Trayvon Martin, Vigilante Justice

[Mumbles]

Freddie's Fashion Mart. 7 people died after Sharpton ranted about "white interlopers".

The man is scum.

That was a pretty clumsy change of subject.

In any case, Sharpton did not call for violence at Freddie's, and openly said he regretted using they raise "white interlopers". But it's questionable, at best, to hold him responsible for the actions of every single protester, in any case.

 

[bynmdsue]

I like how Twitchy Michelle Malkin doesn't understand how twitter works. Someone tweeting at Spike Lee, isn't the same as Spike Lee tweeting something.

She must have been confused by the "Retweeted by Spike Lee" that appears beneath those posts. Y'know, in an article titled "Spike Lee retweets George Zimmerman’s address"

Yep, she sure is stupid.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Well, it's a good thing no-one has his address.

Oh.

http://twitchy.com/2012/03/24/spike-lee-retweets-george-zimmermans-address-threats/

I don't see any condos with a sidewalk running between them near that address. It's close to Twin Lakes where I found the image I copied and Twin Lakes was mentioned in one of the stories.

Either that gated community is huge or that address for Z is wrong.

 

[Puppycow]

Wingnut Conspiracy Theory of the Day: Trayvon Photo Was Lightened to Make Him Look ‘Innocent’

 

[This is The End]

There was no fight with officers. He pushed one officer when he and some friends got in a altercation in a bar. The charges were dismissed.

You do realize that your 2nd sentence contradicts the 1st. He got in a quote "tussle" with one or more police officers. That includes arguing with many, and pushing one.

As for your 3rd sentence. Does "Zimmerman got off with a pretrial diversion program" mean "the charges were dismissed"?

 

[sgtbaker]

Going from the transcript TheL8Elvis posted above it's hard to make sense of that given the location of the incident if Z was just waiting by his vehicle to meet with police and was attacked by Trayvon. If the kid was "running" it certainly doesn't sound like later he came back and attacked Z, that is unless Z pursued T after the call.

After this exchange comes the, "are you following him" comment.

I can't see any way to make that exchange match up with 'lost sight of T and was going back to his vehicle' when T supposedly returned to attack Z.

On the phone to the girlfriend she says she heard T ask Z why was Z following him, and within minutes T was dead. The only way that fits with Z's 911 call is if Z pursued T after hanging up with 911. Keep in mind the location of the shooting was on a sidewalk between rows of back facing condos on both sides, well away from where any vehicle could be parked.

Why would T run away only to come back and attack Z? Does that fit any logical senario at all?

There are a few possibilities but it's only speculation. What matters is that you flat out said that it was impossible that Zimmerman lost sight of Martin. I showed you that he did.

 

[sgtbaker]

I don't see any condos with a sidewalk running between them near that address. It's close to Twin Lakes where I found the image I copied and Twin Lakes was mentioned in one of the stories.

Either that gated community is huge or that address for Z is wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RaknmTkjvU

You can see right in the taped off area, a sidewalk between the two rows.

 

[This is The End]

Again, it is my understanding that the charges were not dismissed, but reduced to simple battery.

Every report I've seen says they were dismissed.

In July 2005, Zimmerman, then 21, was at a bar near the University of Central Florida when a friend was arrested by state alcohol agents on suspicion of serving underage drinkers, according to an arrest report in the Sentinel. Zimmerman became profane and pushed away an agent who tried to escort him, the report said. Authorities said he was arrested after a short struggle. Charged with resisting arrest without violence, he avoided conviction by entering a pretrial-diversion program, something common for first-time offenders.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-george-zimmerman-20120323,0,6326075.story

This is hardly the crime of the century, or evidence that he's a violent person.

How in the world do you get "the charges were dismissed" from "charged with resisting arrest without violence, he avoided conviction by entering a pretrial-diversion program"?

Even if your "charges are dismissed" is technically correct, it doesn't mean he didn't get into an argument with police officers and push one of them.

 

[crimresearch]

From the chart, a 17 yr old that is 6 foot is in the 80th percentile for height and that same kid who weighs 145 pound is in the 25th percentile for weight. At 150 pounds he'd still be under the 50th percentile for weight. A mismatch like that says, "thin".

And? That's pretty much the point.

 

[WildCat]

That was a pretty clumsy change of subject.

In any case, Sharpton did not call for violence at Freddie's, and openly said he regretted using they raise "white interlopers". But it's questionable, at best, to hold him responsible for the actions of every single protester, in any case.

It's the same subject, and Sharpton's irresponsible rhetoric rersulted in 7 deaths. He had no business going after a landlord for not renewing a lease to a private company. In the USA a person should be able to open and operate a business any place it's legal to do so, regardless of what color their skin is compared to what color the person's skin is living next door. He was angry that a non-black person was operating a business in a black neighborhood. It was racism at it ugliest, and 7 people died as a result.

 

[WildCat]

You do realize that your 2nd sentence contradicts the 1st. He got in a quote "tussle" with one or more police officers. That includes arguing with many, and pushing one.

As for your 3rd sentence. Does "Zimmerman got off with a pretrial diversion program" mean "the charges were dismissed"?

Yes, it's like getting a speeding ticket dismissed if you go to traffic school.

 

[This is The End]

Yes, it's like getting a speeding ticket dismissed if you go to traffic school.

I'm quite sure many people could confuse you saying the "charges were dismissed" with "the incident didn't happen".

I'm trying to figure out why you would keep saying it.

The incident did happen and he was punished for it.

Checkmite said it much better than I did:

"Avoided conviction by attending a pretrial diversion program". When people say this person has a history of violence and cite a struggle with police for which he was arrested and charged, it really is intellectually dishonest to counter with "the charges were dismissed", as if he was completely innocent and this incident is therefore not evidence of past confrontational acts. Obviously the courts considered him guilty, which is why they sent him to a program for first-time offenders. Because he was an offender, which is the point of bringing up his past - that he has a history.

 

[WildCat]

I'm quite sure many people could confuse you saying the "charges were dismissed" with "the incident didn't happen".

I'm trying to figure out why you would keep saying it.

The incident did happen and he was punished for it.

Yes, and it was a very minor incident. It certainly doesn't indicate that Zimmerman is a violent person, which is what the people bringing it up are trying to show.

 

[This is The End]

Yes, and it was a very minor incident. It certainly doesn't indicate that Zimmerman is a violent person, which is what the people bringing it up are trying to show.

So, just to make sure I have your argument correct, you are claiming that arguing with police officers and assaulting one of them is a "very minor incident"?

 

[WildCat]

So, just to make sure I have your argument correct, you are claiming that arguing with police officers and assaulting one of them is a "very minor incident"?

It wasn't assault, the exact charge was "resisting arrest without violence".

 

[This is The End]

It wasn't assault, the exact charge was "resisting arrest without violence".

OK so technically Z was not charged with assault, that does not mean that he did not push one of the officers in the incident.

Also, you didn't answer the question.

I'll rephrase it since I assume you refuse to answer it because "assault" has a technical definition.

So, just to make sure I have your argument correct, you are claiming that arguing with police officers and pushing one of them is a "very minor incident"?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

There are a few possibilities but it's only speculation. What matters is that you flat out said that it was impossible that Zimmerman lost sight of Martin. I showed you that he did.

I'm still trying to parse 'lost sight of' with 'he's coming toward me' and 'he's running'.

However, in the context I was talking about and insisting was impossible was in the area Trayvon was killed. If Z lost track of him at some point before that it wasn't what I was talking about. The killing took place between two straight rows of condos with a sidewalk running down the center. There is no way to lose sight of someone. There is no way to reconcile that location with Zimmerman's story that he lost sight of Trayvon and was returning to his vehicle when Trayvon attacked him.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RaknmTkjvU

You can see right in the taped off area, a sidewalk between the two rows.

That's it, the place I was talking about. Thanks for the link.

How can you be halfway down that sidewalk and fit the scenario to Z's story?

 

[Roadtoad]

That's it, the place I was talking about. Thanks for the link.

How can you be halfway down that sidewalk and fit the scenario to Z's story?

A: You can't.

 

[This is The End]

To try and get back to the facts.

I wonder if we know an exact time when the shot was fired?

I notice that the police report says an officer was dispatched to the scene at 7:17 PM. So I assume the shot was fired soon after that.

Do any of the witnesses say when it was fired?