Merged 9/11 No Plane/Energy Weapon discussion thread

[Resume]

She showed that the field did wobble. I think it's good evidence.

It's not even very good fiction.

 

[Macgyver1968]

This thread is getting into "Poe" territory.

 

[Jack by the hedge]

You didn't read Judy's book. Shame.

No, I didn't.

Yeah, she shows data that indicates big fluctuations in the electromagnetic field in the northern hemisphere at key points in time on 9/11/2001.

Does she say where she got the data from? I'm slightly curious to know how the actual fluctuations of that day compare to a typical day.

 

[DGM]

I think it's good evidence.

You don't care that she has not shown these "wobbles" are not normal?

She looked at one day and called it "abnormal".

 

[A W Smith]

You cant fire me! Im a SCIENTIST! I have TWO PHD's!!

Hell it got you a job with John Thomas Financial Brokerage.

How's that going?

I would venture to guess, it aint.
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[Stellafane]

As long as you misrepresent her conclusions, you'll never make progress in debunking her, if that was your goal. Saying the weapon could be in space isn't the same thing as saying it was in space. She says it could be anywhere, on a mountain, in the sea, etc.

First, please allow me to remind you that I need to debunk nothing; it's up to Dr. Woods (and those who would support her) to provide evidence that the DEW actually exists. Thus far she has not done so.

But leaving that aside at the moment, I'm afraid a DEW capable of bringing down the WTC would be even more detectable if it were located anywhere other than space. For instance, if it were in the ocean, it would at an absolute utter minimum vaporize all the seawater between it and the target -- yet no one reported seeing a long streak of superheated steam leading directly to the WTC, blasting up from the boiling surface of the ocean on 9/11. As for being located on a mountain -- or anywhere else on Earth -- what location would provide a totally unobstructed line-of-sight view directly to the WTC, and yet be totally undetectable by everyone in one of the most populated regions of the continent?

So the DEW theory fails spectacularly on two counts. Not only is there no evidence that the device exists, there's no evidence that it can exist. This just isn't the sort of thing that merits serious attention.

 

[beachnut]

An ...

There were reports of thunder on 9/11. ... There were anomalies detected in the Earth's magnetic field on 9/11. Wood might or might not be correct in making a connection between them.

There are no reports of thunder on 911, you have failed to produce a report.

There were no anomalies detected on 911 in the magnetic field of the earth, again you failed to source this claim too.

Judy's claims about 911 are delusional, no one has been able to support her claims.

I'm not inventing these weather reports. I'm just pointing to them.

Why are you spreading lies? Why not correct the lies and get to the truth? You are repeating them without evidence.

 

[Macgyver1968]

You don't care that she has not shown these "wobbles" are not normal?

She looked at one day and called it "abnormal".

Let's have a look..shall we?

Dr. Judy got her data from This Website

She only shows us the frame for 9/11...but lets look at a few other day's readings:

Sept 8:

Sept 9:

Sept 10:

Sept 11:

Sept 12:

Sept 13:

They must of been firing a really big DEW on the 12th and 13th!

 

[NoahFence]

They may or may not be relevant to the attacks of 9/11.

Wrong. Even under the unlikely event you're not lying, they have no bearing on 9/11. Why didn't the airports around Washington DC report the same thing?

Reports of thunder at the NYC airports are an indication of electromagnetic activity in the atmosphere.

Wrong.

Hurricane Erin might have played a role in this. Magnetometer reports show anomalies in the electromagnetic field in the northern hemisphere. Hey, maybe none of it is relevant.

Erin played no role. There is no Maybe about it. The FACT is none of it is relevant.

But maybe it is. It isn't my theory, but energy weapons have been suggested to be the mechanism of destruction of the WTC. Strangely timed deviations in the Earth's electromagnetic field are a possible part of the picture. Do you know what she's saying about all this?

Yes I do. She's saying "Hey everybody look at me! I'm ******* crazy!"

 

[beachnut]

... my postdoctoral training was in the department of bioengineering, ...

Mods, I request permission to snicker aloud.

I was doing experiments in bioengineering in high school! Fortunately those experiments continued through college and did not produce lasting results until the end of UPT (pilot training). I was producing wake turbulence since 1973, small amounts until producing heavy wake turbulence in 1976.

I didn't begin this life with the hope of being an engineer, ... :-(

Don't worry about that.

I didn't ... :-(

What is the purpose of looking for wake turbulence in clear air? Why do you deny RADAR data? Video? Thousands of witnesses?

 

[TSR]

No thanks. You can spend your time finding the original references, if you choose, or you can just look at the references that Dr. Wood uses.

Wood has not made claims about these reports here.

You have.

But strangely, have neglected to off any citation to them, other than gesturing vaguely in the direction of Wood's idiocy.

You want to show that it's not idiocy?

Cite the reports.

*Then* we can get back to shy you believe that radar tracks showing the paths the airliners took are not evidence for those airliners crashing into the the Towers.

 

[The Big Dog]

Please stop talking about any of my former or current places of employment.

Sure, as soon as you drop the Scientist stuff and trafficking your Phd as a credibility boost.

 

[NoahFence]

An earth scientist would be better able to explain it to you. All I can say is that hurricanes are associated with electrical activity in the atmosphere. Things like lightning and thunder are a result.

Hurricanes are NOT associated with electrical activity.

 

[pgimeno]

Yay! I love beginning from places of agreement. If half a dozen regular posters admit explicitly that they cannot provide evidence of a wake near the Twin Towers at 9:03AM, then I am also willing to close this thread.

I actually opened it to see if I was wrong. If I was wrong, and there was clear evidence of a wake at 9:03AM, then I didn't want to go around like a dummy saying there wasn't.

You are wrong, but not in the way you think you're wrong.

The wake is displaced as air does. There was wind, so it didn't last long in that place. This has been mentioned by SUSpilot.

Mackey has shown evidence of vortices for both towers, having effect at a distance. I'm just unclear on whether they are trails of something falling instead.

And biggest of all, you're ignoring the disturbance caused by the fireball itself, which would counter the effect of the wake near the building, while the overpressure expanded. That has also been noted by ratcat.

How many wakes do you see here?


Note for example the third one, the one crashing on the ground raising a fireball. The fireball completely counters any wake that could be present.

You're just wrong in your expectations. So, I agree with twinstead here:

I'm shocked. This is the first time I've seen a truther ask for evidence for something that isn't expected to have occured, and then declare victory when it isn't found.

(bolding mine)

 

[WTC Dust]

No, I didn't.

Does she say where she got the data from? I'm slightly curious to know how the actual fluctuations of that day compare to a typical day.

My goodness. Either read the book or check out her website. The data is there. So many of you claim expertise on Judy Wood, and yet none of you except Jammonius act like you even know what her work is!

 

[Stellafane]

An earth scientist would be better able to explain it to you. All I can say is that hurricanes are associated with electrical activity in the atmosphere. Things like lightning and thunder are a result.

There were reports of thunder on 9/11. There was a hurricane on 9/11. There were anomalies detected in the Earth's magnetic field on 9/11. Wood might or might not be correct in making a connection between them.

I agree that an earth scientist would explain this better. As it turns out, I myself happen to be an amateur scientist (and professional science & technology writer) so I may be in position to provide you with a few basics here that you may or may not find useful.

First, forget the thought that there's any proven direct connection between the earth's magnetic field and the weather. (There may be an indirect connection, such as a heating of the upper atmosphere by the solar wind during times when the magnetic poles reverse themselves and the field all but disappears for a period, but that's highly conjectural and complete besides the point for this discussion.) It's true that thunderstorms can produce electricity in the form of lightning, and this electrical activity can generate electromagnetic radiation, such as radio static. But this does not mean the storm is affecting the planetary magnetic field, or vice versa. Bear in mind, weather is an atmospheric phenomenon produced by moisture and heat, with an assist from the earth's rotation. Magnetism has absolutely nothing to do with it.

As for hurricanes, they're "associated with electrical activity in the atmosphere" only inasmuch as they produce lightning. Hurricanes are actually caused by large pools of hot air drifting west off the Sahara and over the Atlantic Ocean, where they develop cyclonic rotation and become storms. Again, this has nothing to do with the magnetic field.

Thunder is the acoustic energy produced by lightning. Again, this is not connected with the magnetic field -- and in any case, as others have pointed out, the claim of thunder on 9/11/01 is highly disputable, given the lack of any thunder-producing weather in the vicinity of NYC that day.

I don't know how Dr. Woods defines "anomaly" when she says there were anomalies in the magnetic field on 9/11. I can say that the magnetic field is not constant, that its interaction with the solar wind is dynamic and highly variable, and that in any case there are long-lasting magnetic field anomalies all over the surface of the planet at any given time. But even if Dr. Woods is correct in this regard, it would be absolutely irrelevant to any hurricane, thunder, or any other weather in the NYC vicinity or elsehwere.

So whether you take my word for it or not (and a few minutes of Googling should quickly verify everything I've said above), I can assure you that Dr. Woods' supposed connection between the magnetic field and local weather phenomena is impossible. And how any of this can be interpreted in any remotely conceivable way as evidence for the existance of a DEW utterly escapes me.

 

[Oz1976]

It's Dr. Blevins, to you, and tell me again how gravity can cause steel to crumble into dust.

It can't and it didn't and no you clearly do not deserve that honorific. No steel was turned to dust. The 4" and 6" concrete slabs produced dust. The gypsum wallboard produced dust. The collection of dust from over 30 years of service of the building prodcued dust. NO STEEL TURNED TO DUST. You have ZERO evidence of that and ZERO proof of it. Stop lying. When you stop lying then maybe I'll call you doctor, till then you are Ms. Blevins or Dusty. PERIOD.

 

[Oz1976]

Why are you talking about sonic booms when I'm mentioning weather reports of thunder at all three NYC airports?

Because there were zero weather reports of thunder that day, there were civilian observations of loud booms that..."sounded like thunder"...do you have the same ineptitude of Dylan Avery? That being, the failure to understand what a simile is? There wasn't a cloud in the sky that day. There is zero evidence to yet another one of your claims. Sonic booms created the "sounds like thunder". Deal with it.

 

[Oz1976]

Oh, geez. If I was going to make something up, I certainly wouldn't make up a dang weather report. Those things are archived and easily available to anyone with an internet connection.

And yet you have failed to produce a single one...I wonder why.

 

[Oz1976]

Hey man, I'm only talking weather reports. You're asking sideline questions.

No you're not, you're parroting lamebrain Judy Wood. There are no weather reports of thunder...there were civilian observations of "sounded like thunder"...they were sonic booms of fighter craft coming into the area...you're wrong again. Please stop lying, and start sourcing.