain Overgrowth in the First Year of Life in Autism" JAMA 2003;290:337-344 .

"BRAIN DEVELOPMENT IN AUTISM: EARLY OVERGROWTH FOLLOWED BY PREMATURE ARREST OF GROWTH" MENTAL RETARDATION AND DEVELOPMENTAL DISABILITIES RESEARCH REVIEWS 10: 106–111 (2004)
 
Clayton Moore said:
Garbage.
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BenjaminTR said:
I assume by "Garbage" you mean that you had a hard time finding the papers because I used a shortened citation that did not include titles. Below are the citations with the titles. Even if these are not definitive (I am not an expert, so I cannot make that assessment), they at least provide good evidence that autism does not begin at 18 months. Along with the studies that have looked directly at the alleged vaccine-autism link and found no link, and studies that find links between autism and other factors, I see no reason to give any credence to the vaccine-autism hypothesis.

"Brain enlargement is associated with regression in preschool-age boys with autism spectrum disorders" PNAS December 13, 2011, vol. 108, no. 50, 20195–20200.

"Evidence of Brain Overgrowth in the First Year of Life in Autism" JAMA 2003;290:337-344 .

"BRAIN DEVELOPMENT IN AUTISM: EARLY OVERGROWTH FOLLOWED BY PREMATURE ARREST OF GROWTH" MENTAL RETARDATION AND DEVELOPMENTAL DISABILITIES RESEARCH REVIEWS 10: 106–111 (2004)
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Just to make it even easier...

http://www.pnas.org/content/108/50/20195.abstract

http://jama.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=196951

http://www.eric.ed.gov/ERICWebPorta...&ERICExtSearch_SearchType_0=no&accno=EJ904415

Now that Clayton can read the papers referred to as they are just a click away, he can see whether or not they are garbage. If he concludes that they are garbage, he'll be able to explain to us how he came to that conclusion - what flaws there were in the methodology of the studies that justifies their dismissal as "garbage".

Given his consistent failure to do this with the studies that have looked at the alleged vaccine-autism link and found no association, I'd be surprised if he did this with the above papers.
 
Clayton, just to expand on your idiocy, even if every pediatrician's office is full, what's going to make them and their hospitals more money, treating the common cold and other run of the mill maladies they're treating now, or a waiting room and hospital ward full of kids with pertussis, measles and other diseases made rare by vaccines?

Do you even think about these things before you hit "send"?
 
Tomblvd said:
Clayton, just to expand on your idiocy, even if every pediatrician's office is full, what's going to make them and their hospitals more money, treating the common cold and other run of the mill maladies they're treating now, or a waiting room and hospital ward full of kids with pertussis, measles and other diseases made rare by vaccines?

Do you even think about these things before you hit "send"?
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Back in the day, to my knowledge, most children didn't go to the doctors office for the common childhood diseases.
 
Clayton Moore said:
Back in the day, to my knowledge, most children didn't go to the doctors office for the common childhood diseases.
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Really? How much research have you carried out or are you just making it up as you go along yet again? If the doctor visited or the child visited the doctor, what difference did it make? What are you trying to say?
 
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Straw Man said:
Back in the day? When was this day exactly? 10 years ago? 20? 50? 200?

Also, what are you basing this data on?
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to my knowledge

Ask any senior citizen.

Doctors were not the demigods that they are now envisioned to be. We can thank Hollywood for that.
 
Clayton Moore said:
Doctors were not the demigods that they are now envisioned to be. We can thank Hollywood for that.
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Wrong. When I was a kid in Glasgow doctors were highly respected members of the community. Their word was gospel. You really must try and cease spouting these blanket statements.
 
Clayton Moore said:
to my knowledge
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Noted

Clayton Moore said:
Ask any senior citizen.
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I've just asked 3, and heard many tales from these people being treated as kids for childhood diseases by their doctor.

Clayton Moore said:
Doctors were not the demigods that they are now envisioned to be. We can thank Hollywood for that.
Click to expand...

Doctors always have, and still are well respected, and are not treated like demigods, even by Hollywood.
 
Clayton Moore said:
Back in the day, to my knowledge, most children didn't go to the doctors office for the common childhood diseases.
Click to expand...

We aren't talking about "back in the day", we are talking about right now. The children in doctor's offices are there for colds, not pertussis.

Now quit changing the subject and answer the question.
 
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