General Holocaust Denial Discussion Part II

[SnakeTongue]

Do you see Osama bin Laden plotting to murder thousands of Americans?

No...

You think that picture proves that Bin Laden had the intention to murder Americans?

In case your perception did not notice, Bin Laden is a fictional character created by the international media.

If you think not, prove me wrong, find Bin Laden body laying on the bottom of the ocean and I will recognize that Bin Laden was a real person.

[qimg]http://i.imgur.com/ADN1j.jpg[/qimg]
Do you see Timothy McVeigh plotting to murder thousands of Americans?

No...

[qimg]http://i.imgur.com/MmJTp.jpg[/qimg]
Do you see Roman Polanski raping a 14-year old girl?

No...

So?

Where is the evidence which proves Adolf Hitler had kill anyone but the soldiers he fought in the First World War?

Your flawed logic is not acceptable as reference.

 

[SnakeTongue]

I don't know, I give up, who?

Hilberg, I know, estimated 5.1 million victims. But that isn't 6 million.

As you, I also do not know who estimated. That is why I am asking. Where this number come from?

 

[A'isha]

So Nick Terry, did you read "Night" yet?

[...]

Same questions for
LemmyCaution? abaddon? LSSBB? Worclaw? ANTPogo? Moss? TSR? 000063? MG1962?? carlitos? Tomtomkent? Bluespaceoddity? dafydd? OCaptain? Spui? KDLarsen? dudalb? Mudcat? uke2se? BaaBaa? BazBear? tsig?

I've not only read "Night", I've pointed out that you haven't, despite your copypasta lies about it.

Have you read "Night" yet, Clayton?

 

[SnakeTongue]

Wait just a moment

You are stating that the bible is plain flat out wrong?

No, I am not stating that. The Holy Bible is a mixture of true and false statements when regarding the laws of science. Therefore the Holy Bible cannot be "plain flat out wrong".

However, the Holy Bible is a religious book.

It cannot offer accurate information out of it own context.

 

[A'isha]

You think that picture proves that Bin Laden had the intention to murder Americans?

In case your perception did not notice, Bin Laden is a fictional character created by the international media.

If you think not, prove me wrong, find Bin Laden body laying on the bottom of the ocean and I will recognize that Bin Laden was a real person.

Is it a requirement that Holocaust deniers also be 9/11 Truthers, or is the fact that if they're one they're inevitably the other just sheer coincidence?

 

[SnakeTongue]

That link does not go to the document he asked you to provide a URL for, SnakeTongue.

What's the URL for the document "Soviet Consulate General in Harbin to Ambassador Roshchin, 15 November, 1949", AVPRF, f 0308, o 1, p 4, d 31, pp. 2 – 20?

The requirement was a source.

a place, person, or thing from which something comes or can be obtained:
mackerel is a good source of fish oil

http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/source?region=us&q=source​

I located the URL which indicate the source. If the requirement was to provide the evidence, I would had answered that I could not.

Source and evidence are two different words.

 

[SnakeTongue]

You might practice on your English reading skills as well. What is your native tongue?

I appreciated the URLs. I could grasp a basic idea about the questions I made.

My native tongue is Brazilian Portuguese.

I learned English when living in UK.

Your citation of NLG was insightful.

The Dutch guilder (Dutch: gulden, IPA: [ˈɣʏldə]; Frisian: gûne, IPA: [ˈɡuːnə]; sign: ƒ or fl.) was the currency of the Netherlands from the 17th century until 2002, when it was replaced by the euro.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_guilder​

 

[SnakeTongue]

It has been explained to you why URLs were not posted immediately.
Was that aspect of persecution during the 12 year Reich news to you when DDT mentioned it? Where did you look after you were confronted with it? Were the hints useful? What have you found yourself so far?


Dordrechtse Courant Woensdag 14 April 1943
http://resources2.kb.nl/010410000/pdf/DDD_010412958.pdf

Do you require translation for Dutch language material?

I am amazed!

I did not know that in 1943's Dutch newspaper published cross words, chess boards and ads!

Your document gave me an very good visual insight about the Dutch media from the 40's.

Just what exactly means?

Geen Straf
bij tijdige aanwijzing van verborgen joden en joodsche vermogenswaarden.​

Google Translate is producing a very dubious translation.

 

[Bluespaceoddity]

Originally Posted by Nick Terry

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php...postcount=1009

So Nick Terry, did you read "Night" yet?

Did you see The Last Days and The Last Days of the Big Lie?

The Last Days (Steven Speilberg,Shoah,1998)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UlBo3GFgWY

The Last Days of the Big Lie

Take your pick
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7tHB8tD34s

http://archive.org/details/Holocaust-TheLastDaysOfTheBigLie

How about The Fifth Diamond? Did you read that Nick Terry?

Same questions for
LemmyCaution? abaddon? LSSBB? Worclaw? ANTPogo? Moss? TSR? 000063? MG1962?? carlitos? Tomtomkent? Bluespaceoddity? dafydd? OCaptain? Spui? KDLarsen? dudalb? Mudcat? uke2se? BaaBaa? BazBear? tsig?

Night?Yes
Last Days? No
Last Days Big Lie? Yes
Fifth Diamond? No
Dr Neander's Diamond Girl Fact or Fiction? Yes
http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.jp/2010/01/irene-zisblatt-diamond-girl-fact-or.html

 

[erwinl]

I am amazed!

I did not know that in 1943's Dutch newspaper published cross words, chess boards and ads!

Your document gave me an very good visual insight about the Dutch media from the 40's.

Just what exactly means?

Geen Straf
bij tijdige aanwijzing van verborgen joden en joodsche vermogenswaarden.​

Google Translate is producing a very dubious translation.

Basicly.

No punishment
by timely information of hidden jews and jewish posessions.

But of course this means something innocent.

 

[SnakeTongue]

It was his day off and they are German children and and you know very well that Hitler didn't personally carry out any murders. You're not very good at this.

Adolf Hitler did not have any "day off". He had millions of volks to look after.

You just cannot understand that role.

Adolf Hitler had more skills than you are going to achieve in your whole life...

 

[Bluespaceoddity]

I am amazed!

I did not know that in 1943's Dutch newspaper published cross words, chess boards and ads!

Your document gave me an very good visual insight about the Dutch media from the 40's.

Just what exactly means?

Geen Straf
bij tijdige aanwijzing van verborgen joden en joodsche vermogenswaarden.​

Google Translate is producing a very dubious translation.

Lots of things you don't know. My translation of the first sentence:
"No punishment for timely reporting of hidden Jews and Jewish property."

The question: Do you require translation for Dutch language material? Can that be answered with a yes? Does that mean you'll only be commenting on the translation and not necessarily on the Dutch language sources themselves. Is that a fair assessment?

Questions:
Was that aspect of persecution during the 12 year Reich news to you when DDT mentioned it? Where did you look after you were confronted with it? Were the hints useful? What have you found yourself so far?

How about:
Harster letter Den Haag den 5.5.1943 -
Number 10.) on his itemized list. What does it say? ...
Reproduced in "Documenten van de Jodenvervolging in Nederland 1940-1945" page 97

Did you put that into Google and find out more about it? Date of publication, place of publication, organization responsible for publication? Does the org. still exist and perhaps maintain a website? That sort of thing. Did you find it?

How about the person whose correspondence I referenced. Harster.

Did you recognize the name? If not, have you checked who he was and what positions he held during the period of nazi occupation?

When you find that letter, do you require Google translation or will you be able to read the German language in which it was written yourself?

 

[Clayton Moore]

Night?Yes
Last Days? No
Last Days Big Lie? Yes
Fifth Diamond? No
Dr Neander's Diamond Girl Fact or Fiction? Yes
http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.jp/2010/01/irene-zisblatt-diamond-girl-fact-or.html

Dr. Neander's revised version.

December 28, 1944: Irene becomes 16.

January 21, 1945: Schlesiersee I is liquidated, the inmates marched on foot to Gross Rosen sub-camp Grünberg.[80]

January 28, 1945: The women from Schlesiersee I, together with half of the women of sub-camp Grünberg I,[81] are marched on foot in WSW direction, through Lower Silesia, Saxony, and the Thüringer Wald, into northern Bavaria.

March 5, 1945: After six weeks of marching in the depths of winter, Irene arrives at sub-camp Helmbrechts of concentration camp Flossenbürg.[82]

March 6, 1945: Irene is registered under number 63941 as a Flossenbürg prisoner. She and the other 620 sick and exhausted women who arrived together with her need not work, most probably because, at that time, the munitions factory, for which the Helmbrechts prisoners had to work, already lay idle.

April 13, 1945: Sub-camp Helmbrechts is liquidated. Its inmates are marched on foot in eastern, later SSE direction, through the Sudetenland.[83]

May 4, 1945: After three weeks of marching, Irene arrives at Volary (in German: Wallern). Together with about 120 emaciated, severely sick women she is left there in a makeshift camp.

http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.jp/2010/01/irene-zisblatt-diamond-girl-fact-or.html

Huh? What's the point of the Germans marching these women around if they were killing millions of Jewish children, women, and men?

They had to be guarded 24/7, fed, clothed. etc.


Seems to me they were honoring their responsibility to provide for the inmates of the abandoned transit/work camps.

 

[SnakeTongue]

That's strange, I never said "forced" into the chamber. Maybe they were asked politely. Maybe they were lied to, as those killed often were. But please, keep throwing around concepts you don't understand in an attempt to look clever. All you're saying is that I'm saying something that isn't visibly evident, and I'm pretty sure you made up the Latin.

I did not made up the Latin.

Latin was made up by the ancient Romans.

If it is argued that people were in location X when A happened to them, and when we see them they are in location Y, not X, then that does not mean A never happened, especially since there's additional non-video evidence to show that it did.

Argument:

P ∈ X || A ∼ (Y ∉ X) ≠ A ∃ H ˆ (+ ∃ Nv = ∃)

Completely illogical.

Try again.

Or, to repeat, "you can't gas someone to death in an enclosed chamber if they're not in an enclosed chamber". Any more than you can shoot someone to death with a glass of water.

Appellare ad manifestum.

Well, you've certainly shown me that a car of that vintage could not possible have an exhaust pipe on the right side of the--oh, wait.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/stokpic/4938403305/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/argentla/5709615504/
http://www.boldride.com/ride/1936/chrysler-imperial-airflow-coupe

That was no argument over "right" or "left". If your eyes cannot discern angles in different perspectives, I recommend you look for an eye care professional.

Of course, given that a long pipe running out of the rear into a gas chamber isn't a stock feature on any car I know of, I'm not sure why you insist that that is the smoking gun. Clearly, it's an aftermarket modification.

What do you mean by "aftermarket modification"?

What "smoking gun" you are speaking about? I did not address anything related to smoke.

None of which proves that the car wasn't made before the end of the war. Have you even attempted to check the provenance of the video in question, or just focused on "anomalies"?

http://strangevehicles.greyfalcon.us/MERCEDES 260D.htm

If you did not noticed, I made a guess.

Tsig user got in the moment he/she read the word. You did not?

The pictures were provided to offer a visual comparison.

Irrelevant. You're ignoring #677, and you still haven't proved the video is fake.

I hope you get to #677, and Wroclaw's actual question, not your straw man.

Keep waiting.

Here's the thing, ST; even if you do manage to come up with some plausible reason why Eichmann's testimony is unreliable that relates to him being forcibly removed to Israel--as you specifically claimed--the fact that you spent so much time avoiding the question means you did not have it to hand when you started. You would have made a claim, then tried to rationalize it later.

It means nothing.

I was concerned with the numerical data. I never refused the testimony for historical accounts.

Can you understand the difference?

 

[BravesFan]

Adolf Hitler did not have any "day off". He had millions of volks to look after.

You just cannot understand that role.

Adolf Hitler had more skills than you are going to achieve in your whole life...

Anti-semitic troll is anti-semitic

 

[LSSBB]

Anti-semitic troll is anti-semitic

Looks like somebody sure loves Hitler. A lot.

 

[BravesFan]

Looks like somebody sure loves Hitler. A lot.

Look evidence that He was quite a nice feller!

 

[Bluespaceoddity]

Dr. Neander's revised version.

http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.jp/2010/01/irene-zisblatt-diamond-girl-fact-or.html

Huh? What's the point of the Germans marching these women around if they were killing millions of Jewish children, women, and men?

They had to be guarded 24/7, fed, clothed. etc.


Seems to me they were honoring their responsibility to provide for the inmates of the abandoned transit/work camps.

The linked text I provided is identical to the one you linked. What was the significance of indicating "Dr. Neander's revised version"? Would you like to indicate what his revisions were?

Do you accept that the implication of Irene Zisblatt lying about certain aspects of her experiences is not that the Holocaust did not happen? Do you accept that it doesn't follow and that it would be as illogical as the infamous no holes slogan?

Do you accept that Dr. Neander's revised text as presented today is an accurate portrayal of events during Irene Zisblatt's lifetime?

 

[Clayton Moore]

That's strange, I never said "forced" into the chamber. Maybe they were asked politely. Maybe they were lied to, as those killed often were. But please, keep throwing around concepts you don't understand in an attempt to look clever.

The problem with this type of comment/response/rational is that the 3,000,000 number of alleged Jewish gassing victims eliminates any possibility of an entire camp population being NOT aware of the alleged gassing activity.

That knowledge would preclude any tricking gassing victims into a gas chamber. That said, chaos would be rampant because a looming gas chamber threat.

 

[Clayton Moore]

The linked text I provided is identical to the one you linked. What was the significance of indicating "Dr. Neander's revised version"? Would you like to indicate what his revisions were?

Do you accept that the implication of Irene Zisblatt lying about certain aspects of her experiences is not that the Holocaust did not happen? Do you accept that it doesn't follow and that it would be as illogical as the infamous no holes slogan?

Do you accept that Dr. Neander's revised text as presented today is an accurate portrayal of events during Irene Zisblatt's lifetime?

An Attempt at Re-Writing Irene Weisberg Zisblatt's Biography

Let us now try to reconstruct Irene Weisberg Zisblatt's biography until her arrival at New York in November 1947. The following is an attempt, subject, of course, to corrections and completion to the same extent as additional information will appear.

Do you accept that Dr. Neander's revised text as presented today is an accurate portrayal of events during Irene Zisblatt's lifetime?

Who knows. What I do know is that you don't have policy that allegedly killed 4.5 to 6 million Jewish children, women, and men and then march a thousand or so Jewish women between camps for 6 months.

Do you accept that the implication of Irene Zisblatt lying about certain aspects of her experiences is not that the Holocaust did not happen? Do you accept that it doesn't follow and that it would be as illogical as the infamous no holes slogan?

She's just another liar in a parade of liars.

http://www.codoh.com/revisionist/comment/tr08footman.html

In order to make the argument that the Birkenau morgues were really gas chambers the Zyklon introduction ports have to be there -- as the "No Holes. No Holocaust" slogan makes clear-- but will any hole or group of holes do? The irregular holes in the slab roof were created after the roof was poured and had hardened. This indicates if the room below was a gas chamber, then it was not originally designed as such, but converted to that purpose later. If the room was not designed as a gas chamber, then the testimony of Hoess and others is wrong. Without that testimony, there is no evidence of gas chambers at all.

The holes in the roof now were created sometime after early 1943 when the roof was poured. If they were created after late 1944, then they had nothing to do with gassings because the gassings are said to have stopped by then. Assuming holes were there before the building was razed, there must have been a way to seal them since the idea of a gas chamber is a container for the gas: If the holes were not sealed, then the gas was not contained. Since there is nothing to indicate these holes were ever sealed or stopped, the implication that no thought as to their purpose went into their creation needs some sort of explanation. There is no evidenceof design in these holes. So clearly, only desperation would cause one to conclude the holes being discussed here were ever used to dump Zyklon B into the room below.