General Holocaust Denial Discussion Part II

[Nick Terry]

I support this move.

please post on the relevant thread so the mods don't think it's just me...

 

[BaaBaa]

please post on the relevant thread so the mods don't think it's just me...

Done and done!

 

[Clayton Moore]

EDIT: And thank you for actually providing links to the posts you felt so religiously about. Everyone should go and read what happened in the thread after the posts in question.

There are 6000 plus posts that fulfill your "what happened?"


A whatcha talkin bout Willis "what happened?" if there ever was one.

 

[dafydd]

"Nuh uh!" is not a valid counter-argument to a citation to a scholarly work on the topic.

It is in Denierworld. That's the best they can do in lieu of actual evidence of their claims.

 

[Border Reiver]

There are 6000 plus posts that fulfill your "what happened?"


A whatcha talkin bout Willis "what happened?" if there ever was one.

Those would be the posts that refuted pretty much all the points raised in those lovely little posts.

This is "what happened" -

Nazi party comes to power in Germany - 1933
Nazi party starts to marginalize and stigmatize the Jews and other religious and ethnic groups they deem "undesirable" through a series of increasingly restrictive laws.

Nazi Germany can be seent to start what is referred to as World War II by invading Poland on September 1, 1939

Nazi Germany does its best to try and defeat the Western Allies, but is stopped by this new thing that the supposedly infallible High Command didn't forsee - the English Channel - the Western Allies now on a defensive operation while the logistics for the invasion of NW Europe are being set up.

Nazi Germany being run by someone with all the impulse control of a 5 year old decides that now would be a good time to move East and try to take out those nasty Soviets.

While in the East (defined as pretty much anything east of the old German/Polish border) the boys in black set up and operate a number of slave labour and death comps to deal with the religious and ethnic undesirables - but to to the general inefficiency of the Nazi regime the program to eliminate these "threats to the state" is done in an inefficient and haphazard manner through a variety of means:

a. Shooting;
b. Starvation;
c. Overwork;
d. Use of poison gas;

The eventual defeat of nazi Germany (8 May 1945) by the efforts of the Soviets, and the Western Allies eventually stops this but not before a substantial number of the so-called Undesirable religious and ethnic types are killed.

Many of the architects of this atrocity are eventually put on trial and convicted based on documents that they had produced.

After the defeat many of those who share some of ideas that odious regime try to minimize what happened to the civilian populations of the occupied territories and Germany for any number of "reasons."

People who look at the totality of evidence in this matter think those who deny the Holocaust took place have about as much or grasp on the historical method as the authori of "My Struggle" did.

 

[Dogzilla]

Dogzilla
Graduate Poster

Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,350

Originally Posted by Nick Terry View Post





http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7339513&postcount=3578
Dogzilla kicks Team Holocaust's butt.

In comparison


http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7346042&postcount=3595

Both are the truth and a salvation in contrast to the steamy wet flatulence smattered by Team Holocaust.

Thanks for digging that up. After I wrote that response, I asked myself if I should actually post it or if I should simply ask "why do you hate the Germans?" I'm glad I went with my gut instincts.

 

[Dogzilla]

This sentence is both creepy and scatological.

Yet one more sign of why this "discussion" is not a debate.

EDIT: And thank you for actually providing links to the posts you felt so religiously about. Everyone should go and read what happened in the thread after the posts in question.

IIRC, Dr. T disappeared for a few days to "correct midterms" or something and never did directly respond. Nobody else even attempted to intervene probably because most people don't even bother reading the ponderous responses Dr. T and I have exchanged on this board.

 

[Dogzilla]

I support this move.

I agree. But there needs to be a mechanism in place to prevent a proliferation of various HD threads like those that prompted consolidating everything into one in the first place.

 

[000063]

This sentence is both creepy and scatological.

Yet one more sign of why this "discussion" is not a debate.

EDIT: And thank you for actually providing links to the posts you felt so religiously about. Everyone should go and read what happened in the thread after the posts in question.

I assume it's just a coincidence that he linked to the isolated versions of the post, not the ones in context.

Here are the context links, so we can see what happened.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7339513#post7339513
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7346042#post7346042

Basically, Clay got his shorts pulled down in public again. Note how, even in his own link, he attempts to dismiss someone based on the amount of posts they have. Doggy's post is effectively ignored.

I can add a few thousand posts. Why would that matter? Oh, that's a question Clayton needs to answer.
Yes, I would like to read Clayton's answers to your questions as well. But, knowing Clayton, I already know that he will never answer them. He can never answer any questions, for he knows that any honest answer would destroy his arguments. he can never back up his claims, for they are never true. Clayton is all about dodging, evading, and running away like a weasle.

How on earth did I make the quote look proper, with the proper link when you click on the arrow, even though the relevant thread is locked? Maaagic.

 

[A'isha]

IIRC, Dr. T disappeared for a few days to "correct midterms" or something and never did directly respond. Nobody else even attempted to intervene probably because most people don't even bother reading the ponderous responses Dr. T and I have exchanged on this board.

Yes, and because of your apparent tendency to do things like your grotesquely egregious strawmanning of my post (which you actually did in multiple other posts, in fact), I'm not surprised in the least that most people don't bother to read your responses.

 

[Nick Terry]

I agree. But there needs to be a mechanism in place to prevent a proliferation of various HD threads like those that prompted consolidating everything into one in the first place.

Make your suggestions in the FM thread. The mechanism is that there would only be a handful of threads, any new ones would be merged into the relevant master threads. I suggested breaking things down by obvious topics (like Auschwitz, BST etc) and a General thread for everything else. These would then be subjected to the same off-topic considerations as other threads in the event of blatant derails.

 

[Nick Terry]

IIRC, Dr. T disappeared for a few days to "correct midterms" or something and never did directly respond. Nobody else even attempted to intervene probably because most people don't even bother reading the ponderous responses Dr. T and I have exchanged on this board.

actually it looks like you replied after a whole month to a post made on June 4th, on July 5th.

Seems I didn't check in from 5th June to 27th June, nor between 1st and 17th July.

It must be great fun dredging up a post from 10 months ago to try and claim some kind of feeble victory....

 

[dafydd]

Yes, and because of your apparent tendency to do things like your grotesquely egregious strawmanning of my post (which you actually did in multiple other posts, in fact), I'm not surprised in the least that most people don't bother to read your responses.

I've had him on ignore for a long time. His programmed denier responses are predicable and boring, not to mention them having nothing to do with reality.

 

[LemmyCaution]

I've had him on ignore for a long time. His programmed denier responses are predicable and boring, not to mention them having nothing to do with reality.

I put him on ignore recently because of his blatant lying about the discussion of the Jaeger report in the previous thread - I thought of going into detail to refute his dishonesty, but then thought better of doing so, his little game just isn't worth the effort.

 

[LemmyCaution]

. . . those who deny the Holocaust took place have about as much or grasp on the historical method as the authori of "My Struggle" did.

And for some of them, this is no coincidence but instead a matter of their reflecting their influences.

 

[uke2se]

I have posted a proposal to the admins that we have several threads since it's obvious that just one thread has become horrifically restrictive and confusing
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8224398#post8224398

No, please don't let this crap spill out anymore. It's enough with one thread in which the retards can flaunt their antisemitism.

 

[uke2se]

I've had him on ignore for a long time. His programmed denier responses are predicable and boring, not to mention them having nothing to do with reality.

I got tired of him trying to be as vile as possible while staying within the MA and his many many lies. Apparently, millions of dead people is nothing but a game to him. Then again, that's why he's a Hitler-hugger.

 

[Bluespaceoddity]

Posted on April 13,

An interesting question.

I have been wondering how the Jews were identified and captured.

Seriously?

Yes.

How the Jews were identified? What procedures the supposedly persecutors used to identify who was Jew and who was not?

There was any kind of a "Manual to Recognize Jews" utilized by the SS personnel?

April 16.

Was the persecution of the Jews by Third Reich exclusively sorted out by religion identification? How this explain the allegations that Jews were persecuted by the Third Reich due a racial discrepancy among Jews and Aryans? [...]

April 21 : Excerpt from one of my own sourced comments - "Nieuwsblad van het Noorden", published the same day [April 14, 1943] in a different region of the Netherlands [Groningen].
"Article 5. jood in den zin van deze beschikking is hij die ingevolge Artikel 4 van de verordening 189/40 betr. de aanmelding van ondernemingen jood is of als jood wordt aangemerkt"
http://resources2.kb.nl/010410000/pdf/DDD_010414078.pdf

Yesterday I added - "My translation - Article 5. Jew for the purpose of this ordinance is he who in accordance with article 4 of VO 189/40 regarding the registration of businesses is a Jew or is considered a Jew."

Verordening 189/40 - 22 October 1940
Article 4:
"Begrip ‘Jood
1. Jood is een ieder, die uit ten minste drie naar ras voljoodse grootouders stamt.
2. Als Jood wordt ook aangemerkt hij die uit twee voljoodse grootouders stamt en
1) hetzij zelf op de negende mei 1940 tot de joodskerkelijke gemeente heeft behoord of na die datum daarin wordt opgenomen,
2) hetzij op de negende mei 1940 met een Jood was gehuwd of na dat ogenblik met een Jood in het huwelijk treedt.
3. Een grootouder wordt als voljoods aangemerkt, wanneer deze tot de joods-kerkelijke gemeenschap heeft behoord."
Reproduced in: Jacques Presser - Ondergang. (1965) - Online at:
http://www.dbnl.org/tekst/pres003onde01_01/pres003onde01_01_0006.php

English translation:
"Article 4 Definition of Jews
1. Jews are all persons whose grandparents included three or more full Jews by race. (and see 3 below.)
2. Persons with two fully Jewish grandparents are deemed to be Jews if either
(a) belonged to the the Jewish religious community on 9 May 1940 (or subsequently joined it);
(b) or were married to a Jew on 9 May 1940 or after that date.
3. Grandparent is deemed a full Jew if he was at any time a member of the Jewish religious congregation."
From Ashes in the Wind, Jacques Presser - page 34 (1968) - depending on your location this translation may be accessible online through Google books.
Below the text of the excerpt from VO 189/40 Presser added this comment:"We shall frequently advert to Article 4, since it was to rear its ugly head in all principal instruments of Nazi Oppression"

Snaketongue. Take some time and follow this back to its origin- at JREF at least stop here
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=8117949#post8117949
for a moment and ponder what it was exactly you came here for when you jumped into ongoing conversations in a lengthy thread with your attempt to hit the all too familiar restart button.

 

[Multivac]

Adolf Hitler did not have any "day off". He had millions of volks to look after.

And to rid the European continent of jews.

You just cannot understand that role.

Correct.

Adolf Hitler had more skills than you are going to achieve in your whole life...

Being a racist, homophobic, mass murdering psycopath are skills that most people can do without.

So you finally admit that you are Hitler hugger.

 

[Multivac]

Although nobody expected the Spanish Inquisition I'm sure no Germans who oversaw or performed the alleged gassing of millions of Jewish children, women, and men expected that they would get away with it.

Of course they expected to get away with it. They were doing it for the fatherland and expected to win the war.