Trayvon Martin, Vigilante Justice

[LTC8K6]

Why?

How long have you been following this case?

 

[Dcdrac]

Lets see it has now been established GZ

1. Has a record of violent behaviour and a conviction for that.

2. He is a lier he has lied under oath

3. Although no angel possibly jsut a typical teenager there is no evidence that TM was up to no good.


Its not looking good for GZ at the least hes going to get a perjury conviction

 

[TheL8Elvis]

Lets see it has now been established GZ

1. Has a record of violent behaviour and a conviction for that.

2. He is a lier he has lied under oath

3. Although no angel possibly jsut a typical teenager there is no evidence that TM was up to no good.


Its not looking good for GZ at the least hes going to get a perjury conviction

2. where was this established ? Thanks.

 

[bookworm]

It's my experience that people that lie about one thing, quite easily and frequently lie about other other things too.

I don't understand how anyone on this forum can get on a high horse about lying. Are you all going to tell me that you've NEVER told a lie? Unless that's true, I hope none of you ever need people to rely on your credibility.

 

[Bikewer]

Speaking of the lying thing... I see he's back in jail for forgetting to mention the pile of money thay had been donated for his defense...No doubt an oversight.

As I see it, Zimmerman may escape the "murder" charge even though his reckless actions lkely caused the confrontation. He may well be able to argue self-defense. However, it would not amaze me to see the case plea-bargained down to something like "reckless endangerment" or something of the sort.
It also would not amaze me to see him sued in civil court for wrongful death and to lose.

 

[bookworm]

What about the justice for someone who was shot by another merely becaue he looked suspcisous to that other?

WHAT? He was shot because he was banging someone's head on the ground not merely because he looked suspicious!

 

[marksman]

So do you suppose they will release him again?

As I've already said (post 12091), they very well might. but to do so, I believe his attorney would have to give objective evidence of GZ's finances, and not simply tell the judge what GZ and his wife told him. he needs to say that he personally reviewed his finances, spoke with his accountant, etc.

Courts are reluctant to keep someone in jail unless they are a significant flight risk or a danger to others or themselves. GZ does not appear to be a danger or a flight risk. I believe the judge's minimization of the alleged misrepresentation of GZ's passports was intended to set the groundwork for holding that GZ is not a flight risk. Since his passports are now turned over, whether he lied about them or not has no bearing on him being a flight risk.

So the only issue is what the amount of the bond should be. The prior amount was based on GZ's wife's representations and upon GZ/s lawyers representations, which were based on what GZ had told the lawyer. When the judge discovered that information was false he had to revoke the bond because he now had no reliable evidence. That's why a new bond hearing is needed. It will give GZ's counsel a chance to present reliable evidence (which means evidence not dependent on GZ's testimony) to establish what GZ can afford. GZ might even get a bond at the same amount he had previously.

If they do, would that suggest that if this failure to disclose the money being sent him didn't preclude that from happening, it's probably not meaningful enough to impact on his murder trial?

No, it would not. The important thing here is that, previously, the judge was willing to accept GZ's word (as transmitted through his wife and counsel) about his finances. Now the judge has determined that GZ's word is unreliable. That will have a huge impact at his murder trial and likely ensures that GZ will not take the stand in his own defense unless GZ has no other choice. It's a devastating blow to his defense.

The fact that GZ could be free pending trial is a benefit, because the State won't get the opportunity to record any more conversations he gets from visitors. But the damage done is considerable.

After all, had George Zimmerman ensured that this was disclosed, how would anything be different at this juncture?[/QUOTE]

the judge's ruling on the passport not being an issue don't exist

The judge's statement about the passport is dicta, not a ruling. It was unnecessary for a determination of the motion, which was granted. All it is is a statement by the judge that he did not think GZ lied about his passport. It's not a decisions. It's not a ruling. It's not a holding. It's a statement with no legal import. Which isn't to say it doesn't have some value.

 

[Rare Truth]

WHAT? He was shot because he was banging someone's head on the ground not merely because he looked suspicious!

So said the lying Zimmerman...

 

[Rare Truth]

I knew no Bond hearing would be in the offing soon. Zimmy will be sitting in the hoozegow for quite a bit.
Toldja.

Update on Motion for Bond

on 05 June 2012.

Mr. Zimmerman's legal defense team has decided to delay filing a motion for bond. A hearing will not be scheduled for a couple of weeks, and we will file a the motion well in advance of the hearing.

http://gzlegalcase.com/index.php/pr...e-on-motion-for-bond-in-george-zimmerman-case

 

[Dcdrac]

Based on what I have seen to date and what as come out about GZ and his proven track record as a liar and his conviction for violence. Ihave come to the view he adn he alone was the root cause of this tragedy, his word is clearly unrelaible so we cannot take at face value what he says about it.

If he gets off on a plea bargain I do hope TMs parent launch a civil case against him.

 

[AvalonXQ]

The moral of the story:

Always let your lawyer know all the relevant details of the situation before you try to tell the judge about it, especially if you're trying to be "clever" about what you tell the judge.

 

[GWCarver]

I agree with you here about his credibilty about the start of the confrontation taking a huge blow with this. However, I do still think the evidence supports his story.

What would an average person think the penalty should be for Zimmerman not standing up in the middle of the hearing, pointing at the speakerphone, and dramatically shouting, "My wife is a liar!"? Life in prison? I don't think so, and any potential jury will be made up of average people who can easily dismiss the state's silly contention - if this makes it into evidence - that him sitting there like a potted palm makes him a murderer.

The MSM already hates Zimmerman so it doesn't matter what they say - to them, nothing has changed. They just have a different angle to use when they trash him. All that matters is what the judge decides at the next bond hearing.

ETA - If the judge doesn't think it is important enough to revoke bail, de la Rionda will have a hard time convincing a jury it is proof that he is a murderer.

 

[Rare Truth]

I don't understand how anyone on this forum can get on a high horse about lying. Are you all going to tell me that you've NEVER told a lie? Unless that's true, I hope none of you ever need people to rely on your credibility.

How often you lie to a Court?

 

[Dan O.]

You missed a little detail there, CR. I'm pretty sure it's been reported that George turned over his expired passport he had previously claimed was lost, while his wife told him she put his unexpired replacement passport in their safe deposit box and George told her to keep it safe.

Why does it seem like someone is playing Three Card Monte with the passports?

o Prior to this case, George claimed that his original passport had been lost and he had acquired a replacement.
o The original passport with an expiration date of May 2012 was turned into the court at the beginning of the bond hearing in April.
o George purportedly turned his valid passport into O'Mara a few days after the bond hearing.
​

Even though it was not past its expiration date, the original passport would have returned an invalid status if anybody tried to verify it. Obviously the prosecution did verify it. The discovery that George was hiding a currently valid passport would have set off the emergency alarms for the prosecutor. Only the fact that George turned in the new passport before the prosecution came after him saves George from a potential criminal charge. The only evidence that he did turn it over though is the unsent memo on O'Mara's computer (and maybe the fact that George was in hiding in another state and being closely watched so could not have easily arranged a clandestine rendezvous with O'Mara).

At least unless further information comes up concerning the passports, I'm going to accept that this was simply a mistake. The alternative would require O'Mara to be in the middle of the conspiracy to hide the passport

 

[Rare Truth]

What would an average person think the penalty should be for Zimmerman not standing up in the middle of the hearing, pointing at the speakerphone, and dramatically shouting, "My wife is a liar!"? Life in prison? I don't think so, and any potential jury will be made up of average people who can easily separate the state's silly contention - if this makes it into evidence - that him sitting there like a potted palm makes him a murderer.

The MSM already hates Zimmerman so it doesn't matter what they say - to them, nothing has changed. They just have a different angle to use when they trash him. All that matters is what the judge decides at the next bond hearing.

ETA - If the judge doesn't think it is important enough to revoke bail, de la Rionda will have a hard time convincing a jury it is proof that he is a murderer.

Or he could have, you know, coughed.

O'Mara: "Your honor this is my client's only passport..."

George: <cough> <cough>
........
O'MARA to Z's Wife: Other major assets that you have which you can liquidate reasonably to assist in coming up with money for a bond?

SHELLIE ZIMMERMAN: None that I know of.

O'MARA: I discussed with you the pending motion to have your husband, George, declared indigent for cost, have I not?

S. ZIMMERMAN: Yes, you have.

O'MARA: Are you of any financial means where you could assist in those costs?

S. ZIMMERMAN: Not that I'm aware of.

O'MARA: I understand that you do have other family members present with you and I'll ask them questions of them but have you had discussions with them of at least trying to pool together some funds to accomplish a bond?

S. ZIMMERMAN: We have discussed that, trying to pull together the numbers of the family to scrape up anything that we possibly can.
[http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/20/cnr.01.html]

George: <ahem> <cough> <ahem> <cough>

 

[GWCarver]

Or he could have, you know, coughed.

O'Mara: "Your honor this is my client's only passport..."

George: <cough> <cough>
........
O'MARA to Z's Wife: Other major assets that you have which you can liquidate reasonably to assist in coming up with money for a bond?

SHELLIE ZIMMERMAN: None that I know of.

O'MARA: I discussed with you the pending motion to have your husband, George, declared indigent for cost, have I not?

S. ZIMMERMAN: Yes, you have.

O'MARA: Are you of any financial means where you could assist in those costs?

S. ZIMMERMAN: Not that I'm aware of.

O'MARA: I understand that you do have other family members present with you and I'll ask them questions of them but have you had discussions with them of at least trying to pool together some funds to accomplish a bond?

S. ZIMMERMAN: We have discussed that, trying to pull together the numbers of the family to scrape up anything that we possibly can.
[http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1204/20/cnr.01.html]

George: <ahem> <cough> <ahem> <cough>

I don't recall seeing any coughs in any of the court transcripts I've read. No sneezes, burps, or breaking wind either.

 

[Rare Truth]

I don't recall seeing any coughs in any of the court transcripts I've read. No sneezes, burps, or breaking wind either.

Yeah. That's the point.

 

[LTC8K6]

I knew no Bond hearing would be in the offing soon. Zimmy will be sitting in the hoozegow for quite a bit.
Toldja.

Update on Motion for Bond

on 05 June 2012.

Mr. Zimmerman's legal defense team has decided to delay filing a motion for bond. A hearing will not be scheduled for a couple of weeks, and we will file a the motion well in advance of the hearing.

http://gzlegalcase.com/index.php/pr...e-on-motion-for-bond-in-george-zimmerman-case

That's good. They need to prepare better than they have been. I'm glad they didn't file right away and are going to wait a bit.

GZ should be safe since he is isolated in the jail, but you never know if someone might try to collect the bounty.

 

[Unabogie]

That's good. They need to prepare better than they have been. I'm glad they didn't file right away and are going to wait a bit.

GZ should be safe since he is isolated in the jail, but you never know if someone might try to collect the bounty.

What kind of preparation would you need to do to honestly account for your assets and passport status?

The only reason they are delaying is because of the real damage George has done and the risks involved in letting him get up on the stand to explain his lie.

The delay is in O'Mara trying to convince George that he's an idiot for thinking he should just get up there and give the prosecutors a whack at him.

I bet O'Mara is telling him to just sit in jail until trial.

 

[Dan O.]

I don't recall seeing any coughs in any of the court transcripts I've read. No sneezes, burps, or breaking wind either.

It is well known that potted palms don't posses the necessary anatomy to cough. I think that was the judges point.