Merged Apollo "hoax" discussion / Lick observatory laser saga

[jaydeehess]

I did. Look at my last post. That issue is simply too basic. Only a liar would say what you said. I urge all people who doubt to talk to geologists and engineers about it.

You also maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real because that's NASA's position. No one in his right mind would do that after having seen the proof that it was faked.

The NASA space missions from Mercury through to the present have all been real and yes the Chinese have been in orbit and performed a spacewalk.

FF88, now is the time to reveal where Jay Windley gets his disinfo paycheque, or the office from which it is lssued,as well as some proof of the claim.
Having made the statement i made above I require this in order to apply for an entry level disinfo position. I could use the extra income

 

[tsig]

He totally discredited himself when he backed Jay Windley. That issue is simply too basic. Tell us what you think. Also, tell us whether you maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real. I'm still waiting Border Reiver. Do you maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real?

Of course it was real. Physics says so.

 

[jaydeehess]

Of course it was real. Physics says so.

but thats the physics that NASA uses, not the fissicks that FF88 knows

 

[threadworm]

FatFreddy has no answer to the evidence other than call people liars.

I've posted this elsewhere but not everyone visits DIF, so people might like to see it.

I found this video on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrFFbyuQqt4&feature=relmfu It's a rather awesome unedited collection of Apollo TV broadcasts.

The first quarter of an hour is a one take shot broadcast on the 16th of July. It has a beautiful view of Hurricane Bernice that only appeared in that configuration on that date. I digress. Over the course of 15 minutes of footage the Earth should rotate by a noticeable amount. Does it? You be the judge:

I also came across this:

in this article:

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/414431/a-reporters-moon-trip/3/

It's on sale on ebay and is clearly marked with the date - July 17th.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-Mission-Control-Manned-Spacecraft-Center-Houston-Texas-Press-Photo-/190699396022

There's Earth right there on the screen. In that same youtube clip above there is another TV broadcast, and Armstrong tells the world he is going to turn it upside down.

Here is a screen capture of the moment when the Earth is in the same configuration as it is on the big screen in the photo:

How did I do Freddy? What part of any of that is a lie? I think I've posted more credible evidence to defend my position in this one post than you ever have, anywhere.

The other videos in the Apollo 11 facts series on that youtube site are also very good - well worth a watch.

 

[FatFreddy88]

and you DO understand that no one here agrees with that, right?

Here's a pro-Apollo person who finally agreed with me when he saw he couldn't tire me out and bury the issue.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8141778&postcount=7982

What part of the Chinese having a spacewalk was impossible for them to do? Can they get to orbit? Can they buy or manufacture an airtight suit? Can they open doors? How racist are you to think they can't do something that simple?

I didn't say it was impossible. I said this particular spacewalk was faked. The evidence is too clear. Here it is.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=NVbBFwdmldA
http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=kG4Z_r38ZDE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBL98p0wZ7g
http://en.epochtimes.com/n2/content/view/8332/
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/content/view/5809/

In this video the safety cable is obviously buoyant. It has a distinct tendency to to upward.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=ES&hl=es&v=gMxQEHfU6hM

Watch it at these time marks.
0:50
2:10
3:00
3:10
6:08
6:44
6:53

It's going upward because it's slightly lighter than water.

At the thirty second mark in this clip the astronaut moves the flag from right to left.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvpPknmHGAM

The flag flutters the way it would in a medium such as water.

The fast flag movement can be explained by sped-up video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBL98p0wZ7g
(1:55 time mark)
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Tell us if you agree with BetaMax's explanation for the buoyant safety cables. Click on this link...
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8139186&postcount=7954

...and click on the bottom link of the post. Go to page 12 of that thread and read his explanation.

Part of my evidence that you people don't even believe your own arguments about Apollo is that you maintain that this spacewalk was real. This was so obviously faked that only a sophist would try to make people think it was real.

Here's my quote from post #8364 again.

You people keep repeating this because you know my sincere answer might get me banned. I won't say it directly. I'll post this and you can try to infer my answer from it.
http://www.opposingdigits.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1222
(excerpt)
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Planting of provocateurs (and sleeper agents, etc.). These people will vary from the posters who suddenly show up one day under an alias attacking regular posters, to people who seem like regular posters themselves. They may work in teams, supporting each other and giving the illusion of popular support on the net. (Remember, net IDs are basically free, and one person can have many.)
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Now try to infer what I think is going on here. You know I dare not say it directly.

edit-
-----------------------
Regarding the above post–photos and video can be taken by unmanned craft so your photos and video don't prove there were people at that distance from the earth.

 

[threadworm]

~spam removed@

Regarding the above post–photos and video can be taken by unmanned craft so your photos and video don't prove there were people at that distance from the earth.

and you're a seven year old girl.

Your reply is useless. I've asked you before and you didn't answer: How? Not what - how?

Which probe?

What camera capabilitiies did it have?

When was it launched?

Where was it controlled?

How was it controlled?

Who controlled it?

The shots that go from filming people in zero gravity to shots of a distant earth - how was that done?

Stop waving your arms, you're causing a draught and you aren't answering the questions people have put to you.

 

[FatFreddy88]

Which probe?

What camera capabilitiies did it have?

When was it launched?

Where was it controlled?

How was it controlled?

Who controlled it?

These are pretty lame questions which are hardly worth the time, as if I had access to classified info. Are you saying it was impossible? Are you saying NASA didn't have the capability to do all of that? If they had the capability, it's plausible and photos from space therefore can't be used as proof that there were people in space. They also don't make the mountain of hoax proof go away.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8033032&postcount=1
(bottom link)

The shots that go from filming people in zero gravity to shots of a distant earth - how was that done?

Are you saying it was impossible to fake. Please link to one of those shots so we can discuss what we actually see. Also, please tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables which I mentioned earlier.

 

[jaydeehess]

These are pretty lame questions which are hardly worth the time, as if I had access to classified info. Are you saying it was impossible? Are you saying NASA didn't have the capability to do all of that? If they had the capability, it's plausible and photos from space therefore can't be used as proof that there were people in space. They also don't make the mountain of hoax proof go away.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8033032&postcount=1
(bottom link)


Are you saying it was impossible to fake. Please link to one of those shots so we can discuss what we actually see. Also, please tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables which I mentioned earlier.

Even if you had shown the possibility that the entirity of the Nasa missions could be faked(which you have certainly not done) you cannot then declare that all of the various required operations in that fakery were performed without some definitive proof of that.

The fact that you conflate supposition with evidence/proof also explains your inability to explain your proof that persons disagreeing with you are agents sent to counter you.

 

[FatFreddy88]

The fact that you conflate supposition with evidence/proof also explains your inability to explain your proof that persons disagreeing with you are agents sent to counter you.

When I put the flag anomaly forward as proof of a hoax, I'm not conflating anything.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymwE1sNm82Y
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7yc2rVOs00

Nor am I conflating anything when I say that the movement of the tip of Collins' jacket corner is this clip is consistent with gravity.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fqdB1b53jc
(00:52 time mark)

When I say that the movement of Collins' jacket corner is obviously in the same environment as this guy's jacket corner...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTNGNW5Evs4

...and obviously in a very different environment from that in these two videos...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ofwzby1c7o
(3:17 time mark)

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TejsnPThmd4

...I'm not conflating anything.

Tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables.

 

[Garrison]

FF88 you really can't grasp it can you? It is you who have no credibility. You continue to accuse people of lying for no better reason than that you cannot conceive that you could possibly be wrong even when multiple posters have taken the time to explain how badly flawed your arguments are. There is no silent majority applauding your efforts; you are all alone in your beliefs, an Apollo Don Quixote.

 

[FatFreddy88]

FF88 you really can't grasp it can you? It is you who have no credibility. You continue to accuse people of lying for no better reason than that you cannot conceive that you could possibly be wrong even when multiple posters have taken the time to explain how badly flawed your arguments are. There is no silent majority applauding your efforts; you are all alone in your beliefs, an Apollo Don Quixote.

All you people can do now is post empty rhetoric and, when I finally disappear because I get tired or banned, you'll go on as if nothing had happened.
None of you dares to say whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables that I keep requesting that you do because you know he's so obviously wrong that you'll just end up looking silly if you agree with him.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8452301&postcount=8545

You can pretend all you want but you've lost this debate. Your behavior would get you laughed out of the debating hall.

 

[jaydeehess]

When I put the flag anomaly forward as proof of a hoax, I'm not conflating anything.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymwE1sNm82Y
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7yc2rVOs00

Nor am I conflating anything when I say that the movement of the tip of Collins' jacket corner is this clip is consistent with gravity.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fqdB1b53jc
(00:52 time mark)

When I say that the movement of Collins' jacket corner is obviously in the same environment as this guy's jacket corner...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTNGNW5Evs4

...and obviously in a very different environment from that in these two videos...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ofwzby1c7o
(3:17 time mark)

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TejsnPThmd4

...I'm not conflating anything.

Tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables.

I do not see the same interpretation, or arrive at the same conclusions as you do.
In all cases you have been shown to be in error , after which you often resort to the "do you deny it could be faked" which essentially has you equating 'possibility' with "proof"

I simply cannot accept such illogic nor can I comprehend that anyone would.

 

[jaydeehess]

how would agreeing or disagreeing with Betamax prove the fakery you insist must have occured?

 

[FatFreddy88]

how would agreeing or disagreeing with Betamax prove the fakery you insist must have occured?

Agreeing with BetaMax would show that you are less-than-objective and therefore not fit to analyze Apollo hoax evidence.

In all cases you have been shown to be in error , after which you often resort to the "do you deny it could be faked" which essentially has you equating 'possibility' with "proof"

But I haven't been shown to be in error. You people just have the attitude that I have. I pointed out that the tip of Collins' jacket corner was below where the bottle was attached to his torso and that part of the jacket corner behaved the way it would in gravity and nobody took it beyond that.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fqdB1b53jc
(00:52 time mark)

You haven't shown that to be wrong. Go ahead and do it now. Also, please say whether you agree with BetaMax in his analysis of the buoyant safety cables.

 

[threadworm]

These are pretty lame questions which are hardly worth the time, as if I had access to classified info. Are you saying it was impossible? Are you saying NASA didn't have the capability to do all of that? If they had the capability, it's plausible and photos from space therefore can't be used as proof that there were people in space. They also don't make the mountain of hoax proof go away.

[spam removed]


Are you saying it was impossible to fake. Please link to one of those shots so we can discuss what we actually see. Also, please tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables which I mentioned earlier.

Yes, I am saying it is impossible to fake. I am saying that people took that footage, and they took that footage where they said they took it, when they said they took it. The totality of evidence supports that. You have provided nothing to prove otherwise.

The footage you ask for is in the link I posted and the companion videos on the same youtube channel. If you believe it was possible then you need to answer the questions I asked, which you clearly haven't done. You haven't done this because you have no answers and no proof. You might as well be claiming it was done by santa claus. That's how much proof you have. Made up spooks.

There is no mountain of proof of a hoax. There is not even a molehill. Not a hill of beans, not even a single bean. You claim there is evidence of a hoax, then provide the evidence that proves what I have posted is a false. Put up or shut up.

Everything you post alleging the hoax is a lie. it is a lie because it is not true. That's all there is to it.

 

[Agatha]

FF88, is it possible that you can write posts which don't contain links - especially links to your previous posts containing links to outside forums (as links to other forums are forbidden in this thread per the moderator, some pages earlier)?

If you cannot defend your position (an untenable position, anyway) in your own words and without linking to reams of the same tired linkspam, youtube videos and accusations of the whole world lying, one is forced to wonder whether even you believe the nonsense you post.

 

[jaydeehess]

how would agreeing or disagreeing with Betamax prove the fakery you insist must have occured?

you have not answered this question FF

if I disagreed with him how would that prove fakery?

You assume your interpretations are correct and extrapolate that to meaning all others are unworthy of consideration
that is illogical

 

[FatFreddy88]

Yes, I am saying it is impossible to fake. I am saying that people took that footage, and they took that footage where they said they took it, when they said they took it. The totality of evidence supports that. You have provided nothing to prove otherwise.

Sorry, but that was fakable.
http://www.veoh.com/watch/v17299829n75qtFtS?h1=Apollo+XI:+The+Little+Gem

Also, you have refused to say whether or not you agree with BetaMax which shows that you are less-than-objective and therefore unfit to analyze Apollo footage and pictures. Please say whether you agree with BetaMax.

 

[threadworm]

Sorry, but that was fakable.
http://www.veoh.com/watch/v17299829n75qtFtS?h1=Apollo+XI:+The+Little+Gem

Also, you have refused to say whether or not you agree with BetaMax which shows that you are less-than-objective and therefore unfit to analyze Apollo footage and pictures. Please say whether you agree with BetaMax.

You haven't denied you're a seven year old girl. Therefore you are a seven year old girl.

No evidence again. No answers to questions again. If you are refusing to do so then I'm not playing your games. I have no idea who Betamax is or what he claims.

Jarrah's piece of garbage? That opening shot of the Earth photographed over the LM? Hey guess what, the Earth in that shot matches exactly every satellite image taken on that day,before the satellite images were actually taken. Likewise all the video footage matches exactly the satellite images. The first transmission made on the 16th shows a hurricane that can only have been taken on that day and can only have been taken in cislunar space. Jarrah's claims are lies.

 

[Straw Man]

FF88, is it possible that you can write posts which don't contain links - especially links to your previous posts containing links to outside forums (as links to other forums are forbidden in this thread per the moderator, some pages earlier)?

If you cannot defend your position (an untenable position, anyway) in your own words and without linking to reams of the same tired linkspam, youtube videos and accusations of the whole world lying, one is forced to wonder whether even you believe the nonsense you post.

Having been an avid reader of this thread, it seems to me that FF88 is in the position of wearing the Emperor's New Clothes, and his constant links back to other things he has written and youtube videos is an attempt to show he really has 'the finest cloth'. He has to believe, really, otherwise he has to face up to the fact that he's gone out into the world naked.

I'm one of the crowd, laughing.