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General Holocaust Denial Discussion Part II

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Our non Randian non existent all is co-incidence no such thing as a telepathic connection is working very well today Fish.

I was actually trying to spell the tricky word, "paraphernalia" and was looking to see how it is spelt in a dictionary when you posted.
 
LemmyCaution said:
I have read, where the Fish Reporr is involved, about car parks, Polish women, floods, beer, more beer, and so on. At first it seemed to concern a scientific expedition, on the sly, and chiseling and investigating, to be done at Auschwitz with the aim of Scientific Truth. Then it was mostly about being forthcoming. And beer. The Reporr devolved into a rather pedestrian and pedantic travelogue, not at all friendly to Poland and its residents.
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Yes, LemmyCaution, there are many strings to my bow, and I think I can say with some confidence that I am probably the only member of JREF who has led international teams on fieldtrips to Auschwitz-Birkenau in the quest for historical truth.
 
Clayton Moore said:
And if the bully, the authorities, kills my wife and children threats of consequences become moot. As in all bets are off.
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What if he kills your wife, and says he'll come back for your kids if you put a toe out of line? What if he's pointing a gun at your head as his friend kills your wife? What if you quote-mined my entire post except for the one line you wanted ot respond to?

No, wait, that last one actually happened.

The usual human reaction to seeing someone killed is shock. One is extremely unlikely to suddenly become the guy from Taken, and bullets don't really care if you're pissed off or not.

You're ignoring Doc's post.


Clayton Moore said:
The SOP of Holocaust huggers is lying by omission.
....
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You really are completely lacking in self-awareness, aren't you?


Charles Traynor said:
Wrong! Official exterminationist doctrine is to not debate the holocaust with revisionists. ...
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This coming from the guy who claimed that a winter was nine months long and then refused to discuss that claim, and who's debate techniques seem to consist almost entirely of making false assertions about his opponents which he refuses to back up, and ignoring the logic fails of his allies.
 
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Charles Traynor said:
Yes, LemmyCaution, there are many strings to my bow, and I think I can say with some confidence that I am probably the only member of JREF who has led international teams on fieldtrips to Auschwitz-Birkenau in the quest for historical truth.
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I see. Were any members of the team historians? What records did you look at? What physical evidence? Whose witness testimony?
 
Straw Man said:
Sorry I couldn't deliver you a speedy reply - enjoying real life that a Saturday brings.

Quite happy to answer your questions. My uncle was 8th Rifle Brigade, and was on a Bren carrier. If it has to be broken down to company/platoon, Unfortunately I do not have that information to hand.
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Did it never occur to you that your uncle may have been lying about his role in the so-called liberation of Belsen?


Straw Man:
An officer wordlessly handing his crew a couple of bottles of Scotch. Looking for guards who tried to disguise themselves as prisoners, but were easy to find as they were glowing with health, and the realisation that it was far more fun to shoot them in the legs or hips, rather than kill them outright. Being ordered to take your seat on a D-4, and move the empty husks of human beings into a large hole. This was a man who had not spoken (as far as I'm aware) to anyone, and was used to seeing dead bodies, or even creating them.

[Emphasis mine]
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I presume you reported him to the police as a suspected war criminal?

It may interest you to learn that the British did not fight their way into Belsen concentration camp. The guards your uncle and his cronies brutalised had volunteered to remain in the camp to maintain order whilst the British took control of it.

Those brave German men and women were further punished for their humanitarian gesture of remaining behind by being forced to handle diseased corpses without protective clothing, contrary to the Geneva Convention on the treatment of POWs.
 
Border Reiver said:
Alright, I'm coming clean.

I did however ask for evidence of this alleged hate speech or child molestation Mr Traynor accused her of - still waiting.
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She visits schools giving lectures which are filled with her hate filled lies. You might find a video or two of her engaed in this type of activity on YouTube?

Zisblatt estimates she has spoken to 6M children over the years. :eek:
 
Charles Traynor said:
She visits schools giving lectures which are filled with her hate filled lies. You might find a video or two of her engaed in this type of activity on YouTube?

Zisblatt estimates she has spoken to 6M children over the years. :eek:
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You are trusting someone you call a liar to be correct on the number of people she has spoken to?
 
Charles Traynor condemns us for not speaking out against the confabulations of Irene Zisblatt, but is perfectly happy with the truly vile and hate-filled lies of his fellow deniers.

Charles Traynor's concern is not truth. His concern is solely with spreading his message of Holocaust denial.
 
ANTPogo said:
Charles Traynor condemns us for not speaking out against the lies of Irene Zisblatt, but is perfectly happy with the truly vile and hate-filled lies of his fellow deniers.

Charles Traynor's concern is not truth. His concern is solely with spreading his message of Holocaust denial.
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I'm still waiting for him to address Rudolf and Leuchter. Maybe CM can stand in and tell us what he thinks of those frauds?
 
Charles Traynor said:
Did it never occur to you that your uncle may have been lying about his role in the so-called liberation of Belsen?...
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Everyone, note how Traynor stays two qualifiers away from actually saying the uncle was lying. The possibility that the recollection has been somehow distorted by time and distance from the original event is not raised. The sentence actually does double-duty

1. Implies the uncle was lying (which Traynor never actually states, despite the clear implication later in the post).
2. Implies Straw Man is unwilling or incapable of considering the possibility of 1.

...Those brave German men and women were further punished for their humanitarian gesture of remaining behind by being forced to handle diseased corpses without protective clothing, contrary to the Geneva Convention on the treatment of POWs.
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Not a single source cited, oddly enough. If you mean the Fourth GC, that was signed in 1949. When did WW2 end again?

http://www.icrc.org/ihl.nsf/full/380

Art. 90: Workers shall receive suitable working outfits, including protective clothing, whenever the nature of their work so requires.

What would I find if I looked up your claim of the brave Belsen volunteer guards, I wonder?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bergen-Belsen_concentration_camp#Liberation

Initially lacking sufficient manpower, the British allowed the Hungarians to remain in charge and only commandant Kramer was arrested. This had tragic results, as SS guards and Hungarians subsequently shot and killed some of the starving prisoners who were trying to get their hands on food supplies from the store houses.
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What were you saying about war crimes?
 
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Sorry I came here to read about the Holocaust and Holocaust Denial discussion, not read about Irene Zisblatt or some silly reporr. The Holocaust is not Irene Zisblatt. Nor is Holocaust denial.

No one is under the obligation to write anything admitting anything whatsoever here. Certainly not when it is done to please a fallacious argument in favour of reviving perverse Jew hating Neo Nazi witch-hunting either.

Which is what your bullying hectoring ideas remind me of.
 
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Charles Traynor said:
Did it never occur to you that your uncle may have been lying about his role in the so-called liberation of Belsen?
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What exactly did he have to gain by lying to me? Absolutely nothing.


Charles Traynor said:
Straw Man:

I presume you reported him to the police as a suspected war criminal?
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Nope. I also haven't dressed up anything to make it seem more wonderful. Coming across a sight like that obviously affected him and others mentally.

Charles Traynor said:
It may interest you to learn that the British did not fight their way into Belsen concentration camp. The guards your uncle and his cronies brutalised had volunteered to remain in the camp to maintain order whilst the British took control of it.
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Really, Mr Traynor? Were you in charge of troop movements that day? There were no units of Waffen-SS in the area?

Charles Traynor said:
Those brave German men and women were further punished for their humanitarian gesture of remaining behind by being forced to handle diseased corpses without protective clothing, contrary to the Geneva Convention on the treatment of POWs.
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Those 'brave' German men and women, as you put it, had beaten, tortured, abused and murdered their captives for the crime of being Jewish, or homosexual, or disagreeing with the Nazi regime.
 
Charles Traynor said:
TSR, repeat after me: "Irene Zisblatt is a vile hate filled liar:"
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Since I have never asserted the opposite, why are you so transparently trying to distract from your own vile, hate filled lie?

Here, ct, complete this sentence: "the message in which TSR defended Zisblatt is..."

Thirteen and counting.
 
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Originally Posted by Charles Traynor View Post
She visits schools giving lectures which are filled with her hate filled lies. You might find a video or two of her engaed in this type of activity on YouTube?

Zisblatt estimates she has spoken to 6M children over the years.
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Moss said:
You are trusting someone you call a liar to be correct on the number of people she has spoken to?
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Where does it say he trusts her statement?

You gotta love the in your face audacity of using the 6 million number.
 
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