Trayvon Martin, Vigilante Justice

[crimresearch]

Don't think this has been posted before - apologies if it has.

Can't post the url as I've not got 15 posts but it can be found on Newsmax.com

Zimmerman Prosecutor Threatens to Sue Harvard... For Alan Derschowitz's Criticism of Her

Maybe she'll SWAT him...

 

[LTC8K6]

As GZ has lied about something as important as his bail bond money his credability is suspect to say the very least.

But GZ didn't lie in court. He simply sat and watched a lie occur.

How would you bring up SZ's lie to the court at GZ's trial?

 

[Unabogie]

GZ is already there to watch Trayvon from a distance.

GZ has driven well past TM and turned around to watch TM. GZ's vehicle is in the area close to the T long before TM walks that way. So GZ can't have driven over there to follow TM. GZ was there first.

Unless I misunderstood your post.

Ok, in George's story, he only got out of his car to see what the address was. But if that's the case, then he couldn't have already been out of the car when he was asked "what's the address?" but he couldn't tell because he was out of the car already.

Two scenarios:

• George is in his car.
• George is asked for the address, gets out to see the address
• George is attacked on the way back to his car.

Or:

• George exits his car to follow Trayvon.
• George is asked for the address but can't see it because he's not at his car or on the streeet.
• George tells police he only got out to see the address.

See how one scenario would match his story while the other one doesn't?

 

[LTC8K6]

I wonder if someone was smart enough to take photos.

If there were such photos, I would have released them by now to put pressure on Corey.

O'mara could be cagier than I think. Maybe he's holding such photos for the SYG hearing?

I must say that it's hard for me to believe that exculpatory "day after" photos would have been kept under wraps. Especially if they showed a bruised face/forehead.

The best time to release them would have been before Corey made up her mind.

 

[Unabogie]

But GZ didn't lie in court. He simply sat and watched a lie occur.

How would you bring up SZ's lie to the court at GZ's trial?

I think you could probably demonstrate he conspired with his wife to allow her to lie under oath. But don't forget there's now another bond hearing coming up in which George will testify. I think there's a good chance he'll lie then too, while attempting to explain away the conspiracy with his wife.

 

[johnny karate]

But GZ didn't lie in court. He simply sat and watched a lie occur.

Zimmerman conspired to deceive the court by having material falsehoods presented in testimony and court documents. As I've said before, at the very least he lied by proxy. And that's why he's sitting in a jail cell right now.

To assert otherwise is nothing more than biased hair-splitting.

 

[LTC8K6]

Ok, in George's story, he only got out of his car to see what the address was. But if that's the case, then he couldn't have already been out of the car when he was asked "what's the address?" but he couldn't tell because he was out of the car already.

Two scenarios:

• George is in his car.
• George is asked for the address, gets out to see the address
• George is attacked on the way back to his car.

Or:

• George exits his car to follow Trayvon.
• George is asked for the address but can't see it because he's not at his car or on the streeet.
• George tells police he only got out to see the address.

See how one scenario would match his story while the other one doesn't?

George said he was following TM. I suppose he could be doing both. You can look for a house number and a person at the same time.

But he did tell the dispatcher that he was following TM. Logically, that's why he got out of the car. To try to see where TM disappeared to. But the dispatcher stops him, apparently.

We really need to know specifically what GZ said, and we just don't know.

 

[LTC8K6]

I think you could probably demonstrate he conspired with his wife to allow her to lie under oath. But don't forget there's now another bond hearing coming up in which George will testify. I think there's a good chance he'll lie then too, while attempting to explain away the conspiracy with his wife.

I don't know about GZ testifying. If they are going to try to charge him with something related to the bond, then maybe he could invoke the 5th amendment.

I wonder if they can force him to testify against his wife even? Spousal privilege? Haven't really looked into that.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Here ya go

[qimg]http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y221/who007/traytarp.jpg[/qimg]

That's so sad. It boggles my mind people would demonize that kid and justify the reckless behavior that caused it.

 

[Noztradamus]

Originally Posted by TheL8Elvis
The most simple explanation is address = house number. This is clear from the context of parked in front of -vs- parked on. One is parked in front of a particular house number, on a particular street.

He does know the street name, but not the house number, because he is not in front of a house with an address, he is behind the houses, so no house number is available.

Then maybe I'm confused. If, by this time, George is already behind the houses (near the T) at the time the dispatcher asks him for an address, then how does that square with him only getting out of his car to LOOK for an address. He's already there for some other reason, right? Which is to FOLLOW Trayvon, which squares much better with DD's testimony.

We are all confused, some of us don't like to admit it.

This most useful graphic http://apple.copydesk.org/uploads/2012/05/120520MartinWaPoGraphic01.jpg shows him parked in front of the corner house, whose number he could have read, before the not911 call, without getting out of his truck.

I actually think he was further west along Twin Trees because, an hour after sunset, no street lights, 22% moon in western sky, he is going to need his headlights to see anything of Martin other than a hooded silhouette. That may not put him far enough along Twin Trees to see the front of the houses on the South side of Twin Trees.

As to why he didn't get any number, George doesn't impress as a great tactical thinker, and may not have thought of house numbers before the not911 operator mentioned them. By that time he was long way past them.

"Okay. What address are you parked in front of?"
"D'oh! I don’t know, it’s a cut through so I don’t know the address."

 

[crimresearch]

But GZ didn't lie in court. He simply sat and watched a lie occur.

How would you bring up SZ's lie to the court at GZ's trial?

The same way they are going to bring up his father's lies, and his friend's lies, and Rev. Wright's lies...

Q: Isn't it true that you conspired to have your wife lie to the court? Deliberately commit perjury?

A: No.

Judge: Do you have anything either correct or useful relevant to the charge here before us today, Ms. Corey?

 

[GWCarver]

I think you could probably demonstrate he conspired with his wife to allow her to lie under oath. But don't forget there's now another bond hearing coming up in which George will testify. I think there's a good chance he'll lie then too, while attempting to explain away the conspiracy with his wife.

Zimmerman has the right to remain silent. Perhaps you were wondering why he wasn't being grilled at that hearing. That would be it. Could you provide a timestamp for the exact moment of his lie in the video?

In addition, could you provide a citation for your stating as a fact above that Z will testify at the next hearing?

Also, feel free to demonstrate he conspired with his wife to lie under oath. You did say it could "probably" be done.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

....
So do you have any evidence that conclusively demonstrates Zimmerman was repeatedly punched, or are we just supposed to take your word for it? ...

Not just punched, but punched by a kid who supposedly was so powerful GZ feared for his life? Remember GZ's brother's ridiculous claims that GZ felt his life ebbing away or however he worded it?

I have no problem accepting that TM got at least one punch in. From there it's clear not only did GZ wrongly profile TM, wrongly followed him, stupidly approached him instead of waiting for the cops, and grossly over-reacted when he shot TM.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

Ok, in George's story, he only got out of his car to see what the address was. But if that's the case, then he couldn't have already been out of the car when he was asked "what's the address?" but he couldn't tell because he was out of the car already.

Two scenarios:

• George is in his car.
• George is asked for the address, gets out to see the address
• George is attacked on the way back to his car.

Or:

• George exits his car to follow Trayvon.
• George is asked for the address but can't see it because he's not at his car or on the streeet.
• George tells police he only got out to see the address.

See how one scenario would match his story while the other one doesn't?

We don't know what specifically he told the police. We certainly don't know that he claimed to get out only to find an address.

Yesterday, for GZs statments you said this:

When his statements come out in the next few weeks (hopefully) we'll know enough to judge how truthful and consistent he was.

Apply that to this scenario, and in a few weeks we will know.

If you want a scenario of what may have happened:
I believe GZ got out to follow TM and lost him. When the NEN operator asked him what address he was in front of, he didn't know, and that is still because he wasn't in front of a house with a street number. He kept walking for a bit to see if he could spot TM. He couldn't so he was walking back towards his truck and to find an address to tell the police when they called him, and that is when the altercation took place.

Side note: I wonder if the LEO originally sent tried to call GZ as discussed ?

 

[Dcdrac]

Not just punched, but punched by a kid who supposedly was so powerful GZ feared for his life? Remember GZ's brother's ridiculous claims that GZ felt his life ebbing away or however he worded it?

I have no problem accepting that TM got at least one punch in. From there it's clear not only did GZ wrongly profile TM, wrongly followed him, stupidly approached him instead of waiting for the cops, and grossly over-reacted when he shot TM.

Again you put it well and very succinctly the man is a reckless loose cannon with a track record of hot headedness.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

...
Also, feel free to demonstrate he conspired with his wife to lie under oath. You did say it could "probably" be done.

So telling his wife to keep the passport and his wife saying, "For you," isn't clear enough for you?

And if they can explain what they were talking about with the numbers that I'm guessing are just going to conveniently match the larger dollar figures in the bank account at the time of the conversation it will be quite a feat. I wouldn't bet on it.

 

[johnny karate]

The same way they are going to bring up his father's lies, and his friend's lies, and Rev. Wright's lies...

Q: Isn't it true that you conspired to have your wife lie to the court? Deliberately commit perjury?

A: No.

Q: Really? Because I have here transcripts of a conversation you had with your wife prior to her testimony at your bond hearing indicating she had full knowledge of facts she would deny knowing at said hearing. Do you expect this court to believe you had no prior knowledge or involvement in the material falsehoods your wife presented under oath?

A: That's correct. I had no knowledge of those falsehoods.

Q: I also have here official documents submitted to the court by your lawyer at that same bond hearing indicating you were indigent status despite the fact that you had access to over $100 thousand dollars. Why did you not inform your lawyer of those funds prior to him submitting those documents?

A: Uh...

Jury:

 

[TheL8Elvis]

Zimmerman conspired to deceive the court by having material falsehoods presented in testimony and court documents. As I've said before, at the very least he lied by proxy. And that's why he's sitting in a jail cell right now.

To assert otherwise is nothing more than biased hair-splitting.

What day did did the paypal account accepting donations get the first donation ?What day did he give his financial information to MO'M ? What was the balance on that day ?

What day did he and his wife discuss what her testimony in court should be ?

When you can answer those questions, you can start making a good case for conspiracy. Until then, it's just your opinion based on the prosecutions representation of the facts.

As for hair splitting - that's what the law is often about. Unless you have a reference to a FL statute about lying-by-proxy ??

I'll also ask you - if the exact amount of money in his PayPal account was so important, why didn't the prosecution tell the judge what they knew the day of the bond hearing ?

 

[Unabogie]

We don't know what specifically he told the police. We certainly don't know that he claimed to get out only to find an address.

Yesterday, for GZs statments you said this:

Oh, come on. Either we can discuss what he reportedly said or not. We're sitting here discussing what we think his story is. I was talking about the double standard that prevades this thread when it comes to accepting George's "story". But of course that only works when his story sounds good. When we notice gaps in it, we're back to this.

Fine.

Apply that to this scenario, and in a few weeks we will know.

If you want a scenario of what may have happened:
I believe GZ got out to follow TM and lost him. When the NEN operator asked him what address he was in front of, he didn't know, and that is still because he wasn't in front of a house with a street number. He kept walking for a bit to see if he could spot TM. He couldn't so he was walking back towards his truck and to find an address to tell the police when they called him, and that is when the altercation took place.

Side note: I wonder if the LEO originally sent tried to call GZ as discussed ?

I think that's close to the truth as well. Then he DID spot Trayvon and approached him. That's when Trayvon told DD "he's coming closer". Then that's when they had their verbal interaction.

Notice that the verbal interaction precludes being jumped from behind, right? Since George clearly saw him and they exchanged "angry" words. There's no possible way George got jumped from the bushes or whatever his story said.

 

[johnny karate]

Zimmerman has the right to remain silent. Perhaps you were wondering why he wasn't being grilled at that hearing. That would be it. Could you provide a timestamp for the exact moment of his lie in the video?

Zimmerman's "right to remain silent" doesn't explain why he let his lawyer submit material falsehoods in court documents indicating he was of indigent status.

Also, feel free to demonstrate he conspired with his wife to lie under oath. You did say it could "probably" be done.

That might never be 100% conclusively demonstrated, nor would it have to be if this issue was allowed into the trial. Reasonable minded people could see past the pathetic denials Zimmerman would offer, and draw their own conclusions based on the facts.