Should Judge Richard Cebull step down?

[leftysergeant]

That doesn't mean he is correct.

From what I have seen, it would probably be the first time the racist SOB was right about anything.

Just the fact that Bush the Lesser thought him fit to hold a seat on the court is a sign that he may have some serious defect.

 

[leftysergeant]

Times changed and so did the boogeyman. Eventually there was a racist under every rock.

Go check out a few 9/11 twoofer sites.

Check the comments on any news article on the web that mentions a talk show host.

The racists are a continuing and worsening problem

We don't need the fathead from Montana giving them any encouragement.

 

[Ziggurat]

Really? You really don't see how a joke whose punchline boils down to "a white woman who has an interracial child only had that child because she got so intoxicated she not only couldn't fully recall the race of her sexual partners, she couldn't fully recall their species" could be racist and sexist?

The joke is racially charged, but that's not quite the same thing as being racist. After all, it's the white woman who might have been having sex with animals, so it's not exactly complementary to white people. It is arguably sexist, though. But primarily, it's just generally offensive.

 

[Temecula]

From what I have seen, it would probably be the first time the racist SOB was right about anything.

While he may indeed be racist, and may have had racist intentions, there is nothing in the text which is inherently and exclusively racist.

Just the fact that Bush the Lesser thought him fit to hold a seat on the court is a sign that he may have some serious defect.

Come on, that's even bad as ad hominems go. The judge from Kitzmiller v. Dover was a Bush nominee and that turned out OK!

 

[leftysergeant]

Come on, that's even bad as ad hominems go. The judge from Kitzmiller v. Dover was a Bush nominee and that turned out OK!

Broken clock syndrome. Plus the fact that he couldn't think of a valid argument for including ID.

 

[ponderingturtle]

The joke is racially charged, but that's not quite the same thing as being racist. After all, it's the white woman who might have been having sex with animals, so it's not exactly complementary to white people. It is arguably sexist, though. But primarily, it's just generally offensive.

Not exactly. It is viewed as that the woman in question is so with out morals that she will have sex with animals and black men. Hence equating inter racial sex and bestiality. It is also an attack on his mothers character.

 

[sarge]

The joke is racist. The joke is not sexist. The joke has the potential to be offensive, depending as always on the audience that hears/reads it.

Personally, I find the joke quite funny, but I would be uncomfortable hearing it told to an audience larger than a very few well-known aquaintances or in any audience not composed of folks that look almost exactly like me. I can't imagine that I would tell the joke to any audience - I'll not be sharing it with my rich white republican conservative friends this weekend at the club. I will not be bringing this joke up tonight as a topic of discussion with my African American fiancee - although she will probably have gotten an enraged email about the joke from her network of Obama fanatics, or from the Steve Harvey radio show.

Should he resign over having told the joke? No.

Should he resign over having been willing to tell a joke with crystal clear racial overtones? Probably not - but certainly understandable that a citizen might be uncomfortable with the notion of a judge that is willing to tell a racist joke.

Should he be removed from the bench for poor judgement? I don't know. Does the passing of an offensive joke in a manner that might become public make someone unfit for service as a judge?

 

[cwalner]

Should he be removed from the bench for poor judgement? I don't know. Does the passing of an offensive joke in a manner that might become public make someone unfit for service as a judge?

Absolutely. Notice the Highlighted parts. As already stated, the primary duty of a Judge is to apply Judgement (kind of part of the whole job title, you see). Such an egregious display of poor judgement, clearly calls into question his qualifications for his job as a judge.

ETA: one of my favorite Clinton Jokes: A national survey of American women asked if they would ever sleep with President Clinton. 76% answered 'Never again'.
I think it is hilarious, but if a sitting federal judge had forwarded this joke under the Clinton Administration, I definitely think he would not be qualified to be a judge. and the same would apply to equally tasteless jokes about Bush.

 

[Unabogie]

Absolutely. Notice the Highlighted parts. As already stated, the primary duty of a Judge is to apply Judgement (kind of part of the whole job title, you see). Such an egregious display of poor judgement, clearly calls into question his qualifications for his job as a judge.

ETA: one of my favorite Clinton Jokes: A national survey of American women asked if they would ever sleep with President Clinton. 76% answered 'Never again'.
I think it is hilarious, but if a sitting federal judge had forwarded this joke under the Clinton Administration, I definitely think he would not be qualified to be a judge. and the same would apply to equally tasteless jokes about Bush.

Really? See the Clinton joke doesn't bother me at all. It's funny and plays off something true, which is that Clinton was a horndog. What part of Obama's mother being a drunken slut who sleeps with dogs, and black people being almost like dogs is true?

 

[TimCallahan]

Judge Richard Cebull showed the poor taste and poor judgment of forwarding the crude joke on his official e-mail. We do - and should - hold people in high political office to a higher standard than general. Cebull's remark is reminiscent of the remark made by Nixon's Secretary of Labor, Earl Butz, who said, "I'll tell you what the coloreds want. It's three things: first, a tight p****; second, loose shoes; and third, a warm place to ****." Butz was forced to resign following that crude remark.

We do - and should - also hold political candidates to a higher standard. Two examples of failure to live up to such a standard are Jesse Jackson's referring to New York as "Hymie town," and Rick Perry making a speech while being, apparently, hammered.

 

[sarge]

Absolutely.

That many people disagree indicates it isn't "absolutely".

Notice the Highlighted parts. As already stated, the primary duty of a Judge is to apply Judgement (kind of part of the whole job title, you see). Such an egregious display of poor judgement, clearly calls into question his qualifications for his job as a judge.

Possessing the maturity and good sense to not forward insulting emails is not necessarily an essential attribute for a federal judge. Neither is "good judgement" in a general sense the primary duty of a District Judge.

ETA: one of my favorite Clinton Jokes: A national survey of American women asked if they would ever sleep with President Clinton. 76% answered 'Never again'.
I think it is hilarious, but if a sitting federal judge had forwarded this joke under the Clinton Administration, I definitely think he would not be qualified to be a judge. and the same would apply to equally tasteless jokes about Bush.

I disagree. Neither poor taste nor a propensity for engaging in occasional juvenile behavior are disqualifying attributes.

 

[Puppycow]

That doesn't mean he is correct.

It doesn't matter. If he has admitted that the joke is racist, and I agree that it was racist or appeared to be racist, then he ipso facto exercised poor judgment. The job of a judge is to exercise good judgment. Therefore he has proven himself unfit for his job. He can no longer credibly sit in judgment of any African American defendant.

 

[leftysergeant]

I disagree. Neither poor taste nor a propensity for engaging in occasional juvenile behavior are disqualifying attributes.

A federal judge can be expected to have to deal with at least an occassional human rights issue.

That the stupid SOB cannot see that his own attitude toward inter-actions between white and black people is defective indicates that his wee brain cannot encompass the relevant issues surrounding race and human equality.

He is not fit to rule on matters of racial discrimination. Buh-bye.

 

[sarge]

......
He is not fit to rule on matters of racial discrimination. Buh-bye.

If a person that sends a racially offensive email is automatically unfit to rule on civil rights issues, then a gay judge is automatically unfit to rule on issues affecting civil rights for gays, a woman that has had an abortion can not rule on either abortion rights or womens rights, and both an atheist and a christian judge are unfit to rule on a whole range of issues affected by or impacting religion. It is far from conclusive that this judge can not issue impartial rulings on any subject.

 

[cwalner]

That many people disagree indicates it isn't "absolutely".



Possessing the maturity and good sense to not forward insulting emails is not necessarily an essential attribute for a federal judge. Neither is "good judgement" in a general sense the primary duty of a District Judge.



I disagree. Neither poor taste nor a propensity for engaging in occasional juvenile behavior are disqualifying attributes.

I think you are misunderstanding my point. The fact that a Judge thinks such joke is funny, or even repeats it is not the issue. The fact that he used his work email to repeat shows a lack of judgement. There is a huge difference between general behavior and workplace behavior. I don't even have such a high profile job, but if I were to use my work email to repeat either the joke that this judge did or my Clinton joke, I would likely lose my job for unprofessional behavior. I see no reason why this judge should be immune from the same consequences for those same actions.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Judge Richard Cebull of Montana forwarded the following joke on his official e-mail:

“A little boy said to his mother, ‘Mommy, how come I’m black and you’re white? His mother replied, ‘Don’t even go there Barack! From what I can remember about that party, you’re lucky you don’t bark!”

He has since apologized profusely to President Obama. However, even leaving aside the racism and sexism implicit in the joke, should someone who behaves in such a rash manner be a federal judge? In my opinion he should resign.

It's actually a funny joke.

The answer is obviously "no".

 

[Alt+F4]

ETA: one of my favorite Clinton Jokes: A national survey of American women asked if they would ever sleep with President Clinton. 76% answered 'Never again'.
I think it is hilarious, but if a sitting federal judge had forwarded this joke under the Clinton Administration, I definitely think he would not be qualified to be a judge. and the same would apply to equally tasteless jokes about Bush.

But the "joke" in question was not about Obama, it was about his dead mother.

 

[Alt+F4]

The fact that a Judge thinks such joke is funny, or even repeats it is not the issue. The fact that he used his work email to repeat shows a lack of judgement. There is a huge difference between general behavior and workplace behavior. I don't even have such a high profile job, but if I were to use my work email to repeat either the joke that this judge did or my Clinton joke, I would likely lose my job for unprofessional behavior. I see no reason why this judge should be immune from the same consequences for those same actions.

The judge didn't just repeat the "joke" he added this to the email he forwarded:

Normally I don’t send or forward a lot of these, but even by my standards, it was a bit touching. I want all of my friends to feel what I felt when I read this. Hope it touches your heart like it did mine.

I wonder what exactly it was he felt was so touching?

 

[Bri]

The joke is racially charged, but that's not quite the same thing as being racist. After all, it's the white woman who might have been having sex with animals, so it's not exactly complementary to white people. It is arguably sexist, though. But primarily, it's just generally offensive.

“A little boy said to his mother, ‘Mommy, how come I’m black and you’re white? His mother replied, ‘Don’t even go there Barack! From what I can remember about that party, you’re lucky you don’t bark!”

The joke seems racist to me. The implication is that the only reason a white woman would sleep with a black man is because she was intoxicated. The joke also implies that Obama is lucky that his mother only slept with a black man -- she was so intoxicated she might have just as easily slept with a dog. The implication there is that sure Obama would have been luckier if she had slept with a white man (presumably if she hadn't been as intoxicated), but he should at least be thankful that it wasn't a dog. So it's not racist because the black man at least ranks higher than a dog?

I'm guessing that most people would see that joke as racist.

-Bri

 

[cwalner]

But the "joke" in question was not about Obama, it was about his dead mother.

The judge didn't just repeat the "joke" he added this to the email he forwarded:

I wonder what exactly it was he felt was so touching?

Not sure why you seem to be arguing with me. I know that this was an email and I specifically stated that is why I think it is problematic. Regardless of whether the joke was about Obama directly, or indirectly (about his mother) is irrelevant. The problem is not that he liked the joke or that he repeated it, but that he showed extremely poor judgement in forwarding it using his work email.

I love South Park. I find it extremely funny but also extremely offensive (the two do not exclude each other). I have no problem repeating such jokes among friends but I would never use my work email to repeat such jokes.