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Send in the tanks! (Chavez)

Folks, why do you think i bump this thread when i have something to add about Venezuela? Right, it's because this way i don't have to go round and round with the usual suspects about stuff already discussed.

What i especially liked about Stone's documentary was the focus on the ridiculous "reporting" about Venezuela in the US corporate media. He also asked Chavez directly how he feels about that. He answered that he couldn't believe it at first, but then realized that he (paraphrasing) could dress up like the pope and preach world peace the whole day, and they would still call him a tyrant. That's what brought you the "the devil was here" and "Mr. Bush you are a donkey" remarks. Why not have a little fun when you can't change the situation with diplomacy anyway?

btw, it's not a film about Venezuela, but about the independence movement in South America. Stone also interviews Lula, the Kirchners, Morales, Correa, that guy from Paraguay and Raul Castro.

Look the other way all you like but it is not just the right wing media in the US who report his nonsense.

What did Obama do to deserve his wrath and accusations?

Justify the stupid fat fool all you like, but he is making a fool of you and many of his people.
 
I can almost hear her cognitive dissonance from here, her brain going on overdrive trying to justify to herself the fact that she can't apply the same amount of criticism and apprehension she usually uses on most world leaders and governments but this time on her beloved Venezuelan revolutionary.

She portrays herself as someone who doesn't report to authority, she claims not to trust the "mainstream media", but when it comes to Venezuela, she accepts the government's party line without question, she trusts Chávez implicitly and completely, without giving it a second thought, she accepts Oliver Stone's propaganda film without considering that she might have been taken in for a ride.

Fascinating.
 
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I have to quibble with the use of "dictator" here. He wins, then starts nationalizing things left and right.


You've just classified Clement Attlee as a dictator.

I submit an elected dictator is still a dictator. Many become full, textbook dictators by requesting emergency powers for this or that thing. Thank god Chavez hasn't gone that far, yet...

Oh wait, n/m.

While somewhat fairly elected dictators are certainly possible the term as normaly used these days requires that elections have become effectively meaningless and whatever the local legislative assembly is has been completely neutralised. The alturnative is that we have to classify say Stephen Harper as a dictator.

Chavez has certianly had dictorial ambitions (that coup attempt back in the 90s) but the role of populist politician has it's own advantages.


See, democracy is not what makes a nation, including the US, great. Freedom is.

Singapore would disagree. Well more accurately prosecute you for criminal libel but that's just how they do things.
 
RISE DEAD THREAD AND SERVE AGAIN! </thread necromancer>

err:
On topic: What's with all the inflammatory rhetoric against his opponent Henrique Capriles in the coming election? A lot of it seem to be allegations of homosexuality (which is both vile and highly manipulative in a Catholic country) and that he is part of the Zionist World conspiracy or at least their puppet.
 
"Zionist World Conspiracy"? You should read better quality media.

Our Man in Caracas: The U.S. Media and Henrique Capriles


edit: and another one, extensive analysis already from April:

Capriles, Homophobia, Anti-Semitism and Systemic Violence: Understanding the Venezuelan Elections

Rachael Boothroyd said:
In the past few years, certain events have mounted serious challenges to what were previously held to be “universal truths” by Western society. The ongoing financial crisis has generated debate on a global scale about the future and viability of capitalism, just as the governments which continue to prop up that capitalist system, in spite of popular revulsion, have contributed to a weakening of the notion that Western representative political systems are the paradigm of democracy.

As hundreds of thousands of European citizens take to the streets to protest against the economic restructuring of their economy and the associated police brutality required to deliver austerity measures at the end of a bayonet, and as bankers and their lobbying institutions continue to crack the whip over national governments to steamroller these reforms through, the hoax of Liberal democracy in the face of the power of the market has been tangibly laid bare for all to see.

Venezuela is perhaps one of the best examples of how the fallout produced from the collision between a crisis of capitalism and a crisis of representative democracy can produce popular revolution, which can seep out of these cracks and begin to create something new. It is this fact which explains why the international media, and at this historical juncture in particular, so manically seeks to discredit the Chavez government and the embryo of an alternative society that it represents in Venezuela.

With the Venezuelan elections now looming, and with Chavez’s approval ratings stubbornly hovering around the 57% mark, it would seem that the international media has stepped up its “disinformation” campaign against the Bolivarian revolution with renewed urgency, producing the kind of biased, baseless and manipulative stories about the “persecution” of opposition presidential candidate, Capriles Radonski, that have been filling the corporate press’ Latin American correspondence pages for weeks. [...]
 
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"Zionist World Conspiracy"? You should read better quality media.

Our Man in Caracas: The U.S. Media and Henrique Capriles


edit: and another one, extensive analysis already from April:

Capriles, Homophobia, Anti-Semitism and Systemic Violence: Understanding the Venezuelan Elections
How about this one, from your own favorite site?
Most prominent recently has been coverage of an opinion article published on the Venezuelan state radio’s (RNV) website last Monday 13 February which criticised Radonski for representing Zionist thought and supporting Israeli state policy, while stating “the rational struggle against poverty, racism and anti-semitism doesn’t make sense unless directed against Zionism and capitalism”. The appearance of this article was then transformed by Western media into the image of a concerted attack by the Venezuelan state against the Jewish religion.
Ah, because raging anti-semites never, ever claim they're really just anti-zionist (wink wink) and as everyone knows you can't fight anti-semitism without first getting rid of Zionism and capitalism! :rolleyes:
 
How about this one, from your own favorite site?

Ah, because raging anti-semites never, ever claim they're really just anti-zionist (wink wink) and as everyone knows you can't fight anti-semitism without first getting rid of Zionism and capitalism! :rolleyes:


Well, it shows how an opinion piece on a radio station website can be monstrously blown out of proportion by corporate media with an agenda. We knew that already, didn't we? But good example, thanks kitten.
 
Well, it shows how an opinion piece on a radio station website can be monstrously blown out of proportion by corporate media with an agenda. We knew that already, didn't we? But good example, thanks kitten.
It's not just an opinion piece on a radio station, it's the opinion of the Chavez admin. for which that radio station exists to serve. Much like the Chavez propaganda rag you love so much.
 
It's OK. Your history of championing the cause of Nazi-grade antisemites and Jew-haters speaks for itself.


Chavez has/had some cozy relationships himself.

Ahmadinejad
Mugabe
Castro
Assad
Gaddafi
Kim Jong Il

ect.
They're all just misunderstood! And the Zionist capitalist globalization news media is out to get them!
 
RISE DEAD THREAD AND SERVE AGAIN! </thread necromancer>

err:
On topic: What's with all the inflammatory rhetoric against his opponent Henrique Capriles in the coming election? A lot of it seem to be allegations of homosexuality (which is both vile and highly manipulative in a Catholic country) and that he is part of the Zionist World conspiracy or at least their puppet.

Desperate times require desperate measures. Chavez desperately needs an excuse for an upcoming devaluation, for which he will pay a firstborn and a kidney to avoid until elections are finalized and his succession of himself confirmed. Without a scapegoat in opposition, he may face rapidly another recall referendum and loose, should Venezuelan finances unravel in early 2013. If he has a good scapegoat, he may yet survive the turbulent 2013 and 2014, albeit in financial ruin.

On the off chance he looses the election and it somehow stands, he wants to be able to claim from behind that was the Zionist plot, to destroy the country in vengeance (or something).

Kudos to the man who managed to bankrupt the country with the worlds' largest oil reserves and do it to a thunderous applause of many sheep ... what else can we say.

McHrozni
 
They're all just misunderstood!

In fairness a number of them are. For example Mugabe has been having people slaughtered since at least the late 80s. But hey the ones killed in Matabeleland were black so who cared?
 
Desperate times require desperate measures. Chavez desperately needs an excuse for an upcoming devaluation, for which he will pay a firstborn and a kidney to avoid until elections are finalized and his succession of himself confirmed. Without a scapegoat in opposition, he may face rapidly another recall referendum and loose, should Venezuelan finances unravel in early 2013. If he has a good scapegoat, he may yet survive the turbulent 2013 and 2014, albeit in financial ruin.

I'm not sure the evidence is on your side with regards to life expectancy projections.

Kudos to the man who managed to bankrupt the country with the worlds' largest oil reserves and do it to a thunderous applause of many sheep ... what else can we say.

That his opponents are still more annoying? I mean most of the world has worked out that you aren't supposed to shoot the natives any more. As Ever Garcia found out the hard way the Venezuelan right hasn't.
 

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